2008 Cobra Jets belong in Stock

[Rory McNeil]

Shawn, did you go home, or are you still hanging around Pomona? Making for a long "vacation", eh? At least with all the rain, you shouldn`t be too homesick for the Northwest yet!

[bill dedman]

Shawn,

I think that's an excellent point you made RE: is it street legal? If not, then it's an S/S car. I never considered that, but I think it has a lot of validity to it. Getting the mfgr.-friendly NHRA Tech Department to agree might take some doing, unfortunately.

Gary, your comment "American workers who lost their jobs due to our governments embracing of this warped-minded global economy" made me wish I'd said it.... we are on exactly the same page in our thinking on "global economy." Nothing would suit me better than to see a 50% tariff on any car sold here that was not built on this continent. But, that's politics, and I am aware that this in not the place to discuss that.

Be that as it may, "foreign" cars are making inroads performance-wise, and need to be included in the Class.Guide, I think (if for no other reason than to allow you, Gary, to get some starting-line satisfaction racing them!)

When I say they are making inroads, what I mean is "getting faster all the time." If you look at the road test results (in mags like Car and Driver, Road and Track, and Motor Trend) of the Honda Accord V6's, Camry V6's, and Nissan Altima V6s, you'll see that some of them run very close to 100 in the quarter, and the 5-speed Altimas run well over 100mph in the quarter-mile, and in the low-to-mid 14s on stock rubber and do this in brand-new, showroom-stock trim. The slowest run right at 100mph... and will exceed that, when broken in... still showroom-stock, thru the cat's and mufflers. That's a little faster than a '64 GTO was, or a '68 383 Road Runner, which were considered "muscle cars" in their day. And, (except for the Altima) those are all automatics... Amazing, for a 3,400-pound car with a 3.5-liter (214 cubic inch) motor, normally-aspirated, in "grocery-getter" trim.

I think if NHRA gave them a place to race, they would come... and you could have "your day in court," Gary.

I think it's a shame that NHRA doesn't actively pursue the specs on those cars so they can be included in the mix; they're NOT "slow." Any car that can run 100mph in the quarter, showroom stock, is okay by me, regardless of its place of manufacture. Just factor them right, and away we go!!!!

Bill

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by bill dedman

Shawn,


I think if NHRA gave them a place to race, they would come... and you could have "your day in court,"

Bill

The "OVER SEA'S' built s##t box's had a place to race. It was called NOPI and it flopped, failed, went KAPUT. Even the bikini clad 18 year olds couldnt keep it going. They didnt come and now they can run brackets or on the streets as they usually do.

[Fred Popov]

Originally Posted by bill dedman

Shawn,

When I say they are making inroads, what I mean is "getting faster all the time." If you look at the road test results (in mags like Car and Driver, Road and Track, and Motor Trend) of the Honda Accord V6's, Camry V6's, and Nissan Altima V6s, you'll see that some of them run very close to 100 in the quarter, and the 5-speed Altimas run well over 100mph in the quarter-mile, and in the low-to-mid 14s on stock rubber and do this in brand-new, showroom-stock trim. The slowest run right at 100mph... and will exceed that, when broken in... still showroom-stock, thru the cat's and mufflers. That's a little faster than a '64 GTO was, or a '68 383 Road Runner, which were considered "muscle cars" in their day. And, (except for the Altima) those are all automatics... Amazing, for a 3,400-pound car with a 3.5-liter (214 cubic inch) motor, normally-aspirated, in "grocery-getter" trim.

I think if NHRA gave them a place to race, they would come... and you could have "your day in court," Gary.

Bill

I have to disagree... No doubt about the modern V6 engines making great power compared to the older ones, but there is not much more power that can be extracted out of them. They have advanced variable cam timing that varies duration and lift. They are basically making as much power as possible and still emission legal. Other than removing the accessories, exhaust, and making a few computer tweaks there isn't much more to do. Getting 100 hp more would be very difficult if not impossible. It's much easier to get that 100hp out of an older V8 that has much more displacement.
Also, if anyone was ever asked to go though tech in V6 Altima or Camy, that would be the end of their weekend. They would spend the rest of their time reassembling their engine.

