Cheating [2-step And Buttons] - Page 7

Kandra Villani · 09-25-2007, 02:15 PM

Dan: I'm sure anyone who can't win a couple rounds feels the others are cheating, I usually feel like I need to learn and got spanked appropriately! :-) I'm NOT saying I don't think there AREN'T cheaters, but according to the rules, aren't they supposed to have action taken against them, as individuals??? That is why I have a hard time with this whole thing. Button or not, 2 step or not, the principle remains, shouldn't being banned for a year or more from NHRA and having it published in ND and such be a good deterant? IF SOOOO many are cheating that they have to change to rule, rather than enforce it, I would have thought they would have made at least a FEW racers sacrificial lambs to make their point. THEN, I would have to agree with their move here. If 5 or 6 racers were caught and banned and it made public knowledge, and NHRA had informed everyone that because they are catching "x" number of racers at "x" amount of races, then they have every right in my book to make the change.

I just hate the way they change things, whether you agree with the 2 steps or not, until NOW they've been allowed.

The supposition that everyone is cheating has NO merit. Innocent until proven guilty, right???

Kandra

RocketBlock · 09-25-2007, 04:36 PM

Previous cheaters in NHRA racing have been dealt with, drum roll, rule changes or clarifications, sometimes even vacations away from racing! NHRA doesn't seem to want it known but it has happened and there have been reprucussions. Sorry, can't name names because the fact is NHRA didn't have the balls like IHRA to call a cheater a cheater! You would have to think NHRA tech is lame as a half blind, 3 legged dog to think they haven't found a few problems. Ask around tech.

tgriffith · 09-25-2007, 04:41 PM

...

LouisJeffery · 09-25-2007, 04:49 PM

It would only make sense for the best drivers to want buttons and two steps banned. Why let others without their DIVINE capabilities use equipment to compete against them. On the subject of cheating just because they do not have a list of caught cheaters does not in any way suggest there no cheaters. That would be like saying that Chuck D. had the one and only bogus shortblock at indy because he was the only one on the list. LouisJeffery 3225 stock IHRA

Dan Fletcher · 09-25-2007, 05:48 PM

I can remotely understand the position of "if there are no buttons, it's much harder to have a delay".

However, do you really think that someone is going to hit the top bulb, while concealing their body and/or hand movement, hold the footbrake, and then release the footbrake on the bottom...without the starter and/or interested observers noticing that something doesn't look right. Do you really think that is going to go on for long without being detected?

But if you do...or if your position is that stock should be footbrake only (and I agree btw)...or for those that just somehow think that eliminating 2 steps will serve their own personal agenda (whatever it may be), please, get rid of them...for everyone...I'm all for it...level the playing field...make it as hard as possible to be good at this...

Then lets move on to another way that people are cheating (or perverting the very fiber of the class...feel free to choose any spin you'd like)...may I humbly suggest "blocking" as the next witch hunt...

Jack McCarthy · 09-25-2007, 06:31 PM

dan youve been driving too many cars this year...no wonder your win % is drooping a bit... and it might be that new paint job, ,the big V on the door looks like a target to me > LOL !!

anyway i do not think banning 2 steps will have any effect on the better drivers, it might effect the better cheaters !

and i agree get rid on R.T. (and incremetal times)...

i also agree IF cheating is going on the button is only the tip of the iceberg... downtrack ET assistance is easier and more helpful

captain jack and the U/SA 60 chevy wagon

besides i cant stand all that popping and stuttering next to me on the starting line while my tree is coming down

tgriffith · 09-25-2007, 07:35 PM

,,

keith ohanesian · 09-25-2007, 08:26 PM

FAT ED, I Dan is cheating at poker.

