Make Divisionals Great Again

[Bobby Fazio]

Originally Posted by Keith 944

Why are we concerned about bringing in spectators???? We pay a good amount to race.

Because without them we'll have to keep paying gooder amounts of money to race while the tracks, contingency money, track/title sponsors, midway will continue to disappear- while operation costs will continue to rise. The fact that racers don't recognize this kind of scares me.

Originally Posted by Keith 944

If nhra and track’s want more than what we pay then they need to step up and promote.

There seems to be a real disconnect between tracks and NHRA when it comes to these divisionals. I don't think NHRA is inclined to promote the event and may be content getting their cut and operating certain aspects of the race. Their business model might be working just fine on their end. All tracks have slightly different deals with NHRA and it is up to their negotiation skills. Some may have a bad deal in place, or maybe an old deal. It is probably safe to say that the more they take in at a divisional, the more they shell over to NHRA and they may not feel it is even worth gambling on promotions/entertainment and would rather play it safe so as not to lose any money if it flops.

Originally Posted by Keith 944

They are laughing their asses off reading our divided arguments and personal agendas

Anyone reading 1320's post is either laughing their asses off or is confused as all hell. Yes there are a lot of wasted keystrokes on this thread by people offering nothing aside from "nothing will ever be good and that is never was."

[1320racer]

you can count on it!

"nothing will ever be good and that is never was" and specifically Divisionals will never be great again if your definition of great is spectators in the stands and a manufacturer's midway and Bobby fyi, I was with a racer yesterday that you have previously interview who has been reading this thread and he was laughing at YOU and agreed with me 100% that spectators ain't ever coming and divisionals will never be great again according to your definition.

[Steve Stasko]

Originally Posted by Bobby Fazio

Because without them we'll have to keep paying gooder amounts of money to race while the tracks, contingency money, track/title sponsors, midway will continue to disappear- while operation costs will continue to rise. The fact that racers don't recognize this kind of scares me.



There seems to be a real disconnect between tracks and NHRA when it comes to these divisionals. I don't think NHRA is inclined to promote the event and may be content getting their cut and operating certain aspects of the race. Their business model might be working just fine on their end. All tracks have slightly different deals with NHRA and it is up to their negotiation skills. Some may have a bad deal in place, or maybe an old deal. It is probably safe to say that the more they take in at a divisional, the more they shell over to NHRA and they may not feel it is even worth gambling on promotions/entertainment and would rather play it safe so as not to lose any money if it flops.

So do we want spectators or not? In the first paragraph you're trying to sell us on the need for spectators to offset costs. In the second, you're trying to tell us that the tracks don't want spectators because of increased cost.

[1320racer]

forget the spectators that aren't ever coming our concern should be if we keep losing tracks, there's less tracks willing to lose money to host divisionals and entries will continue to increase while payouts remain stuck in the 90s and contingency sponsors continue to leave the program. Take D1, the very real possibility exist that we could lose 2 tracks over the next 10 years.

I disagree with some of your post Ed
We cannot go this on race cars alone. Promoters need money back in the pocket. That offsets what we have to pay ! All one has to do is look at what you pay, the number of entries and what it costs a track to put on an event. It cannot be a loosing proposition or break even. That means they need to advertise and get sponsors. I personally don’t want to pay more to race! We aren’t racing for the money for gods sake. Everything has gone up except for the payout. Yes we had a small increase but so did your entry!

And then there’s some raceway's that charge an astronomical amount of money to host an event because they can. The California Syndrome!

[1320racer]

disagree all you want but you can't prove me wrong. Go pitch all your ideas to your track owners and see where that gets you.

again, host tracks are not going to throw good money after bad in an attempt to lure spectators that don't exist for what we do.

What we do is not a spectator sport. Further, it's boring to watch and most don't understand it and worse think it's stupid watching handicap starts no mind throttle stop racing.

The general public knows drag racing to be 2 cars line up, leave at the same time and the first to the finish line wins. They're loud and fast, do long smokey burnouts, have flames coming out the pipes and sometimes have spectacular crashes That is a spectator sport, that's what they come to see and that's why the Street Outlaw/NPK races PACK the bleachers at every track they compete at while collectively selling 6 figures worth of merchandise at every event.

Originally Posted by 1320racer

disagree all you want but you can't prove me wrong. Go pitch all your ideas to your track owners and see where that gets you.

again, host tracks are not going to throw good money after bad in an attempt to lure spectators that don't exist for what we do.

What we do is not a spectator sport. Further, it's boring to watch and most don't understand it and worse think it's stupid watching handicap starts no mind throttle stop racing.

The general public knows drag racing to be 2 cars line up, leave at the same time and the first to the finish line wins. Their loud, have flames coming out the pipes and sometimes have spectacular crashes That is a spectator sport, that's what they come to see and that's why the Street Outlaw/NPK races PACK the bleachers at every track they compete at while collectively selling 6 figures worth of merchandise at every event.

I know two young men very well that had a vision for drag racing and set the standard for Big bucks racing. One has since passed ( god speed brother) So don’t tell us it cannot be done ! Doomsday posts don’t do anything for the issue. You can be Be part of the solution or part of the problem. But I already know the answer so go ahead.

[1320racer]

Barry, as I stated you can't prove me wrong. Peter and Kyle had a vision for big $ bracket racing which is not NHRA class/divisional racing and also doesn't draw spectators other than bracket racers watching on Motormania TV and they can watch from their home, office, car, beach, etc. and it costs them nothing to do so. You offer nothing that is a real viable solution to put spectators in the stands at a divisional because there is no solution for fans that don't exist for what we do.

