A question for the IHRA guys

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Harry 6674

Having never been to an IHRA track I'm not sure how the class cars compare with the NHRA cars? Doesn't the IHRA allow wider tires and deep pans in stock? Maybe the NHRA racers feel they are at a disadvantage and not willing to change their cars to make use of the rules.

That excuse is B.S. The 10.5 tire is slower by approx .05. That rule was put in many years ago when IHRA had the AA/S class before NHRA ever thought about it and the points race tracks were not what some would call first rate for safety reasons. The tracks are MUCh better today so its a wash. The 9 inch radial will always be quicker unless they are worn out. The extra capacity pan allows someone to run fast WITHOUT trying to run with 3 QTs of oil in a stock pan. Better engine life. How many NHRA guys see zero oil pressure after the finish line when doing this trick ! It kind of helps keep the rods inside the engine where they belong.

[Myron Piatek]

Originally Posted by Harry 6674

Having never been to an IHRA track I'm not sure how the class cars compare with the NHRA cars? Doesn't the IHRA allow wider tires and deep pans in stock? Maybe the NHRA racers feel they are at a disadvantage and not willing to change their cars to make use of the rules.

Crate Motor cars are allowed up to 10.5" measured slicks, but most stay with 9". "Regular" deeper pans (no pan rail kick-outs or steering through sump) are also allowed in CM but not "regular" Stock. Roller rockers have been made legal for all stockers except Pure Stock for reliability. Blueprint specs are in affect for all combos. NHRA stockers don't need to change anything. Since there is no heads-up between regular Stock and CM and the Nitro Jam qualifying sheets show a wide variety of class diversity, I can't see any disadvantage.

It may be easier and less expensive to put a CM combo together, but that was the whole idea behind the concept, which attracted a lot of racers. Nontheless, it is not "easy" as the same basic rules apply, there are indexes and one still has to drive competively. The new factory cars negate the soft index or HP arguments.

[Arnold Greene]

"That's silly, in my opinion. Why would they NOT want any particular kind of car to show up? More cars the better, regardless of type.

There are some combinations that could use some HP, but fast "NHRA" cars typically outqualify crate motor cars. If they whacked the crate motor indexes .50, how many more NHRA would show up that wouldn't normally? They're nothing compared to the CJ's and DP's! LOL I really like the one that's rated 50 HP less than my motor, and runs on a softer index, even after NHRA hit indexes .30! That's AWESOME. I'm not writing letters to the Tech Dept, I'm writing letters to SANTA! "

$.02,
__________________
Michael Beard - IHRA 3 STK - NHRA 216
Staging Light Graphics
Graphic Design & Full-Color Printing


Michael, with all due respect,
I didn't say they didn't want them, I said they didn't expect them to come. That's why they don't care when Nhra has a race in their neighborhood. If they expected the Nhra cars to come, they would try to work with Nhra, as hard as that might be.

As far as the crate motors indexes, start at the 8# class, A/S versus E/CM and check the indexes all the way down. The crate motors can run any intake plus a 750 Holley on small blocks and an 850 on big blocks. Otherwise, the rules are the same for traditional and cm stockers. Why should the cm stockers have that advantage? You guys would be crying if someone that likes to go fast built a car to run in your class. Then you might know what traditional stockers now face with Nhra. BTW, Ihra did a great job by putting the bogus hp new cars where they can run each other and not get a free ride against the 'old cars'.

[Myron Piatek]

Arnold,

The concept of crate motors is to allow more people to get involved. It saved IHRA Stock. However, like the new cars you mentioned, CM cars are also in their own classes, not directly affecting NHRA style cars. You are correct when you say that someone can build a CM car and pick up a lot over the average version. There are a few out there, including some that may be faster than me in J/CM. But even if I had an NHRA car, I would be doing the same thing - trying to find a less populated class because, like many NHRA regulars, I don't have the budget to be a top qualifier or be the fastest in the more popular classes. Nonetheless, I do make the car as fast as I can within my budget as well as the rules and my tuning abilities because I expect to have a heads-up run once in a while. It's an adrenaline rush and a challenge. But I have to focus on how to get the best return on my "investment", otherwise I couldn't race at all.

[Michael Beard]

I didn't say they didn't want them, I said they didn't expect them to come. That's why they don't care when Nhra has a race in their neighborhood. If they expected the Nhra cars to come, they would try to work with Nhra, as hard as that might be.

If THAT'S the case, then they would be idiots.

Why should the cm stockers have that advantage?

