National Records

oldskool · 01-06-2015, 10:17 PM

Here's another dummy question. And the only reason I'm asking is because I don't know the answer and would like to.

I see that at most big races there are cars running under the national record for their class. So my question is: why do they choose not to run for the record ?

I could only think of two possible reasons. Either they don't want to go thru an additional teardown. Or they don't want to call any extra attention to their combo, which might result in a hp refactor.

So can some of you guys clear this up for me ?

Also, I've noticed that some cars are going about 2 sec quicker than the same combo did back in the 70's. Is there any way to look up what the record was for a particular class, say in 1975, and what car held that record ? Or how about a list of when that record was reset, and by what car ? Or is this kind of info just too detailed to keep up with and have available online ?

John Duzac · 01-06-2015, 10:37 PM

Some people may have their engine on the ragged edge and afraid they won't pass tech.

oldskool · 01-06-2015, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Duzac

Some people may have their engine on the ragged edge and afraid they won't pass tech.

Well, that answer brings up another question. If someone is afraid their engine won't pass tech. Then what do they plan to do if they win the race ? Don't all winner's engines get checked at the big races ?

Have you guys known of a lot of big race winners who were DQ'd for an illegal engine ?

If this happens, do they also tear down the RU ? Or is the RU automatically torn down ?

GTX JOHN · 01-07-2015, 06:26 AM

Seldom Tear Down after a race is completed......everyone wants to go home. Random tear downs after Qualification Runs

No teardowns in our Division (7) unless a record has been set.

Exception to rules is All Stars where all division winners are torn down
prior to the race!

Pedigo Perf · 01-07-2015, 08:22 AM

Oldskool,

First off, only the Pro classes are allowed to set a record at National events. As for Divisionals you will likely get Monday HP or at least a trigger for your efforts. Until 2013 the same was true for National Opens but now you can run it out without fear and get the record if you are willing and able. Problem there is that really limits the opportunity to set records as the National Opens aren't always run at the best dates or tracks for optimal performance. In fact, Division 4 doesn't even run National Opens.

Bob Mulry · 01-07-2015, 08:35 AM

Hi,

To answer your question.....

Sportsman National Records cannot be set at National Events.......

The run resetting the record must occur during qualifying, the engine sealed, an R with a circle around it on the racecar during the back-up run (run has to be within 1% of record setting run). Resetting the MPH record can only occur during a resetting of the ET record.

NHRA will inspect car and determine if the Class requirements are met and if so a certificate will be issued.....

Next you get to put your racecar back together to race the Eliminator

That's it......

It seemed like a good idea at the time.....

Back in the day we got extra points for setting records but that was a long time ago.....

We had our car taken apart 7 times in one season because of resetting National Records and Low Qualifier. That was over 10 years ago...

I lot has changed within NHRA, including rewarding performance...

Bob

ALMACK · 01-07-2015, 09:39 AM

One other thing I do not think was mentioned yet, is that by attempting records at 1/4 mile National Opens, the racer can set both 1/8th mile and 1/4 mile records at the same time.

If you attempt a record at a division 1/4 mile event, you can only go for the 1/4 records...IIRC.

As posted above: If a racer attempts at a Divisional race there is the risk of getting a h.p. hit the following Monday, so that's one of the reasons why National Opens are more favorable for record setters.

oldskool · 01-07-2015, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTX JOHN

Seldom Tear Down after a race is completed......everyone wants to go home. Random tear downs after Qualification Runs

No teardowns in our Division (7) unless a record has been set.

Hey THANKS guys ! Ya'll have provided a lot of great info.

I'm real surprised at the info in this post. I just assumed that the winner of every national and divisional would be torn down. Does that mean that only record setting cars are even checked at divisional races ? Does that mean that some of the cars could be running too many cubes and it would never even be checked ?

If this is the case, do ya'll think it's because of the bracket racing nature of class racing now ? Or maybe because the payouts are so low ? Or maybe a combination of things ?

The only negative I can see about somebody running an illegal engine is in the case of a same class, heads up run. In that case it wouldn't seem fair to the other guy IF he is running legal.

Having been around some dirt racing, I know how some guys will fudge all they can get by with.

So, nowadays, is it just assumed that most everybody who runs just the divisional races are fudging a little and most don't really care that much ?

Hey, I'm just trying to learn all I can about how things operate in class racing today. And I can't think of a better way to learn than to ask those who do it. So, thanks again guys for sharing all this info !

oldskool · 01-08-2015, 12:18 AM

Those 1986 records are interesting. The SS/KA is a 10.80. In 1977 the guys at H-O Racing Specialties set that class record at 11.31, in a '74 SD455 TA. So it took 9 years to lower the record 1/2 sec. We saw the H-O car run at the '78 Cajun Nationals. They were a long way from home.

Crew Chief · 01-08-2015, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldskool

Hey THANKS guys ! Ya'll have provided a lot of great info.

I'm real surprised at the info in this post. I just assumed that the winner of every national and divisional would be torn down. Does that mean that only record setting cars are even checked at divisional races ? Does that mean that some of the cars could be running too many cubes and it would never even be checked ?

If this is the case, do ya'll think it's because of the bracket racing nature of class racing now ? Or maybe because the payouts are so low ? Or maybe a combination of things ?

