Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!!

Bernie Cunningham · 10-06-2007, 11:46 PM

This is great, we're at a 'SPORTSNATIONAL' this weekend and for some odd reason, the obvious showcase is the 'super racers' !!!!!!!!!!!! I post here because it's a Stk./SS forum.

Stock had class on FRIDAY after one qualifier, then it went to SS class on Saturday because they got their two qualifiers in on Friday plus an early pass Saturday morning to make three Q's. So far so good, if you don't mind having qualifiers after class for Stock on Saturday, we were slotted for two, to catch up with SS and make it a pretty normal schedule.

Whoop's, there's a bunch of oil downs and time got short, Stock was supposed to be the 4th. catogory out and we didn't get to run until after 11:00 am for our 2nd. TT. Hanging out for a few hours, waiting for the next hit, they cancelled Stock, Comp. Elim and some Super classes of their final TT/ qualifier.

I get home (only 30 minutes away) and read on DRC how they ran 'Shoot-out's', I'll say it again, 'shoot-out's' for Super Street, Super Gas, Super Comp, Top Sportsman and Top Dragster for the remainder of the day with the rest of SS class that included the Hemi 'shoot-out' (five cars) Oh, don't forget the car show and some possible 'Cackle fest' that we'll probably see on Sunday.

What the f*ck, this SN is a joke. We should be concerned as a group that this can take place, what happened to the spirit of heads up being the draw for this venue with class racing. Also, Comp. Elim., the fastest class out there gets bumped for 'super shoot-out's'

Even the advertising for this event was for Top Sportsman and Top Dragster, these classes don't even exist on the National level !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WATCH OUT !!!!!!!!!!

Adger Smith · 10-07-2007, 12:42 AM

Better get ready.. Even more than a few of the Comp guys are worried about Top Dragster & Top Sportsman replacing them. ( And the Pro Stock guys are looking over their shoulder too) I've had a couple of Comp customers talk/worry about their future while at my shop. If we can get our head out from under the hood we might see this. It is even happening to suppliers & sponsors. What direction has Reher & Morrision taken? They aren't the only company making the move in that direction. How many times do we(S &SS) have to park in "The Outback" at Div. races when other classes get "In Close" parking? I've done a little numbers crunching of Top Dragster in Div 4 & have come to the conclusion it will be a 6 second class next year when it is changed to a 32 car qualified field. That's right and Top Sportsman won't be much, if any, slower. Can you see that a Sportsman show full of 6 second cars would be an easier product to sell to track owners & spectators. Want to take any bets that NHRA is seeing that too?
My .02 for Free

Bud Lefevre · 10-07-2007, 04:31 AM

Top Sportsman and Top Dragster are big class's at IHRA races and getting bigger.

Patrick Kelliher · 10-07-2007, 07:54 AM

They may be growing IHRA classes but the fact of the matter is that they are not NHRA classes and in no way should they get any preferential treatment over those classes that compete for national points in the league. It is an insult to ALL NHRA sportsman racers that these TOP categories are getting runs when other classes are getting bumped. The same thing happened at the Lebanon Valley Divisional. If they want to bring them in then they should be first bump as an exhibition class only. The Sportsnationals were created because there was no time for the existing classes to all run during the normal Nationals so why are they adding new BS classes to carry the problem into the Sportsman events.

bsa633 · 10-07-2007, 08:20 AM

hmm..how does SN work down at Pat's place...good right? so who is the target here?...maybe Pat could be hired to run all SN?

Dick Butler · 10-07-2007, 09:11 AM

How many STK and SS versus the bracket TOP/S and D classes. Remember its entry numbers NHRA is using as a gauge of popularity and the Sponsors can sell BIGGER and BIGGER buck motors and there are NO rules, just dial it and run fast. Only takes MONEY to run fast . Guys dont have to worry about the .03 or.04 techniques of Stk or SS anymore.
With points meets and Opens and Nationals becoming focused on the eliminator type racing WHY would NHRA do differently?
Support Class Racing! Only a few Class racers try to keep it alive and Pat is one of them. Remember it is not whether it is your class that runs it is the FORM of racing that means something. TOP/SS and TOP/STK are attempts to get NHRA attention and return to Heads up racing. With time this can spread if you help support the racers and Concept of Heads up Stk and SS racing.

