Why did nhra change the cam and valve spring rule in 1985?

[X-TECH MAN]

Billy Nees brought up one more thought.....ENGINE LIFE. Im friends with a very good life long 428 CJ (not noted for long life with stock rods) engine builder and racer. When the valve spring rule was in effect he could run a full year on one engine. Thats was approx 300 runs. Today he said the engines (all brands) when run hard enough to be fast only last about 75 to 90 runs then your on borrowed time. The rings usually go away before that many runs. Wouldnt it be smarter to limit RPMs from a stocker with valve spring pressures rather than making everyone run a diaper to contain the oil and flying parts from an over stressed "stocker" engine?

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

Wouldnt it be smarter to limit RPMs from a stocker with valve spring pressures rather than making everyone run a diaper to contain the oil and flying parts from an over stressed "stocker" engine?

It's got to be a whole lot less expensive to change a set of valve springs than to re-engineer a Stocker so you can fit a diaper or pan on it.
OBTW, in this day and age it's not uncommon for S/G and S/C racers to check their valve spring pressures between time trials and between rounds so what's the big deal getting an NHRA Tech guy to check a few. There are plenty of unexpensive tools in the ND every week to check springs on the engine.

[Casey Miles]

NHRA told the prostock teams "NO EXOTIC MATERIALS IN THE ENGINES" , why is it allowed in stock eliminator? Schubeck lifters are made from an exotic material the last time I looked. You can't buy them at any local auto parts store that I know of.
NHRA doesn't want to do their job on policing rules and for that matter what we pay for from them when we buy our memberships. NHRA is streamlining for their benefit not to have to enforce rules that should have been kept up with, like valve spring pressures. The cars in stock would not be running 1.0 under if the valve spring pressures where set to factory spec. for sure. The valve spring spec on my 302 engine was 96 lbs on the seat and 204 lbs open pressure, no way could you get the motor to 8k rpm. Now, they are changing gears at 8200 rpm.
My vote is to go back to enforcing an across the board valve spring pressure so that you have to use stock (buy in any auto parts store) lifters again.

Casey Miles
248H

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Casey Miles

NHRA told the prostock teams "NO EXOTIC MATERIALS IN THE ENGINES" , why is it allowed in stock eliminator? Schubeck lifters are made from an exotic material the last time I looked. You can't buy them at any local auto parts store that I know of.
NHRA doesn't want to do their job on policing rules and for that matter what we pay for from them when we buy our memberships. NHRA is streamlining for their benefit not to have to enforce rules that should have been kept up with, like valve spring pressures. The cars in stock would not be running 1.0 under if the valve spring pressures where set to factory spec. for sure. The valve spring spec on my 302 engine was 96 lbs on the seat and 204 lbs open pressure, no way could you get the motor to 8k rpm. Now, they are changing gears at 8200 rpm.
My vote is to go back to enforcing an across the board valve spring pressure so that you have to use stock (buy in any auto parts store) lifters again.

Casey Miles
248H

Yepper......But how are you going to get the associations to change that rule? If I was still working the IHRA deal I woud push for it but I know it would be shot down. That would eliminate just about every NHRA car that wanted to cross over and the car counts are low enough already. NHRA would have to mandate it then IHRA would follow the rule change. All one can do is send letters to the powers that control this stuff and complain and try to reason with them about the cost and potential oil downs. With a head off already for a CC check and the valves out for a size check the checking of a couple of valve springs would take only a few moments. Let the stockers keep their crazy overlap and duration specs as that was a pain in the ***** to check.

[Billy Nees]

[QUOTE=X-TECH MAN;195663] That would eliminate just about every NHRA car that wanted to cross over and the car counts are low enough already.

I think that you'll find that NHRA doesn't want Stockers "crossing over" to SS!

[X-TECH MAN]

[QUOTE=Billy Nees;195742]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

That would eliminate just about every NHRA car that wanted to cross over and the car counts are low enough already.

I think that you'll find that NHRA doesn't want Stockers "crossing over" to SS!

I meant if the NHRA stockers wanted to run IHRA stock....... If IHRA changed the valve spring rule to a max seat and open pressure for stock IHRA would loose ALL of the NHRA stockers wishing to race with them unless they ran S/S because of the NEW valve spring pressure rule. .

[Dwight Southerland]

I am with you guys on this one. The current valve spring rule was the most expensive hit NHRA has done to Stock Eliminator racers. I agree with you, Terry, that if they would set a max of say 135-140lbs on the seat and 350 or so at .500" compression the cost of an engine would decrease, the reliability and down-time would increase and the smart guys would have another avenue to snooker people with.

If someone would start a referendum, maybe we could exert some pressure on them. Lots of people would benefit.

[Mark Yacavone]

You guys are forgetting the fact that many of the current crop of racers would have trouble just getting the valve covers off. Forget about monitoring spring pressure.
Not banging on anyone in particular. That's just a fact of life.

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

You guys are forgetting the fact that many of the current crop of racers would have trouble just getting the valve covers off. Forget about monitoring spring pressure.
Not banging on anyone in particular. That's just a fact of life.

Bad memories.... changing a rocker arm SIX times in one weekend in a Super Stocker. I knew when the owner handed me a box full of rockers and instructions on how to change them before sending me on my way that it was going to be a long weekend... LOL

But anyhoo, I agree... get that party started, Mr. Bell! I'm questioning my sanity, but for some silly reason, I've been daydreaming about building a "traditional" Stocker motor for the Volare.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

Bad memories.... changing a rocker arm SIX times in one weekend in a Super Stocker. I knew when the owner handed me a box full of rockers and instructions on how to change them before sending me on my way that it was going to be a long weekend... LOL

But anyhoo, I agree... get that party started, Mr. Bell! I'm questioning my sanity, but for some silly reason, I've been daydreaming about building a "traditional" Stocker motor for the Volare.

I dont have any say so any more. Im afraid its up to the racers to decide what they want and to really push for any changes IF they see someway to reduce the cost of running over a season of racing. Even then the NHRA dosent listen very well. Get used to what you have. I see more oil downs and diapers in your future if you want to remain competitive and be one of the fast guys. .