Warning to those who use brake cleaner

[Run to Rund]

Most starting fluids are diethyl ether. Extremely flammable. The vapors are heavier than air so it migrates along a bench top or floor.

[sc4400]

Originally Posted by Harry 6674

So are you claiming the doctors were incorrect in their diagnosis or could your numbers be wrong?

Which numbers would be wrong? I would not question that the guy got sick. Or that you should not breathe any chemicals. I only question the "phosgene" assertion. Phosgene is a very lethal, yet very simple chemical. It's symptoms are harsh but very predictable. It is not a carcinogen. Many know that it is also referred to as "mustard gas", used in WWI as a terror weapon. Unlike agent orange or DDT it does not linger in the environment or your body.
My point is that the gentleman was affected by something. I have no idea what it was, but phosgene doesn't cause seizures, or suddenly hit you 2 weeks later. If I can find an MSDS on phosgene I'll post it.
It is easy to cause hysteria. Much more difficult to refute ignorance.

RIP

[John Kelley]

Originally Posted by sc4400

. I only question the "phosgene" assertion. Phosgene is a very lethal, yet very simple chemical. It's symptoms are harsh but very predictable. My point is that the gentleman was affected by something. I have no idea what it was, but phosgene doesn't cause seizures, or suddenly hit you 2 weeks later. If I can find an MSDS on phosgene I'll post it.
It is easy to cause hysteria. Much more difficult to refute ignorance.
RIP

MIKEY.........
You FAIL to address SUPER HEATED "phosgene" which would happen around a welding area !!
An MSDS would not cover that..........

[sc4400]

Originally Posted by John Kelley

MIKEY.........
You FAIL to address SUPER HEATED "phosgene" which would happen around a welding area !!
An MSDS would not cover that..........

Hey Johny...........your lack of knowledge regarding chemicals is evident. Phosgene is COCl2. Were you able to cause its decomposition back to its original components, you would get CO(carbon monoxide) and Cl2(chlorine). Both of these chemicals have well known predictable effects on humans. Neither would cause the symptoms exhibited. In an incinerator(which we had to deal with waste streams) the CO will burn in the presence of O2 yeilding CO2. Many don't realize that pure CO is extremely flamable. The free Cl2 will combine with water vapor to form acid (HCl, often called muriatic or Hydrochloric acid). Which we then neutralized with a caustic stream.

Considering I was involved with this stuff for more than 27 years, and have a complete respect for it, it might occur to you that conclusions by "victims" based on ignorance and weak on facts might be in error.

Quit guessing and bring facts.

RIP

[55 Chevy]

When we got back from holidays the wasps had built a couple of huge nests, 1 under my deck, another under the eves. Picked up a can of wasp/hornet blaster from the local store but I used it all up & they were still buzzing in there. I remember reading this thread while in NZ & I thought that I would see if the stuff is lethal to insects. Shoved the pin nozzle in the nest sprayed for a couple of seconds & immediately action ceased. Problem solved.

[55 Chevy]

Failed to mention in my previous post that lethal stuff I tried was brakleen.

[Mark Yacavone]

Works great on scorpions. I don't know if it drowns 'em or freeze-dries 'em. No pain, no stain.

[Harry 6674]

Originally Posted by sc4400

Hey Johny...........your lack of knowledge regarding chemicals is evident. Phosgene is COCl2. Were you able to cause its decomposition back to its original components, you would get CO(carbon monoxide) and Cl2(chlorine). Both of these chemicals have well known predictable effects on humans. Neither would cause the symptoms exhibited. In an incinerator(which we had to deal with waste streams) the CO will burn in the presence of O2 yeilding CO2. Many don't realize that pure CO is extremely flamable. The free Cl2 will combine with water vapor to form acid (HCl, often called muriatic or Hydrochloric acid). Which we then neutralized with a caustic stream.

Considering I was involved with this stuff for more than 27 years, and have a complete respect for it, it might occur to you that conclusions by "victims" based on ignorance and weak on facts might be in error.

Quit guessing and bring facts.

RIP

I guess the only way you can be sure is to go out and weld through a puddle of the stuff. I don't think I would go to your company doctors though because they probably don't have 27 years working with the stuff. Try the doctors this man went to,you'll have a better outcome. Do we really know the strengh of the phosgene as he produced it accidently, not in a lab enviroment. The heat,argon,brakekleen all worked together to cause this. Have you ever tried that combo?