New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

Great answer Greg. Daryl, the winning of a race is a great goal. For most of us, it dosent happen that often. If your only goal is winning the race and nothing but total victory is unacceptable, you will be dissapointed more often than not. The idea of racing stock, compared to pro ET, or bracket 2 is that we can work on our cars and it means something. If you find a tenth, it can be a competive advantage, bragging rights, or personal pride.

With the brand new cars that are coming in, and the performance they have just started to show we are all in trouble. I'll still race, work on my car, and enjoy the people we race with. When it comes time to go heads up with these new cars, our chances of winning are slim. Like a Sherman tank trying to stop a Tiger tank.

Originally Posted by Greg Hill

To some of us being able to compete for class at Indy is important , having a fast car is something we strive for and work for and spend money on. Ask Bruce Parsons how much time I've spent on his Dyno. I realize that's not what's important to some folks who race stock but it is to me and most of the older guys. The difference between how fast your car is and how fast my car is could be narrowed considerably if you chose to do so. The difference between how fast my car is and the new Mustang or Challenger is a half a second and there is nothing I can do to change that because the hp ratings for those cars are so soft. What got me to thinking about starting this thread was the fact that this winter I have to freshen up Andrew's motor and I was going to do some work on mine to try and make it faster. Should I spend several thousand dollars to try and make our cars go faster or should I just leave mine alone and put rings and bearings in Andrew's car? I'll probably spend the money and see if I cand squeeze a few more hundredths out of our old cars, but I realize it's probably a waste of time and money. In the end I get some satisfaction out of seeing how fast we can make our cars run.

If they were a couple of tenths away, it wouldn't be the end of the world. Most of them are .50 to 1.00 faster than us in bracket mode. That's what can be discouraging.

[442OLDS]

Originally Posted by Kevin Zaskowski

Greg, if you entered Indy you had a great shot at winning class, especially if you raced Andrew's car in "D". You would have had us all covered by at least 2 tenths, even the Mustang.

Andrew had a great season and will probably end up finishing second in Division 3.
Congratulations!

He might have been able to WIN the Division Championship,but he lost a key fourth round heads up race and it wasn't to a new car!


Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed-----Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
339L Randi Lyn Shipp 3207 Andrew Hill
E4 ****WINNER**** 0.066 10.537 121.64 0.055 10.664 115.91
D/SA Dial: 11.55 (+/-): -1.013 D/SA Dial: 11.55 (+/-): -0.886
Prior rounds:
E3 (T Gillespie ) 0.079 10.821 0.121 (K Zaskowski ) 0.010 10.788 0.038
E2 (B Bishop ) 0.020 11.262 0.602 (A Fernstrum ) 0.001 10.710 0.030
E1 (N Botten ) 0.100 10.656 -0.004 (E Buth ) 0.019 10.694 0.034
Qualified: #8 10.620 -0.930 #12 10.634 -0.916
Heads-up! Shipp will face Anderson in the next round.

[sammy pizzolato]

the answer is that nhra had it fixed with the fuelinfected cars in there own class like ihra has it. put it back like it was and problem will be solved.then the fuelinfected cars can beat up each other and everybody will be happy again!!!!!!

[Michael Colaluca]

Originally Posted by sammy pizzolato

the answer is that nhra had it fixed with the fuelinfected cars in there own class like ihra has it. put it back like it was and problem will be solved.then the fuelinfected cars can beat up each other and everybody will be happy again!!!!!!

I dont have a problem with the fuel injected cars anymore, just the "super cars." Give them their own class and the problem will be solved.

[Andrew Hill]

Originally Posted by 442OLDS

Andrew had a great season and will probably end up finishing second in Division 3.
Congratulations!

Thanks! I wish I could have made it a few more rounds to win it, but I'll get more chances.

He might have been able to WIN the Division Championship,but he lost a key fourth round heads up race and it wasn't to a new car!


Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed-----Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
339L Randi Lyn Shipp 3207 Andrew Hill
E4 ****WINNER**** 0.066 10.537 121.64 0.055 10.664 115.91
D/SA Dial: 11.55 (+/-): -1.013 D/SA Dial: 11.55 (+/-): -0.886
Prior rounds:
E3 (T Gillespie ) 0.079 10.821 0.121 (K Zaskowski ) 0.010 10.788 0.038
E2 (B Bishop ) 0.020 11.262 0.602 (A Fernstrum ) 0.001 10.710 0.030
E1 (N Botten ) 0.100 10.656 -0.004 (E Buth ) 0.019 10.694 0.034
Qualified: #8 10.620 -0.930 #12 10.634 -0.916
Heads-up! Shipp will face Anderson in the next round.

This is exactly why Stock Eliminator is so cool, Randi Lynn and I raced at the Indy points race and I won. They went to work, and in Chicago, she beat me. Since then we have worked on my car, and I think it would be a really good race now. It's not just about the round win, it's a hell of a lot of fun winning a heads up against one of the fastest (real) D cars in the country.

Kevin, I'm the same way. I go to every race with the intention of winning, and I believe I can win every race I go to, but winning class or a tough heads up is a huge part of racing Stock too.

[boster]

I agree with Greg Hill let everbody go fast old and new . Great post Greg

[Jeff Lee]

Roll back the HP & weight on the older cars.
No new classes. NHRA will never buy into it.
I do think they would give some consideration to a HP roll back to make the older cars more competitive.
This may not be the ultimate solution that would make everybody happy (is that really possible?) but there's no way NHRA is going to penalize the new Super Cars outside of the confines of the AHFS.

[BadBanana]

NO MATTER WHAT IDEA YOU COME UP WITH IT WILL HELP SOME AND HURT SOME - UNAVOIDABLE.

If I were "King" I would have NHRA:
1.) Become much more proactive in the HP factoring game, especially the newer hi -tech engines;
2.) I would have LESS classes to promote more class racing by using 1 lb. weight breaks; and allowing everyone to add or remove MORE weight to make the newer weight breaks; and
3.) Once the hp factors are in-line, lower the indexes by about .75 sec., so that it takes a decent car to run on or below the index.
But I'm not sure that idea would be very popular with the masses.

..................at least that would make me interested in racing again......................and "yes", I agree about having 7.0 and maybe 7.5 SS/GT weight breaks.

One thing that I never agreed with was how NHRA took the factory hot rod engines (the older ones), that we all aspired to buy and race, and made them totally uncompetitive, Why did most of the tri-power 348's, 409s, 413 and 426 wedges, 406 Fords, etc.go by the wayside (except for nostalgia racing) and become less favorable than a 255hp/350 Chevy to race??? An engine that wasn't what we went to the dealership back in the 60s to purchase because it was such a powerhouse. By comparison some of those factory hot rod combos should have been de-factored because their factory hp rating was due to camshafts, etc. which , at least in S/S can be changed anyway....and in Stock the available cam profiles can really turn on these engines which came with poor camming.
but that's just me, an old racer, speaking !!

[CaptCobrajet]

I agree with Rusty and Tom. NHRA should reinstate the Fuel Injected classes, and combine the sticks and autos. That would keep the number of classes the same and separate the new cars from anything that has a carb in a heads up situation.

People who earn a living building carbed engines are in the same boat with the racers. I have spent my whole life learning how to make a carb work on an old engine. I'm not too interested in learning a new trade at this point. If the carbed cars are forced out, those guys have no place to run their cars, and a guy like me is out of a job. Let the laptop guys race each other with their keyboards, and the carb guys can do mechanical changes. Then, everyone could race cars with the same tools as the guy they are racing when it comes to a heads-up run. Injected engines can tune themselves to some extent because of the O2 sensors, so they should absolutely be separated from carbs...........and blower cars should be separated from other injected cars.

Blair Patrick 2425