I'm confused about IHRA's Sportsman friendliness

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by Hagen Gary

How is everyone missing the point? Lets say 16 cars show up in T/S, and 16 in SS. The track pays out $7900 to T/S and $2,300 to SS.

NHRA pays a ton of money to TA/D and TA/FC, too. What's that have to do with S/SS? They are different classes. They have different payouts. Promoters have to make decisions about what they think the show is. If they see no return on investment, then obviously they will change things. While the disparity is not as great, SS and QR also get paid more than Stock, SR, and HR. They are different classes. They have different payouts.

Question is, if there was no T/S, T/D, TA/D, or TA/FC to compare to, would we even be having this discussion? S/SS payouts are not too crazy out of whack in and of themselves. (IHRA actually ends up paying back a higher percentage of the gate than NHRA). Yes, some classes have issues and don't enjoy the support they once did, and the sanctioning bodies have been trying to find the answer to that, if there is one, but just because one doesn't understand the history, why's, and wherefore's of a class and its particulars doesn't mean that it has any bearing on another class. Flip it around. Pay everybody like T/S, and see how long promoters can keep the doors open. It's not about paying SS more, it's about, "can they afford to continue paying TS like they are?"

Kinda glad I'm not in Bradenton. They started eliminations yesterday, and after 4PM today, they're STILL only in Rnd 3 of S/G. Ridiculous.

No Baton Rouge for me, and probably no Gainesville, either. Inundated with work. Skipping Bradenton allowed me to knock a big hole in my workload, but I need one more good week like that to get back to where I can afford to take the *time* to go. 1st Quarter is always my busiest time of year.

[Toby Lang]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

Kinda glad I'm not in Bradenton. They started eliminations yesterday, and after 4PM today, they're STILL only in Rnd 3 of S/G. Ridiculous.

Well, if you're going to run some NHRA events this year, you better get used to it. By my count, there are about 375 cars at Bradenton.

Do you think IHRA would be able to run a doubleheader in two days with 400 cars?


-Toby

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Toby Lang

Well, if you're going to run some NHRA events this year, you better get used to it. By my count, there are about 375 cars at Bradenton.

Do you think IHRA would be able to run a doubleheader in two days with 400 cars?


-Toby

Probably because there would not be any Alky cars on the grounds to keep the track from rusting....LOL.

[Myron Piatek]

Originally Posted by Toby Lang

Well, if you're going to run some NHRA events this year, you better get used to it. By my count, there are about 375 cars at Bradenton.

Do you think IHRA would be able to run a doubleheader in two days with 400 cars?


-Toby

It would be nice if enough cars showed up to put IHRA through the test. But even if it took 3 days, it would still be 2 races in the same time frame as NHRA's one! And, as has been mentioned often, one trip and less entry fees.

[Toby Lang]

You really think they could give two time runs for each event and get it done in three days with 400 cars?

I'm no division director, but that seems a little bit optimistic to me. As you said, it would be nice if they had enough cars to try it!


-Toby

[Rich67stang]

IHRA can handle same amount of cars, 2 time trials on sat and 1 on sun before eliminations each race. So @ the NHRA div this weekend you get there thurs and do not run first round until sunday, and you guys say this is better racing and do not go to IHRA events weeks before. Enjoy! talk about brain washed...wow.

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by Toby Lang

Well, if you're going to run some NHRA events this year, you better get used to it. By my count, there are about 375 cars at Bradenton.

Do you think IHRA would be able to run a doubleheader in two days with 400 cars?

Could they do it with 400? Certainly not. However, 375 - Unleashed (47) - Comp (12) - Top Alky (11) = 305... a far cry from 400.

We average 52 seconds per pair, including downtime. 2 time trials, plus 10 min of cooldown time between each of the last 3 rounds (EVERY class, so we're building in and accounting for an EXTRA 3-1/2 hrs of downtime for cooldown, etc.)
S/ST 44 1hr 48m
S/G 57 2hr 12m
S/C 72 2hr 37m
SS 33 1hr 32m
Stk 43 1hr 48m
TS 23 1hr 12m
TD 32 1hr 25m
--------------------
13 hours

Long day? Yep, but they absolutely could do it. As a matter of fact, they have. Carolina Dragway 2007, 286 cars, Race #1 done in 12hrs (including Jet cars, wheelstanders and other 'show' stuff they booked in), Race #2 (1 time trial) done in 7hrs 45min. (I think 2006 was bigger, but can't find stats) And given *3* days, it not only could be done, but done comfortably.