The only negative I can see about somebody running an illegal engine is in the case of a same class, heads up run. In that case it wouldn't seem fair to the other guy IF he is running legal.

Having been around some dirt racing, I know how some guys will fudge all they can get by with.

So, nowadays, is it just assumed that most everybody who runs just the divisional races are fudging a little and most don't really care that much ?

Hey, I'm just trying to learn all I can about how things operate in class racing today. And I can't think of a better way to learn than to ask those who do it. So, thanks again guys for sharing all this info !

There is another way someone can be tore down. The car can be protested.

01-06-2015, 10:17 PM	#1
oldskool VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: The Land of Bayous, Boudin & Crawfish Posts: 1,668 Likes: 223 Liked 747 Times in 362 Posts	National Records Here's another dummy question. And the only reason I'm asking is because I don't know the answer and would like to. I see that at most big races there are cars running under the national record for their class. So my question is: why do they choose not to run for the record ? I could only think of two possible reasons. Either they don't want to go thru an additional teardown. Or they don't want to call any extra attention to their combo, which might result in a hp refactor. So can some of you guys clear this up for me ? Also, I've noticed that some cars are going about 2 sec quicker than the same combo did back in the 70's. Is there any way to look up what the record was for a particular class, say in 1975, and what car held that record ? Or how about a list of when that record was reset, and by what car ? Or is this kind of info just too detailed to keep up with and have available online ? Last edited by oldskool; 01-06-2015 at 10:46 PM.

01-06-2015, 10:37 PM	#2
John Duzac Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Covington, La Posts: 311 Likes: 63 Liked 83 Times in 20 Posts	Re: National Records Some people may have their engine on the ragged edge and afraid they won't pass tech. __________________ John Duzac D/S 4448 STK

01-07-2015, 06:26 AM	#4
GTX JOHN VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Boulder City, Nevada 89005 Posts: 2,719 Likes: 2,767 Liked 2,425 Times in 687 Posts	Re: National Records Seldom Tear Down after a race is completed......everyone wants to go home. Random tear downs after Qualification Runs No teardowns in our Division (7) unless a record has been set. Exception to rules is All Stars where all division winners are torn down prior to the race! __________________ John Irving 741 Stock 741 Super Stock

01-07-2015, 08:22 AM	#5
Pedigo Perf Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Wichita Ks Posts: 383 Likes: 70 Liked 30 Times in 17 Posts	Re: National Records Oldskool, First off, only the Pro classes are allowed to set a record at National events. As for Divisionals you will likely get Monday HP or at least a trigger for your efforts. Until 2013 the same was true for National Opens but now you can run it out without fear and get the record if you are willing and able. Problem there is that really limits the opportunity to set records as the National Opens aren't always run at the best dates or tracks for optimal performance. In fact, Division 4 doesn't even run National Opens.

01-07-2015, 08:35 AM	#6
Bob Mulry VIP Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Coarsegold, CA Posts: 1,016 Likes: 57 Liked 320 Times in 102 Posts	Re: National Records Hi, To answer your question..... Sportsman National Records cannot be set at National Events....... The run resetting the record must occur during qualifying, the engine sealed, an R with a circle around it on the racecar during the back-up run (run has to be within 1% of record setting run). Resetting the MPH record can only occur during a resetting of the ET record. NHRA will inspect car and determine if the Class requirements are met and if so a certificate will be issued..... Next you get to put your racecar back together to race the Eliminator That's it...... It seemed like a good idea at the time..... Back in the day we got extra points for setting records but that was a long time ago..... We had our car taken apart 7 times in one season because of resetting National Records and Low Qualifier. That was over 10 years ago... I lot has changed within NHRA, including rewarding performance... Bob __________________ Bob Mulry 7516 STK A & M Motorsports

01-07-2015, 09:39 AM	#7
ALMACK VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Bardstown, KY Posts: 1,935 Likes: 129 Liked 369 Times in 127 Posts	Re: National Records One other thing I do not think was mentioned yet, is that by attempting records at 1/4 mile National Opens, the racer can set both 1/8th mile and 1/4 mile records at the same time. If you attempt a record at a division 1/4 mile event, you can only go for the 1/4 records...IIRC. As posted above: If a racer attempts at a Divisional race there is the risk of getting a h.p. hit the following Monday, so that's one of the reasons why National Opens are more favorable for record setters. __________________ Alan Mackin Stock 3777/ SS 3377 P/SA & SS/PA Fox Thunderbird I/PS '95 Mustang GT Last edited by ALMACK; 01-07-2015 at 01:19 PM. Reason: missed a word

01-08-2015, 12:18 AM	#9
oldskool VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: The Land of Bayous, Boudin & Crawfish Posts: 1,668 Likes: 223 Liked 747 Times in 362 Posts	Re: National Records Those 1986 records are interesting. The SS/KA is a 10.80. In 1977 the guys at H-O Racing Specialties set that class record at 11.31, in a '74 SD455 TA. So it took 9 years to lower the record 1/2 sec. We saw the H-O car run at the '78 Cajun Nationals. They were a long way from home. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by oldskool; 01-08-2015 at 12:34 AM.