[Bruce Noland]

It is hard to keep these threads on topic. A changing of the OEM guard may be taking place with these new CJs. GM may be on it's way out and Ford on it's way in. We may see Ford trucks with nhra logos in the future. It's a cyclic thing. In other words GM is out of money and Ford still has some. Well, at least the Ford Racing Parts folks still have some money. They call the CJ a racing parts car because it did not flow directly from a regular assembly line enroute to the track.

[junior barns]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Anything that the OEM sells to the public, for public consumption on public roadways, should be allowed in Stock.
If the OEM builds it and can't pass DOT / EPA it should be Superstock only.

That should be the argument, not what the HP or class designation! "
__________________
Jeff Lee 7494 SS/H '70 AMX



I AGREE with this statement!!

[Tim Kish]

Originally Posted by junior barns

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Anything that the OEM sells to the public, for public consumption on public roadways, should be allowed in Stock.
If the OEM builds it and can't pass DOT / EPA it should be Superstock only.

That should be the argument, not what the HP or class designation! "
__________________
Jeff Lee 7494 SS/H '70 AMX



I AGREE with this statement!!

Now if someone takes a street legal, dealer available GT500 Mustang - swaps the rear axle, adds a roll cage, headers, removes exhaust, etc - all the things that are legal for stock eliminator the car is no longer street legal. Indisputable. Now how is this car any different than what Ford is offering as the Cobra Jet package? They are offering this commemorative special edition already race prepped - of course they can not sell it as street legal but it is built to stocker specs. I'm currently in Germany for work and must say - be glad we even have the performance automotive culture we have in the US and OEM support. The 1.2L VW rental I have was flat out in high gear and barely went 100mph on the highway.


One comment on the Sport Compact transition, all the classes already exist, SS/EX is the only one new this year:

Sport Compact NHRA
Pro FWD AA/AF (comp eliminator)
Pro RWD BB/AT, CC/AT, DD/AT (comp) - ie: John Mihovetz & Bruno Massell
Outlaw I/D (comp)
Hot Rod BB/AF (comp)
All Motor SS/EX (Super Stock) - Scott Kelley is competing at Pomona with his Toyota!


One of the big issues with most of these cars is that when they were top billing at Sport Compact events they had sponsors (many were OEMs) now that they are sportsman categories those sponsors are gone and the numbers these cars were running can not be done cheaply as they went through alot of parts (like any other Pro classes). But as the indexs were set based on the known max potential of these classes you have to continue at that previous level to participate, especially in Comp. Most have chosen to compete in other categories (Brad Personnett - Pro Mod, etc).

[junior barns]

Street legal!

You can add all you want to a car and still be able to drive on the street (except headers) as long as it has a ser# and insured!

What is your point?

I may be wrong but I thought NHRA rules were all vehicle had to be available to the public with a minimum # sold with vin #'s??

Can this vehicle be ordered straight from the manufacturer with this same set up (engine, trans, etc)??

[ss3845]

Originally Posted by junior barns

Street legal!

You can add all you want to a car and still be able to drive on the street (except headers) as long as it has a ser# and insured!

What is your point?

I may be wrong but I thought NHRA rules were all vehicle had to be available to the public with a minimum # sold with vin #'s??

Can this vehicle be ordered straight from the manufacturer with this same set up (engine, trans, etc)??

I thought he made his point pretty clear. All Ford did was make the modifications that any racer is going to do to run the car in Stock Eliminator. What difference does it make who does the modifications? Try rereading his post. And reading of the rulebook will answer your other question. You won't find anything about VIN#'s. The fact is NHRA can do whatever they want, when they want and they don't care whether we like it or not. Just ask the SRAC.

[junior barns]

ss3845

Did'nt mean to ruffle anybodies feathers. YES NHRA can do anything they want! I agree there is NO difference from someone taking a GT500, doing the mods themselves or getting one already done from the factory or Roush Racing! This car is avail with specs for everything.

My question is can the CJ be bought from the factory bone stock with the (complete) engine that is in these cars? Just a guestion nothing more.

ps I like these cars just dont think they are factored correctly; and, I dont like reading anything from NHRA even the rule book. LOL