Chuck Beach · 10-07-2007, 12:44 PM

I have not had the chance to race much this year, but I have said all along to my divisional staff, if I have to be at a divisional on Friday to get more than one qualifying pass in stock eliminator then chances are I won't be there. Why do I have to sacrifice my qualifying runs on Saturday for all these top junk catagories. Who is even there to watch them? If I can't get Friday off from work and show up Saturday, get one qualifying pass then into eliminations then NHRA doesn't need me. Divisonals were built on Sportsman racing from alcohol classes to stock eliminator. At one time we had Pro stocks at divisionals. Now we have top junk and no spectators .... and I get less qualifying runs and pay more to race .... by the way NHRA I was at the SN at Columbus and the spectator turn out was pathetic.

icebrrrg · 10-07-2007, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck Beach

I have not had the chance to race much this year, but I have said all along to my divisional staff, if I have to be at a divisional on Friday to get more than one qualifying pass in stock eliminator then chances are I won't be there. Why do I have to sacrifice my qualifying runs on Saturday for all these top junk catagories. Who is even there to watch them? If I can't get Friday off from work and show up Saturday, get one qualifying pass then into eliminations then NHRA doesn't need me. Divisonals were built on Sportsman racing from alcohol classes to stock eliminator. At one time we had Pro stocks at divisionals. Now we have top junk and no spectators .... and I get less qualifying runs and pay more to race .... by the way NHRA I was at the SN at Columbus and the spectator turn out was pathetic.

I agree completely with Chuck. Why do I go to LODRS races? Why do I go to the Gatornationals on Thursday? To see three categories - Comp, Super Stock and Stock. I have no desire whatsoever to watch TD or TS or anything else for which relative performance is absolutely meaningless.

Adger Smith · 10-07-2007, 03:04 PM

I agree with Chuck 100% I copied this from the Div. 4 Website (I hope it doesn't violate any rules)
NEW TECH PROCEDURES FOR D-4 LODRS EVENTS

1. Tech will begin at noon on Thursday at all D-4 LODRS events. There will be Technical Officials onsite to handle tech during this time.

2. Tech for ALL classes will be held in the staging lanes or an area designated by Tech Officials. Any designated area will be announced over the loud speaker at the event.

3. There will be no house calls for COMP, TS, and TD at future events. Tech for these classes will be held in the lanes or designated area.

4. Early Tech will still happen on Fridays at all events. Staging lanes will be designated as cars that are already teched and ready to race and those needing tech. All cars needing tech will go into the same lanes and once a racer has completed tech they will have to then go to the assigned lanes for their class. Tech will not be provided in the lanes where racers are running.

5. Racers are encouraged to take advantage of Thursday tech and early tech on Friday so as not to take a chance on missing time runs.

6. This new procedure goes into effect beginning at the Thunder Valley LODRS event October 12-14, 2007.

Looks like the div races (at least Div 4) are headed toward having to be there 4 days. I really don't understand why we will miss runs on Friday since they have cut Top Sportsman & Top Dragster to 32 car fields. Could there be more time planned for the Top/.90 class shootouts? Could they be doing this to help us get more runs, Or could it be a plan to get us to the motel bars earlier? Draw what ever conclusion you want, but I think running later Friday & Saturday night is better than getting there on Thursday. OH! I forgot some of the Div tracks want to run their bracket program on Sat night... I'm a little concerned with the direction of our sport.
My .02 for Free

William Koski · 10-07-2007, 03:06 PM

There seems to be a belief among some people that TD and TS will draw spectators?
Bracket racing has never drawn any significant number of spectators and that is all this is, fast bracket racing!
Why they have designated qualifying times and bump "real" national classes at all the divisions divisionals is a travesty!

