SS 3 speed Auto or Stick $$$$$

[Jeff Lee]

All apples to apples the stick is usually better. A 250# weight penalty would be pretty stiff. But in S/SS there are no weight penalties (unless there is in the modified class). There are instances were the index is harder on stick combos. I run SS/G-H-I and the index is only .05 apart per class instead of the normal .015. Another example is SS/J vs. SS/JA. That index is .015 apart but the fastest SS/J will out run the fastest SS/JA on a heads-up run while the SS/JA will out qualify the SS/J.
I think it usually boils down to many of the stick racers are just stubborm and determined to race a stick. Many aren't even chasing records or low qualifying times. But some, like me, are. That's just my bag. Dig it. Groovy....

[Ed Carpenter]

Darrin are you going to be in Houston next weekend? If so look me up. ED

[Dragsinger]

All this talk about manual trans has me interested.

My latest build up is a 1990 Firebird that I plan to race in local brackets. The plan is a relatively mild build up to run low 10's. So just how would a four speed manual be in this combination?

Thanks
Larry Woodfin

[Scotty D]

larry the 4speed will hold up just fine,and be more efficient than an automatic.this part of the equation i hope jeff lee will correct where i'm wrong.the misnomer is that you have to work on them all the time that however is as far from the truth as you can get.if you build it bullet proof to begin with you shouldn't have to work on except for general maintance.i was talking to a guy here in cincy on this very subject at our first stick race of the year(i help with the umtr its a manual transmission series its in Ohio) his name is robby kropfeld,his dad drove the miss budwieser hydroplane racve boat for many years,robby is a very accomplished driver has won several big money bracket races.robby had said that he would like to build a stick to run with us,but he didn't want to have to work on it all the time.a friend dave stehlin who is the director of umtr has a all steel 79 z-28 that weighs 3400 lbs and runs 9.50,it is powered by a 415 small block and a clutch assisted jerico,he put a good slipper clutch in it and put approximately 300 passes on it,at that point had the clutch rebuilt and put a new ring and pinion just to be safe.also checked the trans and everything was a ok and rebuilt the motor.and all of this was with no more than general oil changes,valve adjustments and every 30 passes would do a clutch adjustment.if you would like you can go to the umtr website and ask all kinds of question everybody over there loves to talk stick cars and answer questions.

[Darrin Christen]

Originally Posted by deuces wild

Darrin are you going to be in Houston next weekend? If so look me up. ED

Yes ED, I will be there and will look for you.

[Darrin Christen]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lee

All apples to apples the stick is usually better. A 250# weight penalty would be pretty stiff. But in S/SS there are no weight penalties (unless there is in the modified class). There are instances were the index is harder on stick combos. I run SS/G-H-I and the index is only .05 apart per class instead of the normal .015. Another example is SS/J vs. SS/JA. That index is .015 apart but the fastest SS/J will out run the fastest SS/JA on a heads-up run while the SS/JA will out qualify the SS/J.
I think it usually boils down to many of the stick racers are just stubborm and determined to race a stick. Many aren't even chasing records or low qualifying times. But some, like me, are. That's just my bag. Dig it. Groovy....

Jeff, I have been looking into the SS/Modified Stock classes and the way I read the rules there is a weight break for the autos. I forget exactly how it reads, but it talks about 250lbs or some percentage of weight. If its 250lbs extra for a stick, thats a lot to overcome in my opinion. The index is the same for the autos and the sticks in the modified stock class. SS/AS SS/BS SS/CS and so on.

[John Mason]

In SS/AS - SS/DS you can remove 5% for automatic, up to 250 lbs. max.
SS/CS for example - 300 ci X 10.5 lbs = 3150 less 5% (157.5 lbs) = 2992.5 minimum weight.
Remember, Modified Stock weight includes driver when figuring class.

[Jeff Lee]

Scotty D,
I can speak from experience that if you are not getting help from the manufacturer; basically sold a pile of parts and told to go at it, you will be under the car a lot. Not only in making clutch tuning adjustments (often times pulling the bellhousing), but you can expect more broken parts. That ads to the frustrations, expense and lost rounds. I've been there.
It wasn't until I started using my current supplier I found the value in getting the parts set-up to your application and having the ability to call the owner if there was a problem with conditions and how to adjust for them.
If you buy were I buy, follow the instructions (often seems to be a big problem), you'll enjoy the racing. If you fight it, it will make you miserable. It's that simple.
And I built my car for a stick. That's a Dana 60 stuffed with MW parts (steel spool, not aluminum), MW CM driveshaft and MW yokes. The only weak link I've had show up is inadequate leaf spring u-bolts and not boxing in the spring pads. Nothing else has ever broken since 1998(all though I don't race as often as others).

Regarding the weight penalty, my first impression is NHRA must have saw the need for penalyzing stick cars in those class'es. That should tell you something. Second, if I had a small high winding engine, I would not want an auto trans. And I don't know that part of the rule book, but I believe you can run a 5-speed stick. All the better.