09-25-2007, 08:31 PM

Tom,

What's the problem with keeping stock footbrake only, if you want to race with a button get in S/S or Comp where transbrakes and buttons should be used... I know everyone keeps telling me there's no -advantage to the two steps, then why do you need them ? Tim, you are right, this is not about cheating or trying to beat the best racers, it's about getting electronics out of Stock class.. Yes, I know the same guys will keep winning, you are right but not using a two-step..No-body is questioning that point, it's about using electronics...Those guys are just better than the rest of us, they make fewer mistakes and practice a hellva alot more than we do..Give them credit, they race more and are just better than the rest... I can't wait to see the real vote,because we only hearing from the ones who want to keep two-steps and a few who don't mind getting bashed... NHRA, holds all the cards.....Time will tell, I thought more racers would be upset with FI cars in their class... Wait til next years opener and the first class race of the year...It should be very interesting in 2007..... enjoy !!!!! Dave...1033/stock

Ryan Horensky · 09-25-2007, 08:58 PM

I just don't see what the big deal is with this. Why all of a sudden do people want to ban two-steps and everything else. Two-steps at this point are a part of stock. Where were all of you guys 17 years ago when people started using them in stock. Where were your complaints then. I footbrake so it wont affect my driving. Other peoples driving may be affected, but probobly not. I'm not a purist at all so this may be offensive to some. It would be nice to have the opportunity to try a two-step in the future if the class doesn't get totally **....! By people who want to change everything they don't like about it. There are some things that bother me about stock, but I deal with it. Just go out and race! Maybe some of you guys would be as good as the people who must be cheating because they use a two-step! Get real! Go get some seat time and maybe you'll get that good! It's a matter of preference. Some like to use a two-step and some dont. People should still have the choice to choose how they want to race and what they want to use. How is it fair to start trying to change rules because you dont like them. How is that fair to the other racers.

Ryan Horensky
1273 C/SA

09-25-2007, 02:15 PM	#61
Kandra Villani Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Federick, CO Posts: 24 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Dan: I'm sure anyone who can't win a couple rounds feels the others are cheating, I usually feel like I need to learn and got spanked appropriately! :-) I'm NOT saying I don't think there AREN'T cheaters, but according to the rules, aren't they supposed to have action taken against them, as individuals??? That is why I have a hard time with this whole thing. Button or not, 2 step or not, the principle remains, shouldn't being banned for a year or more from NHRA and having it published in ND and such be a good deterant? IF SOOOO many are cheating that they have to change to rule, rather than enforce it, I would have thought they would have made at least a FEW racers sacrificial lambs to make their point. THEN, I would have to agree with their move here. If 5 or 6 racers were caught and banned and it made public knowledge, and NHRA had informed everyone that because they are catching "x" number of racers at "x" amount of races, then they have every right in my book to make the change. I just hate the way they change things, whether you agree with the 2 steps or not, until NOW they've been allowed. The supposition that everyone is cheating has NO merit. Innocent until proven guilty, right??? Kandra

09-25-2007, 04:36 PM	#62
RocketBlock Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 57 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Previous cheaters in NHRA racing have been dealt with, drum roll, rule changes or clarifications, sometimes even vacations away from racing! NHRA doesn't seem to want it known but it has happened and there have been reprucussions. Sorry, can't name names because the fact is NHRA didn't have the balls like IHRA to call a cheater a cheater! You would have to think NHRA tech is lame as a half blind, 3 legged dog to think they haven't found a few problems. Ask around tech.

09-25-2007, 04:41 PM	#63
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] ... Last edited by tgriffith; 09-26-2007 at 08:04 AM.

09-25-2007, 04:49 PM	#64
LouisJeffery Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Detroit Posts: 53 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] It would only make sense for the best drivers to want buttons and two steps banned. Why let others without their DIVINE capabilities use equipment to compete against them. On the subject of cheating just because they do not have a list of caught cheaters does not in any way suggest there no cheaters. That would be like saying that Chuck D. had the one and only bogus shortblock at indy because he was the only one on the list. LouisJeffery 3225 stock IHRA

