Econo Modified

[Dick Butler]

Like I said before 3, 4 or 1 car at the Class nationals which could run SS/CS index in eliminator would start more questions and interest than all the discussions we have had here.
We'll see what happens..
Randy, Could we post cash to encourage one of the cars that ran at your place to show up? Pay them gas money or something and see one in person, If several ran there maybe they would show up together..Get your mailing list out and lets contact some of them.

[randy wilson]

Dick, if we still own the cobalt, I'd make sure it was somewhere, but, and this is a big but. THEY WILL NEVER, EVER, NEVER, let it in SS\CS. ASK ANYONE ON THIS BOARD! Go to 11,000 rpm cobalt, or 12,000 rpm nova at youtube, and watch some of it now.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by randy wilson

You know, the funny thing is we're all discussing, and arguing about something that will never happen. I think we've missed the era of interesting spectators, or racers in the concept.

If you remember the "TOP STOCK" deal at Norwalk in IHRA I had a small window to work in. I knew Bill Bader from working as a Tech Offical for IHRA for a long time and Bill was/is a good guy. He was reachable to the little guys and knew a good idea when he saw it. To bad it was "Bastardized" by one of the sponsors who had their name on the program when it came about. At the first race myself and Mike Keener of Checkmate fame put up the prize money out of our own pockets. I believe is was around $500 each along with a few small sponsors we had managed to round up and the hope that if enough cars showed up to race it would become an eliminator. It was well recieved and became an eliminator but as in most cases a good idea isnt always the main requirement. GM Performance and one of their engineers ended up shoving the crate motored combos up our....Im mean down our throats and the rest is history. It takes MONEY to keep an eliminator up and running no matter how popular it might become. GM had the $$$$$$, clout, and the powers that be bended to the almighty dollar. Just something to think about with any new endevor.

[Mike Taylor 3601]

Billy,
I know spec head would have engine built around heads also,what I meant on restrictor plate as example you had X amount of cars running that had just added restrictors,and someone shows up with engine built specifically for restrictors,I'm not sure it would work out.
In my opinion spec head,750/850 carb,cast alum.intake,if supposed to be unmodified that could be bad,if ever seen the unmodified intakes Wilson does for some of the nascar series,they look untouched,but have alot of work done,cut in sections,plenum sizes changed,etc.never heard how many $.
What do associations that run spec head do on intake manifolds?

If 8.5 lbs per ci was the weight around 380'' is biggest I would consider myself,with 2800 min. weight 329.4 would be smallest could be. so that limits how many different sizes you would want to run.

My theory on deck height is from 9.0-9.6 you cover sbc,351W,sbm, from factory351w has alot bigger main,but aftermarket blocks mostly have cleveland main,which puts all three brands close together on main size,and rotate assm. of all three could be built close together in rotating weight without a guy having to spend a bunch of money.

I want to be sure no one takes my post wrong,I'm not saying my ideals are right and yours are wrong,I think is all interesting and am enjoying the conversations.
Mike Taylor 3601

[SStockDart]

RPM limiters?

[Dick Butler]

Originally Posted by randy wilson

Dick, if we still own the cobalt, I'd make sure it was somewhere, but, and this is a big but. THEY WILL NEVER, EVER, NEVER, let it in SS\CS. ASK ANYONE ON THIS BOARD! Go to 11,000 rpm cobalt, or 12,000 rpm nova at youtube, and watch some of it now.

Randy, I do not understand. No I dont recommend racing CLASS with the test car. I recommend running eliminator with it using the SS/CS index then it is SEEN as a combo. People notice the idea more in the open. That kind of stuff.

[Billy Nees]

Mike, no matter what you do regarding rules, a handfull of racers will exploit the rules and dominate. In order to get any kind of series off the ground it has to have participation. The only way to get a significant number of participants, IMHO, is to make participating easy, convenient and inexpensive. Once you get them to try it, they can make their own decision as to whether they want to better their combination and continue or not. The trick is to get them to try it and the more that initially try it, the better chance the series has of surviving. After the series gets underway and gets (hopefully)a following then you can get feedback from those participants in regards to how or if the rules should be changed. But only active participants should have any say in any changes(see X-Techman post).
From my experiences, racers eventually get bored and want to try something different be it a local Bracket racer trying some .90 racing or an NHRA Stock or SS racer trying Nostalgia or a circuit. You have to make it quick and easy to set the hook. There are too few racers with the time, money and knowledge to do a purpose-built car on a whim.

[randy wilson]

X-Tech is just letting us know some of the hang-ups we would encounter, and I'm sure we would. Top stock was a great idea, that got hijacked. To Billy, I don't know how a couple of racers would dominate, if a racers board made ALL the calls, along with Brodix for help. There is just so much HP in a short block. Dick, I now see what you mean, but NHRA would NOT let us run in SS. To Mike, that's why we allowed ANY internal mods to the intake manifold. THAT'S where they, the innovators can play. WAY LESS EXPENSIVE THEN THE HEADS. Control the heads, you control the performance. You could spend a million dollars on the intake, and maybe gain a slight advantage, but a guy with a good brain, could take a well designed intake, have a competent guy port it, pick the right cam, and carb, and compete. It still has to go down into a limited head. I think Mike and I think a lot alike, but we may be wrong. Did anyone go to youtube and watch the black nova against us, or the white nova against us? That race in the dark was Big Shoot-out night, and we won by .0002. We spotted him a tenth, he was at 11.5 lbs, we were at 11. LOOK at the stands, but remember, the stands were only on the side they are filming from.

[joespanova]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gw5VG6n0J4"]High Revving Cobalt vs Nova Heads Up Drag Race - YouTube[/ame]
I assume this is you?
I also notice by the comments , there's the confirmation we live in a world chock full of dumb asses.
BTW , personally , as cool as the engines sound , the performance ( E.T. ) I would want , just isn't there in the little combos.
Also , the camera guy(?) really needs training.

[randy wilson]

Ha, the camera guy. Ya, he ain't no professional. But, you get the drift. And Joe, you're right. Unless they had like 3 different lbs. per cube classes, I think the bigger motors would be better, And I figured you guys would read the posts, and you don't know me from Adam, but the ones posting NEVER even ran the class. They were patsy's for the guys who wanted to slam us. I actually sent my heads over to the competitors so they could look at them, and it's after all that the accusations started bad. I closed it because we had one really nutty family that I thought might go postal. Plus, it wasn't worth the vitriol to keep it open. I doubt we'd have that problem nationally. After all, this is redneck country.