10-06-2007, 11:46 PM	#1
Bernie Cunningham Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 560 Likes: 45 Liked 52 Times in 17 Posts	Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! This is great, we're at a 'SPORTSNATIONAL' this weekend and for some odd reason, the obvious showcase is the 'super racers' !!!!!!!!!!!! I post here because it's a Stk./SS forum. Stock had class on FRIDAY after one qualifier, then it went to SS class on Saturday because they got their two qualifiers in on Friday plus an early pass Saturday morning to make three Q's. So far so good, if you don't mind having qualifiers after class for Stock on Saturday, we were slotted for two, to catch up with SS and make it a pretty normal schedule. Whoop's, there's a bunch of oil downs and time got short, Stock was supposed to be the 4th. catogory out and we didn't get to run until after 11:00 am for our 2nd. TT. Hanging out for a few hours, waiting for the next hit, they cancelled Stock, Comp. Elim and some Super classes of their final TT/ qualifier. I get home (only 30 minutes away) and read on DRC how they ran 'Shoot-out's', I'll say it again, 'shoot-out's' for Super Street, Super Gas, Super Comp, Top Sportsman and Top Dragster for the remainder of the day with the rest of SS class that included the Hemi 'shoot-out' (five cars) Oh, don't forget the car show and some possible 'Cackle fest' that we'll probably see on Sunday. What the f*ck, this SN is a joke. We should be concerned as a group that this can take place, what happened to the spirit of heads up being the draw for this venue with class racing. Also, Comp. Elim., the fastest class out there gets bumped for 'super shoot-out's' Even the advertising for this event was for Top Sportsman and Top Dragster, these classes don't even exist on the National level !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WATCH OUT !!!!!!!!!! __________________ Bernie Cunningham 7053 STK

10-07-2007, 12:42 AM	#2
Adger Smith VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Texarkana Ark/TX Posts: 2,446 Likes: 575 Liked 880 Times in 311 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! Better get ready.. Even more than a few of the Comp guys are worried about Top Dragster & Top Sportsman replacing them. ( And the Pro Stock guys are looking over their shoulder too) I've had a couple of Comp customers talk/worry about their future while at my shop. If we can get our head out from under the hood we might see this. It is even happening to suppliers & sponsors. What direction has Reher & Morrision taken? They aren't the only company making the move in that direction. How many times do we(S &SS) have to park in "The Outback" at Div. races when other classes get "In Close" parking? I've done a little numbers crunching of Top Dragster in Div 4 & have come to the conclusion it will be a 6 second class next year when it is changed to a 32 car qualified field. That's right and Top Sportsman won't be much, if any, slower. Can you see that a Sportsman show full of 6 second cars would be an easier product to sell to track owners & spectators. Want to take any bets that NHRA is seeing that too? My .02 for Free __________________ Adger Smith (Former SS)

10-07-2007, 04:31 AM	#3
Bud Lefevre Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Toledo, Ohio Posts: 250 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! Top Sportsman and Top Dragster are big class's at IHRA races and getting bigger. __________________ Bud Lefevre 3075 STK IHRA World Record Holder

10-07-2007, 07:54 AM	#4
Patrick Kelliher Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 124 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! They may be growing IHRA classes but the fact of the matter is that they are not NHRA classes and in no way should they get any preferential treatment over those classes that compete for national points in the league. It is an insult to ALL NHRA sportsman racers that these TOP categories are getting runs when other classes are getting bumped. The same thing happened at the Lebanon Valley Divisional. If they want to bring them in then they should be first bump as an exhibition class only. The Sportsnationals were created because there was no time for the existing classes to all run during the normal Nationals so why are they adding new BS classes to carry the problem into the Sportsman events.

10-07-2007, 08:20 AM	#5
bsa633 Banned Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 310 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! hmm..how does SN work down at Pat's place...good right? so who is the target here?...maybe Pat could be hired to run all SN?

