Cheating [2-step And Buttons]

[Kandra Villani]

Beth: Lane's car, which I was fortunate to drive again and technically blow it up for him, since his first pass the following race (ET Finals) was where the bearing siezed on him, has the button on the brake pedal, up in the top, and is activated ONLY in low gear, the chances of hitting it on the top end are nil, but his car can finally stall at 3200 rpm, when I drove the car in 1997, I had to 2 foot it and the MOST stall we ever got was around 1800 rpm. The 2 step helped with some ET for him, and yes consistancy. He's battled the index (being about .25 under at the most) since 1997, the 2 tenths they are taking away puts him back on the index, taking away his 2 step will ensure he can't run the index. His combo is a difficult one, but because there is ONE other car that threw a lot of $$$ at it, he can't seem to catch a break. Sad, he's TRULY one of the FINEST most talented racers, and most oft NOT mentioned when talking about some of the "hitters" there is. It will be sad to not have him in Stock anymore.

Kandra

[Beth Denysenko]

Anything that will drive people away from this sport is sad. This two step issue seems to hurt more than it will help. Will people stop racing if they stay? No. Will people stop racing if they take them away. Possibly. So, where is the benefit? We will get to a point that only touring pros can compete. Can afford to and have the skills to compete and win against one another. It will be mini-pro stock. Same folks racing, just a little different outcome every race. Maybe racer A wins this week, racer B next week, but they both always qualify. Racer C, not a chance. Yawn.

Let's agree stock is no longer that and hasn't been for a while. Best thing would be to throw everything out and re-factor every single combination. Yes, those argue "well, you picked your combination, pick a different one." And that's not so easy (or cheap) either. But let's keep the minor advantage I and other's have against the "guys that have always won will always win". Might be the difference even once or twice. I got a taste of winning a few rounds this past weekend and it was kinda fun!

[Jason Oldfield]

I've been watching this thread for a while, and am finally ready to chime in. Let me qualify my comments here by stating that I do not have a horse in this race, so the outcome doesn't affect me directly at all, and that I can feel for you low-budget racers (I'm one myself, just in a different category).

My personal opinion is that this is Stock Eliminator, and that Stock should mean Stock. No buttons, no two-steps, no wheelie bars, etc. What's that? Your stocker is too fast and without wheelie bars you'll scrape the bumper and risk damage and bodily injury? Well, then maybe it's time to slow that bad-boy down.

Now, I realize that two-steps and buttons may even the playing field against the top drivers. My response to that is, GO PRACTICE! And yes, I do race in a category where throttle stops and delay boxes are allowed. My wish however would be that NHRA eliminate all of them from the .90 classes. This would make it so that the best DRIVER and/or tuner would generally win more often. I may not be the best, and if I lose because of it, so be it. I need to go make myself a better driver then.

In the meantime, I use these devices because they are legal, and I'm certainly not going to show up with a knife at a gunfight.

Side Note: Elimination of throttle stops would also have an added affect of reducing the cost to compete because people would no longer have the need to build 1000+ hp motors simply to slow them down to run 9.90 at 170mph. But, this is a topic for another day, in another forum.

Also, I think the elimination of classes as a whole will be a good thing from a spectator point of view. Because you're going to have more cars in a class, that's going to mean more heads-up racing, which EVERYONE likes to watch. Yes, the .90 classes are heads-up, but it's not a no breakout, first one to the finish line class, and as such the spectators RUN from the stands when we come up to compete. All one has to do is look at the popularity of ALL the heads-up classes (the NHRA and IHRA Pros, NMRA, NMCA, ADRL, the Nostalgia drag racing craze, and probably the biggest one of all, Pinks) to see that spectators don't want to watch a bracket race (go to your local track on a Saturday night and take a look in the stands to count all 10 people there). So, elimination of classes will not only create more heads-up races in final eliminations, but in class eliminations as well. The less boring singles to watch a guy "win" class, the better IMHO.

Anyway, by eliminating classes there will be downsides, especially the fact that I think the cost to compete will go up. On the positive side, it's bound to make the racing more interesting for the spectators, which can have nothing but a positive effect on the class overall (maybe not immediately, but over time I would think more money would filter in through more sponsor interest).

All that said, the pessimist in me wonders if NHRA isn't looking at the combination of classes simply to cut down on their expenses. I don't know at how many events Class Eliminations are contested, but less classes means less winners, which means fewer trophies and less payout overall (wouldn't the index adjustment possibly affect this as well, since I'm assuming you'll still have to run at least 5-tenths under to qualify for a class win with a single.) But, maybe that's just me being a glass is half empty type of guy.

Let the flaming of the .90 racer begin!

