Factory experimental

[Bruce Noland]

I spoke to the Ford guys at 2008 SEMA and they are really pumped up to run their tricked out, aftermarket, 700+ HP Mustangs in Stock against our 40 year old cars. From what we have already seen from early testing, there is no doubt that they will in fact come into the AA and A Classes and kick our butts. Although the Chrysler guys were a little more subdued about their impact on these classes, it is clear that they want to dominate as well. New blood is fine, but this is way over the top.

I personally think this is an unconscionable venture between these two auto makers and nhra to wipe out the upper classes with these cars. I believe, until now, supercharged cars were not allowed to race in Stock. nhra has no idea how to tech these cars, and any tech information they get will come directly from the preferred OEM.

The new Challengers and Mustangs belong in FX classes. After Pomona it will be too late. No matter how bad it makes nhra and Ford/Chrysler look the deal will be closed and most racers will not be able to compete with these Aftermarket Super Stock cars masquerading as Stockers.

Yes, it's good that the OEM's want to play, but these cars should be placed in A/FX. They can still run the eliminator just like everybody else and, at the same time, have a showcase class to market their cars.

nhra should not be so hungry to forget or neglect it's responsibility to fairly classify these cars!

[Billy Nees]

Bruce, welcome to my world.

[Chad Rhodes]

Bruce, I think you may be on to something. I know that the AHFS will not correct the factors on these cars in any reasonable amount of time. Considering that they aren't showroom available, they should not be allowed in the class. These cars don't have VIN numbers. while i think the involvement of detroit in S/SS is wonderful, as someone with alot of money and time invested in A/SA or AA/SA it sickens me to think of how much it would cost to compete with these guys

[Jim Kaekel]

It's obvious that NHRA made a "deal with the devil" when they changed the wording in the rule book a couple of years back, adding the "special production run" clause of 50 cars for manufacturers. I see there are four '08 Mustangs (Calvert, J. Waldo, Stinnett, Ronzello) entered for Pomona. No new Challengers yet, but they are sure to come in the near future. It will be interesting how all of this sorts out. The positive I see is that this may generate some much needed publicity for our class.

[Woodro Josey]

I have about decided, we are on the losing end of a sinking ship. That means if they are rating these cars at 700hp, how much will a race prepaired, really make, and this is in Stock. Try gettin one of those babys insured for the street, they are street legal cars, right?

[bill dedman]

How are these cars any different from a 1968 Dart/Barracuda Hemi car, or a Thunderbolt? Both are non-street-legal factory cars, both have outrageously powerful engines that wouldn't be happy in a grocery getter, and both are EXTREMELY limited production cars.

What did they do with the Hemis and T-Bolts?

They put them in their appropriate Super Stock classes, where they could "play with their own kind."

There IS no Factory Experimental class in the rule book, and hasn't heen for eons, but there sure as hell are Super Stock classes for these cars, and I think that's where they belong. Let's see how they fare against Brandon Wilkinson's car, heads-up, or any of the Hemi '65 Plymouths and Dodges in SS/B...

Apples to apples...

That IS what they did with the '68 competition Hemis and Thunderbolts...

What's good for the goose, etc., etc., etc....

What think ye? They sure as hell don't belong in Stock Eliminator, for a variety of reasons!

[Greg Hill]

All this does is re-enforce my feeling that the powers that be either don't have a clue or really don't care about stock eliminator. These factory built race cars belong in some class besides stock eliminator. A " 68 " Z-28 can't even run the 2x4's or the cam that anyone could order from the factory and have delivered to the dealer in the trunk of the car. Now whatever the factory wants to do is okay even though these are not even street legal cars. A lot of A and AA cars are going to be obsolete.

Greg

[danny waters sr]

New classes AF/S & AF/SA = All new Fords AD/S & AD/SA = All new Dodge & Chyrsler (or even AM/S or AM/SA for Mopars) AG/S & AG/SA = All General Motors. All with their own indexes and Factors.This reminds me of mixing fuel injections with carb classes . In my opinion this is the way it should be if they want to run stock..Who knows ,maybe this is the new answer to cutting out real stockers at NHRA. These cars could easily take your place in the big show. That would make them happy . Just thinking out loud ..

[Rory McNeil]

Well... according to my NHRA Rulebook, the 3rd paragraph states "OEM may apply for inclusion of any special production runs into the Official NHRA Stock Car Classification Guide. Special run must include a minimum of 50 units of an already accepted body style, need NOT be showroom available. Applications evaluated on an individual basis. Acceptance will not imply precedent".
A quick peek at my 2004 Rulebook has the exact paragraph, word for word. Wouldn`t this same situation be how the 66 427 Fairlanes, COPO and Yenko Camaros, "Firehawk" late model Firebirds, the LT1 powered 97-98 Camaro & Firebirds, and possibly some other vehicles that Joe Blow off the street would never have been able to purchase from his local dealership?
As for the percieved domination of these Mustangs, it kinda sounds like many racers complaints when the EFI cars started getting popular. "The aerodynamics, high tech vodoo, better wight balance, etc" was going to ruin it for the "little guy". When the EFI classes were blended with the traditional Stockers, the "fuelies" were gonna eat the older cars for lunch. At the end of the 2008 season, there were more carbed cars in the top 10, and the vast majority of NHRA National records were held by the older cars too. I think a sit & wait approach would be better than panicking. Granted ,it did take NHRA a while to get the LS1`s HP rating within reason, but then Pontiac WAS the "Offical Car of NHRA" at the time, Ford isn`t, so maybe NHRA would be a bit quicker to react if the new Cobra Jet does indeed run away from the pack. As for superchargers in Stock, they were legal in the 57 Fords, and several versions of Studebakers years ago, and Turbos have been allowed for years, so whats the differance? Personally, I think that any forced induction Stocker should be limited to the factory boost pressure, but maybe thats just me. I guess Pomona will tell the story, right?

[Michael Kilduff]

Originally Posted by Bruce Noland

I spoke to the Ford guys at 2008 SEMA and they are really pumped up to run their tricked out, aftermarket, 700+ HP Mustangs in Stock against our 40 year old cars. From what we have already seen from early testing, there is no doubt that they will in fact come into the AA and A Classes and kick our butts. Although the Chrysler guys were a little more subdued about their impact on these classes, it is clear that they want to dominate as well. New blood is fine, but this is way over the top.

I personally think this is an unconscionable venture between these two auto makers and nhra to wipe out the upper classes with these cars. I believe, until now, supercharged cars were not allowed to race in Stock. nhra has no idea how to tech these cars, and any tech information they get will come directly from the preferred OEM.

The new Challengers and Mustangs belong in FX classes. After Pomona it will be too late. No matter how bad it makes nhra and Ford/Chrysler look the deal will be closed and most racers will not be able to compete with these Aftermarket Super Stock cars masquerading as Stockers.

Yes, it's good that the OEM's want to play, but these cars should be placed in A/FX. They can still run the eliminator just like everybody else and, at the same time, have a showcase class to market their cars.

nhra should not be so hungry to forget or neglect it's responsibility to fairly classify these cars!

This is a good post. The new blown cars should be factory experimental.

If a mustang comes 'stock' with 700hp, what will it make tricked out? 850?

Good luck getting that to hook.