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Old 01-07-2009, 01:27 PM   #31
Dick Butler
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

First Crate motor is a term to degrade racing ONLY a term. We can gradually "evolve" to Spec motors or move constructively to limit ambiguous rules and rulings.
Yes I am not racing now but with doing it with three cars in the late part of my 35 years doing it I have watched it , experienced it and dealt with it. You may not like the term Crate motors but you each have your own Spec motor now just you built it to fit the spec of your year car. Everyone wants stable specs while some use the unstable production of old parts as an excuse to not follow the specs published. Why dont people keep searching for a casting that can make the specs? cost of multiple old castings to find one pair that works. With the consistent push for fewer and fewer gray zones on valve angles, valves , acid use people are pushing for a CNC piece to be used with molded production. Alan, I respect your point of view that it would not be the same (in one way) to have given Casting of aftermarket to be used. It is the same just get the piece clean and cheaper and hopefully less to finish and the supply can be larger.
55 chevy still has a spec, Ford still has a spec. People still can race class now with Aluminum heads right? what would change except ONE STEP to uniform parts and specs for all motors and brands.
As far as a Chevy eliminator I hear ford has a DOVE head, right, Cranks are built by many people. This could really help the manufacturers have a market and continue to exist.Chrysler has all new Hemi parts produced now right?

Last edited by Dick Butler; 01-07-2009 at 01:35 PM.
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Old 01-07-2009, 02:29 PM   #32
Alan Roehrich
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

Never mind.
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Old 01-07-2009, 02:48 PM   #33
Ed Fernandez
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Butler View Post
First Crate motor is a term to degrade racing ONLY a term. We can gradually "evolve" to Spec motors or move constructively to limit ambiguous rules and rulings.
Yes I am not racing now but with doing it with three cars in the late part of my 35 years doing it I have watched it , experienced it and dealt with it. You may not like the term Crate motors but you each have your own Spec motor now just you built it to fit the spec of your year car. Everyone wants stable specs while some use the unstable production of old parts as an excuse to not follow the specs published. Why dont people keep searching for a casting that can make the specs? cost of multiple old castings to find one pair that works. With the consistent push for fewer and fewer gray zones on valve angles, valves , acid use people are pushing for a CNC piece to be used with molded production. Alan, I respect your point of view that it would not be the same (in one way) to have given Casting of aftermarket to be used. It is the same just get the piece clean and cheaper and hopefully less to finish and the supply can be larger.
55 chevy still has a spec, Ford still has a spec. People still can race class now with Aluminum heads right? what would change except ONE STEP to uniform parts and specs for all motors and brands.
As far as a Chevy eliminator I hear ford has a DOVE head, right, Cranks are built by many people. This could really help the manufacturers have a market and continue to exist.Chrysler has all new Hemi parts produced now right?
Dick;
What about Buick,Olds,6 cyl. engines,Pontiac,AMC etc.?Me and Jeff,Aris,Jim Mantle and others can't just run to the local AMC dealership or for that matter most after market companies and get the trick of the week.I know,build something more common.There's enough Chevies and Mustangs now.We dont need Chevy_Mustang Elim. being called to the lanes.

Ed F.
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Old 01-07-2009, 03:07 PM   #34
Dick Butler
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

Alan, I understand the feelings about the Crate motors because it loses the "flavor" of class racing.
The alternative is dont us the term and wait for all cars to get there over another X years with bogus specs of every kind and opinions for decisions instead of Numbers or specs.If it were a move to SIMPLIFY the spec choices and searchs and specs to enforce that was my view.
Ed, Diversity is a neat deal in Class racing. Can it be racings worst enemy? maybe. Too many specs in the books and too few enforcers and tech abilities to keep it working. Soon laxity and lack of enforcement and overruling decisions become the norm.
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Old 01-07-2009, 04:00 PM   #35
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Talking Re: Runner Volumes

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Alan, I understand the feelings about the Crate motors because it loses the "flavor" of class racing.
The alternative is dont us the term and wait for all cars to get there over another X years with bogus specs of every kind and opinions for decisions instead of Numbers or specs.If it were a move to SIMPLIFY the spec choices and searchs and specs to enforce that was my view.
Ed, Diversity is a neat deal in Class racing. Can it be racings worst enemy? maybe. Too many specs in the books and too few enforcers and tech abilities to keep it working. Soon laxity and lack of enforcement and overruling decisions become the norm.
Dick;
The real reasons are
1) Lazy IDGAS leadership in Glendora
2) A small % of racers that will do anything at any cost to go faster and or win races
3) Our wonderful Nat'l tech director
4) GG (glendora greed).Ever seen the salaries these bums pull down?If it was a public owned corp. they would have been out on their asses a long time ago.
I have more,but maybe others can add to the list,it's far from complete.

Ed F.
Dick you were doing well for a while but you seem to be going over the edge again.Get back on those meds.
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Old 01-07-2009, 04:10 PM   #36
Dick Butler
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

Ed , No meds, I get light headed standing on the Soap Box, too little O2. I'll rest a while and recover.. Thanks. Back to politics.....
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Old 01-07-2009, 04:30 PM   #37
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Ed , No meds, I get light headed standing on the Soap Box, too little O2. I'll rest a while and recover.. Thanks. Back to politics.....
How many steps to the top?I thought you would add to the list.

Ed
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Old 01-08-2009, 12:39 PM   #38
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

dick,

get off the soapbox and back into a race car...maybe it will refocus your thinking

we think top stock is cool, FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO PLAY... not everyone does.

and furthermore i dont need you are anyone else to tell me what i should race and what the rules should be... if i chose to race and "obscure combo" in your words i should be run out of stock eliminator.

bob shaw has forgot more about what stock eliminator means than you may have ever known.

jack mccarthy

p.s. i thought this thread was about those cheating bogus cave sized stocker heads that are gonna be $5000 weight box material ??????????????
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Old 01-08-2009, 03:08 PM   #39
Dick Butler
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Default Re: Runner Volumes

Jack, Thanks you are correct. The thread Is about the$ 5000. door stops. No planning for the future and no end to the door stops. Just more and more expensive replacements and frustrations.
No intent to tell ANYONE how to race or WHAT to race or what to call racing their cars. Too much fun just frustrating as seen today.
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Old 01-08-2009, 09:27 PM   #40
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Wink Re: Runner Volumes

This is probably an ignorant question, but, why do all the stocker heads that fail to pass tech become $5000.00 door stops and ballast. Are door stops really in that short of supply and the demand is so great that they bring $5000.00 on the open market. Or is Bernie Madoff the only wholesale outlet for them?

Now I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but if I had a set of 'large capacity' cylinder heads, I'd probably list them on Class Racer and hope that a Super Stock racer bought them. After all, isn't the supply of OEM heads finite? And don't forget, those dad-gum collectors are gobblin' them all up!
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