little help with FWD

[Bob Shaw]

Could the camshaft be advanced too much?

[tgriffith]

how dnagerous would it be to have a spool in the front????

on the cam being advanced??? I wouldnt think so even though I cant say for sure. I bought the long block from napa in 2001,,,,,,at the time, they installed the cam for me. The used a stock timing chain (or belt) and stock gears. They didnt advance it. Im not sure but Im thinking if they got it off a tooth, it wouldnt run rite at all....OR would it????? it sure does have the symptoms of being too far advanced

I tryed different computers thinking it might have been something there but same result on the downtrack ET not matching with the short time ET. The cam itself is one of those "out of the box" compu cams that crane used to sell with an advertised .423 lift.......and a mega 204 @ .050 in duration (LOL). There has never been any issues with idling,,starting, and appears stock except its loud,,,,,so this is the reason Im thinking its not off a tooth

I know with MSD, if you wire the crank trigger backward, it will be 10 degrees off or so but it will run fine,,,,,,,because some of the wiring had been hacked up when the digital MSD was installed,,,, I reverse the trigger wires........It fired and went "BANG",,,,,so we wont do that again

Ed,,you are correct about running it in bracket mode,,,My only issue with that is,,,,if I slow it down too much,,,,I will run out of dial in since its so slow down track.....and even though Bristol isnt the best hookin gplace in the world,,,,it was fairly good with the new guys at the helm AND the car wasnt making the HP it will at rockingham.......Rockingham is marginal at best, when the pro stuff is over,,,,,so if one gets lucky and makes it to 3 rd or so,,,its going to be problems...but at the rock, the car has ran 14.9`s so I would have some et I could kill

What about those lower A arms being bent out of shape????? I think I have come up with a way to add a traction bar using the lower motor mount (dog bone) and using the motor roll to shove the front end down when it launches,,,I had also seen somewhere (maybe on a neon) a type of ladder bar with 2 points connected to the A-arm and one point connected under the radiator,,,,,it didnt seem to actaully cause the car to hook but only served to keep the A-arm from twisting. A friend of mine today told me that he thought earlier cavaliers might have had a steel lower A arm...wasnt sure it would fit..


anyone know how much leaway Ihra/Nhra will tolerate with FWDers???

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by tgriffith

how dnagerous would it be to have a spool in the front????

on the cam being advanced??? I wouldnt think so even though I cant say for sure. I bought the long block from napa in 2001,,,,,,at the time, they installed the cam for me. The used a stock timing chain (or belt) and stock gears. They didnt advance it. Im not sure but Im thinking if they got it off a tooth, it wouldnt run rite at all....OR would it????? it sure does have the symptoms of being too far advanced

I tryed different computers thinking it might have been something there but same result on the downtrack ET not matching with the short time ET. The cam itself is one of those "out of the box" compu cams that crane used to sell with an advertised .423 lift.......and a mega 204 @ .050 in duration (LOL). There has never been any issues with idling,,starting, and appears stock except its loud,,,,,so this is the reason Im thinking its not off a tooth

I know with MSD, if you wire the crank trigger backward, it will be 10 degrees off or so but it will run fine,,,,,,,because some of the wiring had been hacked up when the digital MSD was installed,,,, I reverse the trigger wires........It fired and went "BANG",,,,,so we wont do that again

Ed,,you are correct about running it in bracket mode,,,My only issue with that is,,,,if I slow it down too much,,,,I will run out of dial in since its so slow down track.....and even though Bristol isnt the best hookin gplace in the world,,,,it was fairly good with the new guys at the helm AND the car wasnt making the HP it will at rockingham.......Rockingham is marginal at best, when the pro stuff is over,,,,,so if one gets lucky and makes it to 3 rd or so,,,its going to be problems...but at the rock, the car has ran 14.9`s so I would have some et I could kill

What about those lower A arms being bent out of shape????? I think I have come up with a way to add a traction bar using the lower motor mount (dog bone) and using the motor roll to shove the front end down when it launches,,,I had also seen somewhere (maybe on a neon) a type of ladder bar with 2 points connected to the A-arm and one point connected under the radiator,,,,,it didnt seem to actaully cause the car to hook but only served to keep the A-arm from twisting. A friend of mine today told me that he thought earlier cavaliers might have had a steel lower A arm...wasnt sure it would fit..


anyone know how much leaway Ihra/Nhra will tolerate with FWDers???