Yes, the indexes are soft by comparison, and could use more adjustment, as could some HP factors. (Something some others don't have the integrity to admit...) Be that as it may, it's bracket racing in eliminations, and they only run other crate motor cars heads-up, so the only issue is qualifying... and again, if the "fast NHRA" guys chose to run IHRA events, they would outqualify the crate motor cars. Kind of a moot point. In fact, all of the IHRA 1/4 mile Nitro Joe's Top Guns are NHRA-legal cars. The crate motor cars only "make the cut" in the 1/8th mile Top Guns... so maybe it has to do with 1/8 vs 1/4 mile.

You guys would be crying if someone that likes to go fast built a car to run in your class.

There's always someone ahead of the curve. Now, if someone gets performance-enhancing concessions and are not factored accordingly, then obviously I would have a problem with that, just as I would in NHRA. As long as everyone is building within the rules and factored properly, then that's more than in their rights. What's the problem?

I'm sure I could go stupid fast for another $20K, but what's the point?

Then you might know what traditional stockers now face with Nhra.

I'm well aware of what traditional stockers face in NHRA.

BTW, Ihra did a great job by putting the bogus hp new cars where they can run each other and not get a free ride against the 'old cars'.

Agreed.

Really, the only way to know why NHRA guys don't come to IHRA races is to specifically ask each and every one personally. I don't think there's a silver bullet that's going to change things. Does anybody really think that the car count would triple if IHRA adopted all of NHRA's rules, policies, entries, grade points, payouts, contingency, schedule, etc?

Other than the drop in contingency-participating sponsors (which has effected everyone) and some nitpick things, I think we have it pretty d*mn good in IHRA. Quite frankly, it's changed my life.

[Chad Rhodes]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

It's a sad state of affairs, but every time IHRA has addressed something that somebody said, "If you'd only...", they still don't show up. Eliminate one excuse, and they come up with another. I wish I knew the answer.

If you stop and think about it, scheduling conflicts and access to your customer ( event location), should be priority #1 to increase car counts. If a racer has to drive 8-9 hours with todays price of fuel, and possibly miss an NHRA national or divisional to go "try out" an IHRA race, then it may not look very appealing. IHRA needs to think in terms of AND, and never in EITHER/OR when it comes to NHRA.

It needs to be "well we can run these NHRA races AND we can run these IHRA races", not "Should I EITHER go to the NHRA divisional, OR should I go to the IHRA national". Once you get some of these guy to come AND race, they may be tempted to race more of them. But you will be hard pressed to get many to forgo an NHRA race in favor of the IHRA race, unless it is literally in their back yard. And that may be a challenge.

[Ed Wright]

Good points Chad.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

If you stop and think about it, scheduling conflicts and access to your customer ( event location), should be priority #1 to increase car counts. If a racer has to drive 8-9 hours with todays price of fuel, and possibly miss an NHRA national or divisional to go "try out" an IHRA race, then it may not look very appealing. IHRA needs to think in terms of AND, and never in EITHER/OR when it comes to NHRA.

It needs to be "well we can run these NHRA races AND we can run these IHRA races", not "Should I EITHER go to the NHRA divisional, OR should I go to the IHRA national". Once you get some of these guy to come AND race, they may be tempted to race more of them. But you will be hard pressed to get many to forgo an NHRA race in favor of the IHRA race, unless it is literally in their back yard. And that may be a challenge.

IHRA could NOT get the NHRA guys to come and race when the race was in thier back yard with NOTHING going on within several hundred miles and the payouts were on par with NHRA years ago back in the early 1990's. Budds Creek Md. for example and not one Div. 1 car showed up. Zip, zero, nadda ! That was before the crate motored class even existed and we did tear downs at every race. What was the excuse back then when the economy was alive and strong?

[Chad Rhodes]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

IHRA could NOT get the NHRA guys to come and race when the race was in thier back yard with NOTHING going on within several hundred miles and the payouts were on par with NHRA years ago back in the early 1990's. Budds Creek Md. for example and not one Div. 1 car showed up. Zip, zero, nadda ! That was before the crate motored class even existed and we did tear downs at every race. What was the excuse back then when the economy was alive and strong?

Terry, that's back before I had a driver's license, so I don't know what to tell you right now. But i do know that NHRA has a quite a few disgruntled customers, and IHRA could really capitalize on that. Having scheduling conflicts and letting race tracks fall off the schedule is not the way to do it

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

Terry, that's back before I had a driver's license, so I don't know what to tell you right now. But i do know that NHRA has a quite a few disgruntled customers, and IHRA could really capitalize on that. Having scheduling conflicts and letting race tracks fall off the schedule is not the way to do it

Im just trying to point out tha its was and sometimes today an ego thing. Today I understand why with the economy, losing tracks, lack of sponsors, etc. The other point is nothing ever seems to change. The scheduling leaves a lot to be desired and one or the other if not both associations should consider thier customer base. Gezzz....now you made me feel even older.....LOL.