09-25-2007, 05:48 PM	#65
Dan Fletcher Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Churchville, NY Posts: 491 Likes: 128 Liked 1,040 Times in 69 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] I can remotely understand the position of "if there are no buttons, it's much harder to have a delay". However, do you really think that someone is going to hit the top bulb, while concealing their body and/or hand movement, hold the footbrake, and then release the footbrake on the bottom...without the starter and/or interested observers noticing that something doesn't look right. Do you really think that is going to go on for long without being detected? But if you do...or if your position is that stock should be footbrake only (and I agree btw)...or for those that just somehow think that eliminating 2 steps will serve their own personal agenda (whatever it may be), please, get rid of them...for everyone...I'm all for it...level the playing field...make it as hard as possible to be good at this... Then lets move on to another way that people are cheating (or perverting the very fiber of the class...feel free to choose any spin you'd like)...may I humbly suggest "blocking" as the next witch hunt... __________________ Dan Fletcher 1781 STK, SS, COMP, SG, SC DAN FLETCHER TRAILER SALES

09-25-2007, 06:31 PM	#66
Jack McCarthy VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: lyndon ky. ... louisville area Posts: 1,318 Likes: 28 Liked 459 Times in 113 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] dan youve been driving too many cars this year...no wonder your win % is drooping a bit... and it might be that new paint job, ,the big V on the door looks like a target to me > LOL !! anyway i do not think banning 2 steps will have any effect on the better drivers, it might effect the better cheaters ! and i agree get rid on R.T. (and incremetal times)... i also agree IF cheating is going on the button is only the tip of the iceberg... downtrack ET assistance is easier and more helpful captain jack and the U/SA 60 chevy wagon besides i cant stand all that popping and stuttering next to me on the starting line while my tree is coming down __________________ Jack McCarthy 3609 STK "the Captain"

09-25-2007, 07:35 PM	#67
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] ,, Last edited by tgriffith; 09-26-2007 at 08:05 AM.

09-25-2007, 08:26 PM	#68
keith ohanesian Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 392 Likes: 0 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] FAT ED, I Dan is cheating at poker.

09-25-2007, 08:31 PM	#69
RIBEIRO RACING Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Tom, What's the problem with keeping stock footbrake only, if you want to race with a button get in S/S or Comp where transbrakes and buttons should be used... I know everyone keeps telling me there's no -advantage to the two steps, then why do you need them ? Tim, you are right, this is not about cheating or trying to beat the best racers, it's about getting electronics out of Stock class.. Yes, I know the same guys will keep winning, you are right but not using a two-step..No-body is questioning that point, it's about using electronics...Those guys are just better than the rest of us, they make fewer mistakes and practice a hellva alot more than we do..Give them credit, they race more and are just better than the rest... I can't wait to see the real vote,because we only hearing from the ones who want to keep two-steps and a few who don't mind getting bashed... NHRA, holds all the cards.....Time will tell, I thought more racers would be upset with FI cars in their class... Wait til next years opener and the first class race of the year...It should be very interesting in 2007..... enjoy !!!!! Dave...1033/stock

09-25-2007, 08:58 PM	#70
Ryan Horensky Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Sugarloaf,PA Posts: 201 Likes: 19 Liked 109 Times in 18 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] I just don't see what the big deal is with this. Why all of a sudden do people want to ban two-steps and everything else. Two-steps at this point are a part of stock. Where were all of you guys 17 years ago when people started using them in stock. Where were your complaints then. I footbrake so it wont affect my driving. Other peoples driving may be affected, but probobly not. I'm not a purist at all so this may be offensive to some. It would be nice to have the opportunity to try a two-step in the future if the class doesn't get totally **....! By people who want to change everything they don't like about it. There are some things that bother me about stock, but I deal with it. Just go out and race! Maybe some of you guys would be as good as the people who must be cheating because they use a two-step! Get real! Go get some seat time and maybe you'll get that good! It's a matter of preference. Some like to use a two-step and some dont. People should still have the choice to choose how they want to race and what they want to use. How is it fair to start trying to change rules because you dont like them. How is that fair to the other racers. Ryan Horensky 1273 C/SA