[BKSG1198]

This thread really brings me back to a few years back with the YB Nationals at Cecil, now granted it's a different breed of racers (Pro Mod, 10.5 Outlaw, Etc), the event was huge but was growing so big that they couldn't finish the 600+ cars in a weekend if they had weather issues and the sportsman were being pushed to late Sunday Night / Monday morning. The promoter and track decided that those classes were going to be a pre-register only for the next year taking 40 and qualifying 32, of course it filled quickly just like a NE does but those who didn't make it made the argument that they bring all the spectators in, the fans come to see them only (Not Pro Mods or 10.5 outlaw) so they decided to form their own race at Maple Grove (8.50, 10.00, 11.50.Pro Dial) on the same weekend and it was a huge bust but, YB was packed that weekend proving their theory wrong. The event has gone back to its regular format now but, I think it proves that as much as we argue on here about .90 cars, Juniors, Stock/SS we have to realize WE ARE NOT THE SHOW and never will be, we are fillers. I know that will hurt people's feelings, I'm sure I will get tomato's thrown at me next year but, we have to face the facts.

The most successful Divisionals on paper have a show associated with them, Norwalk D3 race, New England D1 Race, Sometimes Maple Grove D1 race in May but, only the diehard people want to come at 9am in the morning to watch the sportsman, it's like going to a sporting event, they want to be entertained for 3-5 hours at the most, not 12 hours and they want to get the best bang for their dollar, it has to be a show (Pro Mods, Wheel standers, Alky Cars, Jet Cars, Fireworks) but that also comes at a cost, these special event cars are not racing for free, I helped out at MG before Kyle bought it with some of the previous employees and can tell you - Jet Cars $1,000 - $2,000 per car to make two passes, they get paid if they make a run or not (weather, etc).

Let's also think why did the entry fees for D1 races go up from $200 to $225 in 2023? The reason is because the track owners told NHRA they aren't making any money at these Divisional races...I can tell you we're glad it was ONLY $25 increase because it was on the table to be much more.

Also, for those of you who think I haven't beaten this drum before with a DD - here is an e-mail to Bob Lang from 2011 about the same topic we are talking about 12 years later in which I was told he's brought this up at the D1 meeting in January in 2012...did it happen, only track owners at that time would know...

From: Rob Keister
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 3:11 PM
To: Bob Lang
Subject: Quick Question

Dear Bob,

The reason for my e-mail is a recent discussion I had with some racers. A few racers came to me regarding this issue since I help out Lucky with MASGA and I’m also the President of the Super Comp Series. The discussion that was brought up was about how can we promote sportsman racing better and get more fans to a Lucas Oil Series Races. I know at a few tracks this year they did a special promotion for fans such as Carloads for $25.00 at Maple Grove, Atco had a special “Buy 1, Get 1 ½ off” on Saturday and so forth. The real only good turn-out seemed to be at Epping where you had 10,000 people show up for the race on Saturday Night. Not saying the other promotions were a flop for the track owners but, I don’t think it was the turnout they were looking for. I know from a fan and racer aspect the promotions seemed to be announced on a Monday or Tuesday before the event and many fans were already committed to other things on the weekend. I know I handed out about 15 of the coupons at my office for the Atco Race but, most of the people already had something going on that weekend.

As a promoter myself I know how it’s hard to get people to come to a race when the economy is in the toilet and people are more worried about putting a meal on the table rather than spending the day at the track but, you give them a deal in advance they may just come check it out. What I was wondering is if we could put something together for 2012 as in a division 1 marketing program. I know Gary from PC Richard & the Alessi’s normally have their rigs at the track a few days in advance of a Lucas Oil Event and if we could set something up like NASCAR does at a local Wal-Mart, PC Richards, Etc with the cars out for people to see and look at I think people might get interested in coming to see them. I know I’ve looked over Gary’s Mustang a few times and I think people would see that car and be like “This car, which looks like my street cars…run’s what??” Maybe offer up discounted tickets at these events to people with a “See these cars and many more at Atco Raceway August 5th to 7th”. Or maybe do something similar to what NHRA did this year with the 60th anniversary “walk the track program” get someone like Manzo or Kosky to walk Atco with their memories of running at the track. Last but, not least maybe go around and visit automotive technical schools or automotive dealerships in the areas with cars and discounted tickets.

I don’t see much new blood in the series due to cost and not understanding the classes. Like why does a Super Gas car leave the line then fall on its face and take back off? Maybe have a few racers at the local dealerships explain how the classes work and what a throttle stop does and why when Stock or Super Stock come up it was 10.50 on the scoreboard but, he runs 9.40…I don’t get it?

Rob Keister
1198 S/G

Here also is some pics from NHRA TV of the Norwalk D3 race, the less filled stands are when the sportsman (Stock/SS, .90) are running and the filled stands are when Alky, PM, etc are running....yes they did run R1 od SC & SS in between Alky with the stands somewhat full but, like anything else unless you go to the bathroom or want to grab food, you don't want to miss the action.

[GTS340]

As long as there are fans there. feel free to watch what you want. Back in the stone age before Jeg's and Summit. There were local speedshops promoting up and coming races. Radio channels giving free tickets from sponsors. GREAT FOOD! Entertainment for little future racers. Sorry but wheel standers and jet cars make good advertizing. Get enough folks there. Maybe the bathrooms will be to busy and the fans can watch the real show.

Paul