10-07-2007, 09:11 AM	#6
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! How many STK and SS versus the bracket TOP/S and D classes. Remember its entry numbers NHRA is using as a gauge of popularity and the Sponsors can sell BIGGER and BIGGER buck motors and there are NO rules, just dial it and run fast. Only takes MONEY to run fast . Guys dont have to worry about the .03 or.04 techniques of Stk or SS anymore. With points meets and Opens and Nationals becoming focused on the eliminator type racing WHY would NHRA do differently? Support Class Racing! Only a few Class racers try to keep it alive and Pat is one of them. Remember it is not whether it is your class that runs it is the FORM of racing that means something. TOP/SS and TOP/STK are attempts to get NHRA attention and return to Heads up racing. With time this can spread if you help support the racers and Concept of Heads up Stk and SS racing.

10-07-2007, 12:44 PM	#7
Chuck Beach Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Delaware, Ohio Posts: 664 Likes: 12 Liked 58 Times in 13 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! I have not had the chance to race much this year, but I have said all along to my divisional staff, if I have to be at a divisional on Friday to get more than one qualifying pass in stock eliminator then chances are I won't be there. Why do I have to sacrifice my qualifying runs on Saturday for all these top junk catagories. Who is even there to watch them? If I can't get Friday off from work and show up Saturday, get one qualifying pass then into eliminations then NHRA doesn't need me. Divisonals were built on Sportsman racing from alcohol classes to stock eliminator. At one time we had Pro stocks at divisionals. Now we have top junk and no spectators .... and I get less qualifying runs and pay more to race .... by the way NHRA I was at the SN at Columbus and the spectator turn out was pathetic. __________________ Chuck Beach 3340 STK

10-07-2007, 03:04 PM	#9
Adger Smith VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Texarkana Ark/TX Posts: 2,446 Likes: 575 Liked 880 Times in 311 Posts	Re: Disappointed, Fontana SN schedule !!! I agree with Chuck 100% I copied this from the Div. 4 Website (I hope it doesn't violate any rules) NEW TECH PROCEDURES FOR D-4 LODRS EVENTS 1. Tech will begin at noon on Thursday at all D-4 LODRS events. There will be Technical Officials onsite to handle tech during this time. 2. Tech for ALL classes will be held in the staging lanes or an area designated by Tech Officials. Any designated area will be announced over the loud speaker at the event. 3. There will be no house calls for COMP, TS, and TD at future events. Tech for these classes will be held in the lanes or designated area. 4. Early Tech will still happen on Fridays at all events. Staging lanes will be designated as cars that are already teched and ready to race and those needing tech. All cars needing tech will go into the same lanes and once a racer has completed tech they will have to then go to the assigned lanes for their class. Tech will not be provided in the lanes where racers are running. 5. Racers are encouraged to take advantage of Thursday tech and early tech on Friday so as not to take a chance on missing time runs. 6. This new procedure goes into effect beginning at the Thunder Valley LODRS event October 12-14, 2007. Looks like the div races (at least Div 4) are headed toward having to be there 4 days. I really don't understand why we will miss runs on Friday since they have cut Top Sportsman & Top Dragster to 32 car fields. Could there be more time planned for the Top/.90 class shootouts? Could they be doing this to help us get more runs, Or could it be a plan to get us to the motel bars earlier? Draw what ever conclusion you want, but I think running later Friday & Saturday night is better than getting there on Thursday. OH! I forgot some of the Div tracks want to run their bracket program on Sat night... I'm a little concerned with the direction of our sport. My .02 for Free __________________ Adger Smith (Former SS) Last edited by Adger Smith; 10-07-2007 at 03:05 PM. Reason: spelling

10-07-2007, 03:06 PM	#10
William Koski Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 33 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Wave of the Future! There seems to be a belief among some people that TD and TS will draw spectators? Bracket racing has never drawn any significant number of spectators and that is all this is, fast bracket racing! Why they have designated qualifying times and bump "real" national classes at all the divisions divisionals is a travesty!