I announced at the Div. 2 Bracket Finals last year... 400 cars. We ran 5 races in 5 days.

Like Myron said, why doesn't everyone just flood the IHRA events and show them how they "can't" do it. LOL (Please, nobody mention the 2009 World Finals!)

[borninamopar]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

Could they do it with 400? Certainly not. However, 375 - Unleashed (47) - Comp (12) - Top Alky (11) = 305... a far cry from 400.

We average 52 seconds per pair, including downtime. 2 time trials, plus 10 min of cooldown time between each of the last 3 rounds (EVERY class, so we're building in and accounting for an EXTRA 3-1/2 hrs of downtime for cooldown, etc.)
S/ST 44 1hr 48m
S/G 57 2hr 12m
S/C 72 2hr 37m
SS 33 1hr 32m
Stk 43 1hr 48m
TS 23 1hr 12m
TD 32 1hr 25m
--------------------
13 hours

Long day? Yep, but they absolutely could do it. As a matter of fact, they have. Carolina Dragway 2007, 286 cars, Race #1 done in 12hrs (including Jet cars, wheelstanders and other 'show' stuff they booked in), Race #2 (1 time trial) done in 7hrs 45min. (I think 2006 was bigger, but can't find stats) And given *3* days, it not only could be done, but done comfortably.

I announced at the Div. 2 Bracket Finals last year... 400 cars. We ran 5 races in 5 days.

Like Myron said, why doesn't everyone just flood the IHRA events and show them how they "can't" do it. LOL (Please, nobody mention the 2009 World Finals!)

Come to Capital City Dragway Friday and see how many cars go down the track, over three days. I don't think they ever hurt for car count.

[Toby Lang]

Michael,

My initial reply to you was in response to your saying it was ridiculous how they were only in the 3rd round of SG at 4PM. One reason for that is they ran behind schedule on Saturday so they postponed the first round of eliminations for the index classes until Sunday morning.

Using your formula, how long should it take to run 375 cars with each class getting four time runs except for Stock and Super Stock which got three? My rough guess says about 21-22 hours. Probably a lot more when you take into consideration how long it takes to run the Alcohol cars sometimes. For instance, on Sunday DRC posted the first round winners of TS at 12:54 PM. The next class was TAD. Their first round of eliminations was posted at 2:24 PM.

From what I can tell on DRC, they completed the race in about 27 hours. That isn't too bad, is it? Also, the more cars you have the more likely it is that you will run behind schedule, right?

I haven't been to too many NHRA races that weren't running behind schedule. Like I said before, if you plan on running NHRA, running behind schedule is par for the course.


-Toby

[Hagen Gary]

I guess it’s my fault for bringing this subject up under IHRA. You loyalist are so amped up to protect IHRA, that you confuse the issue. I just thought it might be an interesting point to bring up about how unfair the payout structure is at what is suppose to be a National Event. Like I said before, I expect my friends to be fair to me. This S#!t ain't fair no matter how you slice it. I said alot of things in this thread that apparently some people have a hard time comprehending, cuz they keep on making ignorant comments like "go build a T/S car." How is that constructive?

Its the Legendary Hagen Gary! He talks ****, hates IHRA and complains about everything. I think if you looked into me (I use my real name) you would know that’s not the case. God forbid I bring up one thing I feel is unfair to every S/SS and .90 car. Some dude is going to sit on his computer and judge my intentions when he aint got a clue who I am, or how much I have supported IHRA. It’s not about the money, It’s about the morality of two classes taking home 3 times as much as any comparable class.

Do you think I would come on this forum and air this out if I didn't have firsthand knowledge of Scooter hearing this very argument over a year ago? I guess so, cuz its on classracer with all the keyboard racers. He provided the same reasoning I have heard here. He needs more cars. Well, they aint coming with this payout a year and a half later.

Next time I'll name the thread "The evil NHRA policies spill over to poor ole IHRA" I might get some support on pure emotion. I believe that if you offer more money to be won, you will get people to tow from further away, which will lead to more cars. I'm not saying do it for divisional races, But this thread is about the payout for The Mardi Gras National! Fairness People, that’s all I'm asking. I'll park way in the back and let a T/S car have his 40ft of asphalt for a car whose doors come off. But this payout structure is out of control. It caters to two classes leaving the rest of us showing up because its in the neighborhood. IHRA is doing exactly opposite of what I think they should do to attract more cars from NHRA at a time that’s right for the picking. Offer more money! If you build it, they will come. How is everyone so excited about all of the combo races when they don't even have the tech that IHRA has? Its because of the money goof ball.