Clutchless transmission permitted in S/S

[randy wilson]

i do not think they should get rid of auto weight breaks, i still think a clutch car is quicker than an auto, espescially a 2 speed. comp cars get 250 and indexes are virtually the same, tell me why and where i am wrong.we ran a 9.5 car with 2 speed and it was .26 slower than our 11 lbs. 4 speed car , and yes we were using the clutch between each gear, and .35 slower going clutchless , same exact engine combo. let the games begin.

[Nitro Joe Jackson]

were the weight break should change is in SS/AH, either everybody races at 3210 or 3170, personally i think if the weight doesn't get changed you will see a bunch of sticks in Cuda's & Darts.
It's been proven these transmissions are fast and maybe faster now

ps I don't like the rule change, but I'm just a fan.

[Mike Dahl]

Randy,

The national records are as follows and I would respectfully submit this is our best barometer for comparing potential performance .

SS/A 8.78 SS/AA 8.61
SS/B 8.97 SS/BA 8.84
SS/C 9.18 SS/CA 9.00
SS/D 9.28 SS/DA 9.12
SS/E 9.48 SS/EA 9.04
SS/F 9.59 SS/FA 9.26
SS/G 9.48 SS/GA 9.53
SS/H 9.74 SS/HA 9.63
SS/I 9.76 SS/IA 9.54
SS/J 9.94 SS/JA 9.93

So, if you remove SS/E & SS/F from the list to create a truer median #, you still have the automatics with a .116/sec advantage, yet there is at least a .1 index advantage for the autos and in some cases .2 Really?

I would have done a GT comparison, but there are too many minimums. I suppose it must be because the sticks are so attractive to everyone.

I always hear how if somebody put a stick in their car it would go faster, but clearly the records tell a different tale. I think most people would be sorely disappointed after losing a tenth on the index, losing their radial tires and having the overwhelming joy of learning how to work on their clutches.

P.S. The clutchless tranmission is worth .02 NOT .1. Even up the indexes and let's race. Seriously, why not?

[bubski]

well put Mike some of those autos that are not as fast as sticks may be so to keep their hp factor safe as their indexes are substantially slower. MAKE EM ALL THE SAME AND LETS GET IT ON.

[acme383]

Originally Posted by mike dahl

randy,

the national records are as follows and i would respectfully submit this is our best barometer for comparing potential performance .

Ss/a 8.78 ss/aa 8.61
ss/b 8.97 ss/ba 8.84
ss/c 9.18 ss/ca 9.00
ss/d 9.28 ss/da 9.12
ss/e 9.48 ss/ea 9.04
ss/f 9.59 ss/fa 9.26
ss/g 9.48 ss/ga 9.53
ss/h 9.74 ss/ha 9.63
ss/i 9.76 ss/ia 9.54
ss/j 9.94 ss/ja 9.93

so, if you remove ss/e & ss/f from the list to create a truer median #, you still have the automatics with a .116/sec advantage, yet there is at least a .1 index advantage for the autos and in some cases .2 really?

I would have done a gt comparison, but there are too many minimums. I suppose it must be because the sticks are so attractive to everyone.

I always hear how if somebody put a stick in their car it would go faster, but clearly the records tell a different tale. I think most people would be sorely disappointed after losing a tenth on the index, losing their radial tires and having the overwhelming joy of learning how to work on their clutches.

P.s. The clutchless tranmission is worth .02 not .1. Even up the indexes and let's race. Seriously, why not?

amen brother!

[randy wilson]

mike, that is all true, but dont you believe that there is 5 times as many autos as there is sticks, a less experianced stick racer is not going to compete with a smart auto racer, also a smart stick racer will kill a dumb auto racer.dont get mad yet, i think most nhra stick racers no way more about it than i do, my question is why can i do an exact back to back test and come up so far off. i dare to say any stock or ss racer running a stick switches to a 2 speed will slow down, im from missouri you may have to show me. also guys, lets take comp records and post them with the 250 lbs. wt. break. that is the true test. when there is no differance in weight or index the true class cars will all be running sticks. eddeyville is going to run some index no-break out stuff this year, autos get a weight break, bring your autos and kick these standard trans guys ***, i will give an auto an extra 100 dollars if they win. there will be 2 clutch cars in the finals.

[randy wilson]

i just went to comp to be sure, i would stay away from those records if you want to continue this discussion. true, some are faster, but average it out and post it, and again that is with a 250 lbs. break running 3 speeds mostly. they are the true test, take away the weight breaks there and see how many autos show up. if you guys are right, im going to loan my powerglide to mike edwards at pamona if he promises to split the winnings with me. should be a wash.

[Pvt Parts]

Try using "same place same day" comparison like class winners/qualifiers at Indy or Gainesville. Most of the heavy hitters are at those races and conditions are the same for everyone.

Most of the SS racers here are missing the real gains with the clutchless gearbox. If you don't have a computer and a clutch you can slide like a torque converter, you'll never see the true potential. The ones who get it right can easily see a tenth.

[Mike Dahl]

There is at least 5 times as many auto cars versus sticks. Why? Do you think it is because autos are more fun to drive? Do you think it is because auto guys do not like to work on their cars? I don't think so.

Remember, this is super stock and we are talking about guys and gals who live and breathe this stuff. Typically, they are highly intelligent, get up early, stay late, defer their retirements, upset their spouses, and sacrifice Christmases sometimes to become King of the Hill. That said, if there was a gain to be had by having a stick, they would have it. But they don't. I have one because it is fun. Period.

Due respect, comparing comp cars and pro stockers to super stock is a bit of a stretch. As well, the ratio of autos versus sticks is lobsided in comp too.

Forgive me, because I almost forgot one little thing. Is it not true that Comp and Pro Stock are allowed 5 speed transmissions? Wanna bet what happens if they limit them to 4?

Conversely, I would modify my opinion greatly if we were allowed a 5 speed.

[Mike Dahl]

Randy,

Remind me again what class you run. Were you the one with the super clean Cobalt with the hood scoop on You Tube? If it is, I would like to have one that looked that nice.