Spy shots - Don Garlits Challenger

[Mike Carr]

The weight breaks are different, hence no T-Bolts, AMX's and '68 Hemis in Stock. AA/S is the same weight break as SS/D (7.5). If the weight breaks were the same, those other cars would be in Stock Eliminator. Actually, when the '68 Hemis came out, they ran SS/B and SS/A was an empty class (nothing fit). The AMX's were SS/F when they debuted. Not sure what the T-Bolts fit. The Hemis were rated 425 from the factory (hmmm). I don't know exactly when, but soon after NHRA rated the Hemis at 500, where they still stand today for the stick cars (507 for the automatics). I guess if we had the old school regime at NHRA now, instead of the bean counters, they would have laughed at the absurdity of the 425 rating of the 2008 CJ's and assigned them a more realistic factor? Who knows. It would be neat if Stock ran on the same weight break as S/S (starting at 6 pounds for AA, 6.5 for A/S, 7 for B/S, etc). Could have made for some even more interesting matches in the higher classes. Oh well, it's a moot point. With the evolution of racing and factory stuff, things change. Thirty years from now, there might be something come down the line that is a half-second faster than the '08 CJ's, and those racers will be complaining, same as the modern-day '08 CJ bashers are. Same as the Stocker racers did when the LT-1/LS-1's came out and began to dominate. These new Mustangs are far the first cars to come down under-rated and dominate, and sure won't be the last. I doubt they will last the whole year at their current rating. They will get hit, and may be relegated to AA, or even out of Stock, before too long. Who knows.

[Jared Jordan]

Originally Posted by Mike Carr

I doubt they will last the whole year at their current rating. They will get hit, and may be relegated to AA, or even out of Stock, before too long.

That's definitely one advantage the Challengers have over the CJ's. If the CJ's get hit a few times they will be out of Stock like so many of you want them to be. On the other hand, the Challenger, which is rated 40 HP less for the "big" motor, will be around for the foreseeable future.

I haven't seen anyone discuss which of the two combos will be the faster of the two. I'm betting on the Dodge, but I'm admittedly biased...

My $.02

[Jeff Lee]

Originally Posted by Jared Jordan

That's definitely one advantage the Challengers have over the CJ's. If the CJ's get hit a few times they will be out of Stock like so many of you want them to be. On the other hand, the Challenger, which is rated 40 HP less for the "big" motor, will be around for the foreseeable future.

I haven't seen anyone discuss which of the two combos will be the faster of the two. I'm betting on the Dodge, but I'm admittedly biased...

My $.02

Jared,
In Stock Eliminator my WAG or wild *** guess is the 6.1L Hemi will initially make 685 HP as a prepared stock eliminator engine following the rules and current tricks of the trade. That's engine Dyno.
My WAG on the 5.4L is 725-750 HP.
Plugging those numbers and weights of 3250 Challenger and 3570 Mustang show both equal at 9.78+/-.
Previously I had predicted by the end of 2009 a Mustang CJ500 will clock a 9.42. So far we've seen an official 9.79 on race #2 so I don't think I'm going to be out in left field on the Mustang prediction.
And I'll bet a 5-speed with the proper race clutch behind a 6.1L Hemi will see at least a 9.55 ET by the end of the year.
My WAG is that by the end of 2009 if a 5-speed Challenger 6.1L is properly built and driven with a high RPM launch (7500 or so) , it will be the fastest car in class. And I don't think a auto trans Challenger will be much slower.
I'm betting the Challengers will always have less traction issues (start and down-track) than the Mustang.
Maybe this should be it's own thread?

[bsa633]

Originally Posted by Jared Jordan

That's definitely one advantage the Challengers have over the CJ's. If the CJ's get hit a few times they will be out of Stock like so many of you want them to be.

I dont think so..there's gonna be a new rule before that happens...going something like: Cars can always stay in stock if they were classed 7.5 or higher when they entered the class...but more likley they will just add 7.0..these new stockers are gonna make SS look silly..thats for sure..

We guys with the older "higher up" cars that dont want or can afford to build something new have to start finding a new venue fast ..these Cars are here to stay..and gonna change the face of Stock and SS forever..and ultimatley kill it i think..in Phoenix half of the field were upper class cars..that means alot of heads up..if there are a total of 8-10 of these new cars at the races..do you really think there will be 40-50 of the old one's there at the same time within a couple of years? probably less than half is my prediction..that means a decline in participants..not good for the class..The fix is FX at 7.0 and put the right factor on them...fast..

p.s That FX-class should be a class in SS not Stock in my opinion..but i can buy that the new cars gets to "shine" in Stock..

[Bruce Noland]

Mike,

Yes the Camaro left a couple months ago and my new car should be out very soon. Thanks for the nice comments about the Camaro.

I need to renew my stuff with IHRA to recieve their new rule book. Are the injected cars and carbureted cars still separated at IHRA events?

Thanks.

[Eric Merryfield]

Originally Posted by Bruce Noland

Mike,

Yes the Camaro left a couple months ago and my new car should be out very soon. Thanks for the nice comments about the Camaro.

I need to renew my stuff with IHRA to recieve their new rule book. Are the injected cars and carbureted cars still separated at IHRA events?

Thanks.

Bruce,

Yes, stock(which includes CM),FI, Stock truck(like my dakota),stock Gt and pure stock for those who want to play for the least dough....some drive it to the track....but you do have to have the original cam, heater box, no lightweight brakes, have to run mufflers if you run headers, smaller tires..etc.

Here is the link to the rulebook.

http://www.ihra.com/competition/index.php#rulebook

Eric

[Bruce Noland]

Eric,
Thank you for the information and link.

[Eric Merryfield]

Originally Posted by Bruce Noland

Eric,
Thank you for the information and link.

Good luck with your new ride. If you have it ready in time you would likely enjoy the D-1 proam and Sportsman National at Richmond at the end of May likely pretty close to you.

Eric

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Eric Merryfield

Bruce,

Yes, stock(which includes CM),FI, Stock truck(like my dakota),stock Gt and pure stock for those who want to play for the least dough....some drive it to the track....but you do have to have the original cam, heater box, no lightweight brakes, have to run mufflers if you run headers, smaller tires..etc.

Here is the link to the rulebook.

http://www.ihra.com/competition/index.php#rulebook

Eric

In pure stock cams that check on OEM duration, over lap, and lift like the pre 1985 stocker cams are legal (if they have someone who knows how to check one...lol). Valve spring pressures must be OEM also (if they have a spring checker).

Thirty years from now....?? Five years and we might be talking who has the most voltage!!