Factory experimental

[Bruce Noland]

Jack,

I have to say that you are one of the most pro nhra racers I have met. Sure you got beat up a little at Pomona and I'm sorry that happened but I personally don't believe it has changed your point of view.

Yes, I have spoken to racers who know a lot about these cars and who have seen them go down the track. I'm not afraid to come out here and post for them if I think they are right. And what if you are wrong? What happens when they take the wraps off these cars and show their real performance to you? What will you say then? Oh well, shucky darn, those cars are rael fast. By then it will be too darn late and it will take nhra years to catch up to them. And what is so darn bad about them running in a Factory Experimental class? Do you have a particular reason for not liking Factory Experimental or are you being nhra stuborn?

[Bruce Noland]

Jack,
Nobody needs you dissect the way they post. The man has an open mind and can see the potential for a train wreck while you have your eyes closed.

[junior barns]

I have to agree with Bruce. I have only been going to a couple of races a year recently so I have'nt been worried about how fast I needed to go. My plans were to step up my program and get back into the lions den with the upper class guys (AA, A/SA ) and even the top stock class. Now; I believe I will save my money and watch to see what happens with these cars. Separate class is the only fair thing to do until these cars have shown what their true potential is!

I dont like bringing a knife to a gun fight!

ps I still like the cars and want to see them run!

[bill dedman]

It looks to me like the ONLY problem with this whole MESS is: "Are these engines correctly "factored" by NHRA?", so that there's not another debacle that takes YEARS for the AHFS to resolve, like it did with the LS-1's.

That was an inexcusable, totally preventable, (and deliberate, I think), faux pas on NHRA's part, and could (and probably will) happen again with these Cobra Jets. It's the one thing that NHRA can "do" for these manufacturers when they (NHRA) want to give them a pat on the back. Unfortunately, it invariably comes at great expense to the rank-and-file....

Having said that, and with that scenario fresh in mind, I don't understand why anyone would think it necessary to create a new class ("F/X") for these cars when they will fit so very well in existing Super Stock classes.

That's what they did in '68 with the then-new Cobra Jets, when they won there... Only the 'cammers were put into F/X (oh, and Bil Hoeffer's Weber-carbed 289.)

I think that the only real problem that these cars are going to create will come about if they're severely under-factored, (DUH....) but of course, that would also be a problem if they were put into Super Stock, too. But, the type of performances that Bruce has alleged they can produce wouldn't be so overtly out-of-line in Super Stock, as they are almost guaranteed to be in Stock.

If they are correctly "factored" (and I have my doubts), then they should be fine in Stock; if not, make them Super Stockers; there are lots of cars in that Eliminator that will not be intimidated by the blowers and 4-valve technology they possess. They are, in fact, small motors, after all... just GOOD ones!

The problem is, of course, getting it right the first time... you don't want to have to move a car out of one Eliminator, into another, after it's originally been classified. That would be unprecented, and undoubtedly wouldn't happen. The Cobra Jets (and their competitiors) are going to have to live with wherever they are put, initially, it would seem. Get it right, NHRA!

I'm delighted to see both them and the Dodges in the fray. I think it's a wonderful opportunity to give Sportsman racing some badly needed media exposure; I just hope it doesn't come at the expense of long-established racers' programs that have been many years and many dollars in the making.

We'll know a lot more in about two week....

Thanks for listening.

[Jack Matyas]

Bruce -- First of all I hope you don't think this is a personal attack on you . Second -- what if I'm wrong -- no shucks about it -- it always catches up -- its never too late to fix a problem .
As for the Factory Experimental class -- I'm sure you understand that has no chance whatsoever in becoming a class . No , I'm not being NHRA stubborn -- just realistic .

As for disecting bsa633's post my point was and still is that we should stick to real facts --not maybe's .And I surely believe he is entitled to his opinion -- whatever that may be .

[George Wright]

[junior barns]

and still went 10.20"s

Unless I got lucky; I was just kidding!!

[Bruce Noland]

Bill,
You're right. The Horsepower rating is the real problem. I think Evan agrees the Horsepower is soft.

[Ed Wright]

If NHRA or IHRA wanted to, they could take one to a chassis dyno and see what they make at the tires. The LT1 and LS1 cars made more at the rear tires than the factory flywheel ratings. Should be off about 15% with a stick car. My everyday driver is an untouched '98 WS6 (ram air) LS1 automatic Trans Am convert. It makes 326 at the tires. A decent stick version makes closer to 340. What are they finally factored at now?? Even if they started off with the rwhp numbers, it would surely be closer than what Ford (or any mfgr) rates them.

Won't make everybody happy, but would be closer than advertised hp for sure. Could save a year or more with the AHFS handling it. Might cost somebody an hour's worth of time. You would want an untouched vehicle, not one that could have been de-tuned by the mfgr or racer before be presented for testing. NASCAR uses a Dynojet just like mine for spot testing cup cars after races to keep the different brands competitive with each other. Simplest thing it the world to do. The numbers can't be skewed by the operator as with many other brands.

[goinbroke2]

Maybe nhra decided to drop them into Stock instead of coming out with a new F/X class because....well...mopar is now owned by fiat and basically broke and gm ain't far behind. The camaro was delayed because of an interior part couldn't be supplied because the supplier went bankrupt. When will the camaro be out...WILL it be out...will gm and mopar spend on dragracing when the braindeads in congress could get wind of it?

Let it run and then bitch...how can everyone be so upset when it hasn't even been in competition yet.






Oh yeah, it's a damn ford!