[Mike Mayhew]

I've said for years that the .90 classes could become fun to watch, and a fun class to get in to if they would do one thing....ELIMINATE THROTTLE STOPS. To a lesser extent delay boxes, but the stops is what REALLY aggravates the crap out of people.
I've said the two most aggravating sound in sports is an aluminum bat, and a throttle stop on a racecar.

Just think of the tuning and driving you'd have to do without a stop. The fun returns, the fans return, some, and the scary speeds go down.
Ok, back to S/SS

[tpoh815]

here is my take, the people who are complaining about the two steps may get his or her wish as to someday no 2 steps, buttons, etc. etc. mark my words, the great racers who are using these "non stock" devices . biondos, fletcher, zane, stillings just to name a few. ( remember these names cause it will be easier to remember in years to come), these guys names will be on top as long as they race! i dont care what you take away,they will adapt. and i wont have to prove you all wrong. ill bet my last broke *** dollar!
anyone want to bet me? place your bets now i could use the easy $$$. also this does not mean im taking anything away from the footbrakers.nothing but respect here. besides i use a two step and if i cant win $ this way, maybe i can make it on my proposal.anyone want in?? peace mike h

[tgriffith]

...

Hey Mike,

Hope you are doing well.....I think everyone is missing the point on getting rid of Two-steps..
They all think its about the guys winning all the time, their wrong its about electronics/buttons in Stock..I agree the same people will keep winning, they get much more sit time and practice more and are just plain better drivers...It gets real old hearing that there is no-advantage to two-steps, then why do we need them ? Its like the fast car doesn't have an advantage...Yes, its a rare thing when a K on down car wins,but those are choices we all make based on many things..I think NHRA has made a good first step this week, anyway time will tell...You know its interesting that local tracks have gotten rid of two-steps and no-box brackets ? See yah at the races... Dave...1033/stock (350)

[The Hawk]

First off,thanks for the kind words Kandra. Most of what you mentioned regarding the Buick is correct,the stall the car had without the 2 step would go to about 3300 and start rolling. I`ve seen so many people post here saying that this is stock,these cars didn`t come with 2 steps,get rid of `em and make this a foot brake class again. That`s the least of what should be brought up concerning these cars to be called "stock". You show me a late model Firebird that came with a TH200 tranny,so quit saying "this is stock",cause that`s a bull**** reason. What about the $5000 sets of heads that are out there? That sounds awfully high for something that`s "stock". It was mentioned that a lot of racers could run a lower classed car and do well as opposed to buiding a higher classed car,most people like to do the chasing. Don`t forget,Scotty Richardson did extremely well with an O/SA car for a while about 10 years ago. Finally,I don`t know how it`s figured that slow racers are leaving off of the second bulb,or whatever,but I`ve always left on the last amber,with everything from 15 second cars to 21 second cars(deep staging was required for the real slow stuff). I don`t follow the tree down,I stare at the last bulb. NHRA`s decision to do this has come at a perfect time,I need a new motor,so the Skyhawk will get a bracket motor for for now,and maybe in a few years,I`ll come back. They can keep the $250 entry fee a will lose since I had to withdraw from the Mile Highs,maybe go to Starbucks and buy the Saftey Safari a round of coffee. I`m done. It`s been real. "The Hawk"

[Fred Suiter]

Another perspective on the 2-step:

One of my life long dreams was to race in NHRA Stock class. When I started in 2002, I was already in my early 60's. I tried footbrake racing for about a year and soon discovered that my reflexes were slow and I was inconsistent. I was an easy target, 1 or 2 rounds and out. My son suggested I try a 2-step button on the shifter. This changed my racing career. I could be competetive, give you a good race, have fun and go 3 or 4 rounds. This helped me level the playing field.
Most of you are younger (50's or less) and had previous experience footbraking. I experienced, and maybe some of you will find later in life your physical and mental skills will slow down. As one racer put it, "the only electronics affecting the launch of the car is the wiring to your brain". My wiring seems OK but the transmission of the signal and the response (releasing the footbrake) has slowed. In my case, eliminating the 2-step probably would make me an easy target, take the fun out of racing for me and definitely not level the playing field.

[Jim Bailey]

I believe some racers are missing the point. The problem is not an RPM limiting aid know as the Two Step. The real problem is that that nearly every, if not all, cheating devices, currently available, are accurately activated by a hand released button. These delay boxes, event timers, etc. are cleverly hidden, with the same color wires and disguised as Two Step Modules, Retards, etc. It is impossible for NHRA, IHRA, or anybody to police this stuff. Therefore, you eliminate the the cause, you eliminate the effect.

Let's all say a quick prayer for John Force,his teams, and his family, they've been though just about enough this season.