Trust me ,you don't want a spool in a FWD car. Very hard to steer ,except straight ahead. It''ll break your arm if you're not holding onto the wheel tight and you turn sharp .Especially on gravel of grass.

That mild cam explains alot. That's why it wants to run with less gear (tall tires) on it . You're making it hard to hook too, with that torque down low.
Tire pressure : We always ran the 173 Cimarrons with very low t/p. 8-9 lbs. Only way they'd hook .Everybody thought I was getting a flat all the time, with all that frontal weight.
I'd get rid of the alum a-arms . They're not helping you any .
Pretty sure those Caddys had steel lowers. They were 87-88 pilot cars. Maybe Jim Wahl will comfirm that.
Not done. Tired of typing tonight .You got a long way to go ,bud.

[Jeff Lee]

I see no mention of stiff front shocks....I had Koni "sport" struts on my A/FS Daytona set at full stiff for racing and softer on the street. That and the aluminum flywheel stopped the CV joint problems I had.

[Tim Kish]

The "traction bar" setup you reference as seen on a Neon (likely SRT-4) ties the control arms to the core support to reduce control arm deflection under load. The Honda guys do the same thing but deflection of the a-arms and chassis on the mid-late 90's Civics were pretty bad. What they are trying to do is reduce control arm, control arm bushing and cross member deflection which results in negative changes in alignment as well as contributes to wheel hop if it unloads. Installing solid bushings / heim joints in place of the rubber bushings takes care of much of the deflection issues.

I've run a spool in my car since last spring. Yes its hard to manuever low speed, damn hard to push around corners but maneuvers fine on track.

[tgriffith]

thanks guys for all the input,,,,,going to try much less air pressure tomorrow....Also going to look at this cam thing...........

The more I think about it (gettin in trouble here--LOL)----the cam`s duration just may be creating alot of torque and certainly no downtrack HP------once you look at it,,,its very obvious why the numbers dont match.....and its been that way from day 1------I have to be carefull about the finish line,,,,, when Im running a car the same et, they can alway out MPH me by 4 or 5

Im going to try to make something to stablize the new a-arms and also going to change struts,,,,,the ones on the car are worn out....got to remember to think in reverse (LOL)

on the spool thing,,,my car now is suppose to have the limited slip,,,it isnt working very well and the car still has the power steering rack in it which already makes it a nightmare to drive,,,,,,need to find manual if they are available,,,,,,,if there still is a problem after the cam change,,,,I`ll spool it

I havent seen the 125 apart in sometime so I dont really remember what would be involved with making a spool BUT i do have a friend that owns a machine shop,,,,if it can be made,,,he can do it and he has a machine for re splinning axles

again,,,thanks for the help

[larry dowty]

i have 2 spools in stock for the 125 i had them made for my car and never got around to using them. i will make you a good deal dont need tham any more.

[Rob Lloyd]

Originally Posted by tgriffith

I think I have come up with a way to add a traction bar using the lower motor mount (dog bone) and using the motor roll to shove the front end down when it launches,,,

...

anyone know how much leaway Ihra/Nhra will tolerate with FWDers???

I've seen a similar setup on a (non-class car) turbo dodge. He said it was good for nearly 0.1 off his short times. Not sure how NHRA would view such a contraption. I mean, it's essentially the same as traction bars - which you can run on a RWD stocker...

[Toddwell]

Originally Posted by Rob Lloyd

I've seen a similar setup on a (non-class car) turbo dodge. He said it was good for nearly 0.1 off his short times. Not sure how NHRA would view such a contraption. I mean, it's essentially the same as traction bars - which you can run on a RWD stocker...

Rob, were you thinking of that swaybar/ dogbone setup?

Here's a couple pics...

Todd (vntodd)

[Rob Lloyd]

Originally Posted by Toddwell

Rob, were you thinking of that swaybar/ dogbone setup?

Here's a couple pics...

Todd (vntodd)

That's exactly the car I was thinking about...