AHFS at Indy?

[KRatcliff]

Originally Posted by james schaechter

As far as indexes go, I agree there are some really soft ones. Whenever anyone mentions dropping the index it is met with a lot of resistance from folks that will be impacted.

Are there really that many soft indexes or are there a few soft factored cars within a given index? I am trying to wrap my head around how simply lowering indexes accomplishes much because it is proportional.

All cars within that index now run under a lower one. Just like what happened a few years ago. What am I missing?

Say you lower it another .30 All you end up doing is lowering the index and the few cars that are within that .30 can't compete, but it does nothing towards addressing soft combo. Of course, I could be missing something so I am listening.

[Jeff Dona SS3269]

Originally Posted by KRatcliff

Are there really that many soft indexes or are there a few soft factored cars within a given index? I am trying to wrap my head around how simply lowering indexes accomplishes much because it is proportional.

All cars within that index now run under a lower one. Just like what happened a few years ago. What am I missing?

Say you lower it another .30 All you end up doing is lowering the index and the few cars that are within that .30 can't compete, but it does nothing towards addressing soft combo. Of course, I could be missing something so I am listening.

It?s been roughly 15 years since the last index and AHFS adjustment rule changes better accepted parts ,R&D have made anyone working on their stuff faster making easier to run .85 under and that?s all you have to avg to get HP along with 2 sec under triggers . If we leave the indexes or the .85 avg numbers the same we will keep putting weight in our cars . I?ll use the 255 that got instant HP on Monday as an example that combo has been race for 56 years did it really need that much power obviously he spent good money bought the best he could buy and was in great conditions and now everyone that has that combo that chose not to buy the best stuff and I totally understand that got their combo pretty much destroyed in one run. We also just watched a heads up final in stock at a track that?s not known for being fast if that race happens at Gainesville they are both probably getting Hp on Monday and not just 5 enough to move a class. At some point either the AHFS numbers need adjusted or adjust the indexes and leave the AHFS numbers the same . Like Andrew said in his post 91 stockers were a sec under at Indy not Gainesville . The last adjustment we took a .30 hit and the trigger went from 1.15 to 1.0 I do not recall what the avg was . This gave everyone a little cushion the guy on a budget wasn?t get hp from someone that?s buying the latest greatest stuff we are there again.

[Mike Pearson]

As I remember about a year ago they polled the racers and it was overwhelming voted to keep the indexes the same and make the corrections with the AHFS. Lowering the index does nothing to improve parity in the classes. Only hurts the guys at the bottom of the sheet. Car counts are not what they used to be. Lowering the indexes will not bring more cars to the track. Fast guys have the choice to run all out or hold back. If you are racing a combo that can run way under including under the trigger then you could get a hit at any time. Realistically there was very few HP hits at the end of the season last year.

[SDT1DYI]

How about having two different classes for the same combo in Stock Eliminator.
Example would be 1 G/SA class has an index of 12.00 the other lower. Say 11.00 (for easy math). The 11.00 index car carry a unique letter designation.
All the same current rules applied to both cars.
If both cars have a heads up, its a dial race.
If a 11.0 index G/SA car races another same index car , its no dial , same for two 12.00 index cars.
Ladders are based on runs under you class index.
Call the class what ever you want, make the lower index 1. Under, .8 under. .5 under.
But this way the really fast guys can keep it matted and race each other without getting Horse Powered on Monday.
The guys that chose not to run with the lower index CAN and race a fast index same combo in a non heads up round.
Problem Solved ( well almost lol)
AHFS will never accomplish what NHRA intend it to .

Steve Teeter Stk/SS 620/7888

[Lyn Smith]

Originally Posted by Mike Pearson

As I remember about a year ago they polled the racers and it was overwhelming voted to keep the indexes the same and make the corrections with the AHFS. Lowering the index does nothing to improve parity in the classes. Only hurts the guys at the bottom of the sheet. Car counts are not what they used to be. Lowering the indexes will not bring more cars to the track. Fast guys have the choice to run all out or hold back. If you are racing a combo that can run way under including under the trigger then you could get a hit at any time. Realistically there was very few HP hits at the end of the season last year.

Our SCRA rep told me that very few racers in StK and SS even voted on the index change.

[L.Fite]

At some point indexes will have to change or combos will have to move classes...
There is only so much weight that can be added...
(Per RULES and/or LOGIC)... If that matters....

[Mike Pearson]

Originally Posted by Lyn Smith

Our SCRA rep told me that very few racers in StK and SS even voted on the index change.

I don?t think they published the exact amount of racers that voted but did tell us the the majority voted to keep the index?s as they were.

[Cglrcng]

Looking at the Indy Stock/Super Stock entry list currently it is 153 (3 over Quota Stk/150 Quota in S.S.), and looks to be a bad fast and quite competitive field vying for those 128 Qualifying spots to race field after Class, so it did not scare away many (the AHFS back on at Indy again), that want to race in the NHRA 2025 Indy Big Go Show!

There are a few in some classes that were fastest of the fast missing that raced last year when it was off, nobody but them knows if they even had plans to attend this year or not. Even AHFS back on the over quota shows the interest in class racing is healthy and its predicted by many demise is a fallacy often repeated. The field may be graying but isn't going away anytime soon. Go get those Wally's boys and girls (or shall I say in most cases Ladies and Gents!)

Those trophies will not say AHFS on or off. They will just say 2025 Indy Class Champion, and Event Winner! And those memories last a lifetime.

[Bryan Worner]

We need personal hp factoring in Stock and Super Stock! They do it in Comp, why can?t it be done in Stock and Super Stock? We have Nitro Joes stats and now Draginsights.com to provide all the data needed!

[KRatcliff]

Originally Posted by Jeff Dona SS3269

It?s been roughly 15 years since the last index and AHFS adjustment rule changes better accepted parts ,R&D have made anyone working on their stuff faster making easier to run .85 under and that?s all you have to avg to get HP along with 2 sec under triggers . If we leave the indexes or the .85 avg numbers the same we will keep putting weight in our cars . I?ll use the 255 that got instant HP on Monday as an example that combo has been race for 56 years did it really need that much power obviously he spent good money bought the best he could buy and was in great conditions and now everyone that has that combo that chose not to buy the best stuff and I totally understand that got their combo pretty much destroyed in one run. We also just watched a heads up final in stock at a track that?s not known for being fast if that race happens at Gainesville they are both probably getting Hp on Monday and not just 5 enough to move a class. At some point either the AHFS numbers need adjusted or adjust the indexes and leave the AHFS numbers the same . Like Andrew said in his post 91 stockers were a sec under at Indy not Gainesville . The last adjustment we took a .30 hit and the trigger went from 1.15 to 1.0 I do not recall what the avg was . This gave everyone a little cushion the guy on a budget wasn?t get hp from someone that?s buying the latest greatest stuff we are there again.

I understand what you are saying, but the index change doesn't impact a single combo. It affects all combos in that class. What was the instant HP before the .30 reduction in the index? -1.50? Then they dropped it to -1.20 after the .30 reduction.

Index changes only affects qualifying and positions on the ladder if you do not do it universally. Then it is only semantics if you do it universally. I have yet to understand how an index change would target a soft combo without affecting more fairly factored combos.

Then you have a scenario in Super Stock where there are 5 classes with a 11.00 index. SS/K, SS/JA, SS/TD, FSS/M, & SS/PHA (whatever that is). One or more of the cars in those particular classes my have a super soft index, but none of them would be a heads up situation if they line up against another class even though it shares the same index.

Soft or not indexes only affect qualifying at a fairly rare event that has more than 128 cars which Indy is one and sometimes Bowling Green. I know there are a few more that pop up and they are pretty cool to see. But qualifying high on the sheet or even number 1 doesn't seem to be a big factor in winning overall.

All that being said I am not opposed to lowering the indexes, but I don't see the point if the triggers are lowered along with it.