Question for the Super Stock Racer's

[Adger Smith]

If you study the SS production rules you might see a very similar blend of modified and NHRA SS/GT. Stock bore & stroke for the engine claimed keeps it from being a full blown Modified - Comp style engine. Yes, there are a few other things besides Carb, heads & compression, but I just look at it as a the IHRA version of a modified SS/GT class.

[Ed Wright]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

What exactly makes it a joke? The class has been around forever, with deep historical roots. It's basically like the SS/Modified classes (which both NHRA and IHRA contest), only with more rules. (Refer to the Camaro driven by NHRA 4-Wide Nationals Super Stock Champion Pete D'Agnolo.) Rules are available online, free: http://www.ihra.com/competition/itemlist/category/123

Number of SS/Production cars in Div. 4: Zero, so that cannot be what's keeping the cars home in your region.

"Deep historical roots" in IHRA maybe, but we have a lot of Super Modified SS cars in Div 4 NHRA, but most don't fit the IHRA rules. If they want to draw NHRA cars they need to make the rules the same. There aren't a lot of IHRA-only Stock or SS cars around here anyway.

Considering the IHRA tracks around here, they likely still wouldn't draw many cars. I ran several IHRA races a few years ago. I tried to support them. Other than Tulsa, which couldn't make any money with IHRA, none of them had room for the number of cars and big rigs an NHRA points race draws. They couldn't fit them all in.

[dragracer2011]

[QUOTE=
Considering the IHRA tracks around here, they likely still wouldn't draw many cars. I ran several IHRA races a few years ago. I tried to support them. Other than Tulsa, which couldn't make any money with IHRA, none of them had room for the number of cars and big rigs an NHRA points race draws. They couldn't fit them all in.[/QUOTE]

That's hilarious right there Ed, if you think Tulsa made any money with 322 cars then it's obvious you don't have a clue about cost of events and as for your statement about IHRA tracks in your area, I am assuming you mean Oklahoma area, IHRA pro am tracks in div 4 are SAN ANTONIO( not very good racing surface but will hold whatever is needed for car counts), Baton Rouge( good facility and great people and former nhra track and can hold the cars needed) Pinevalley ( very good track and great racing surface and room for plenty of cars).Are they as good as the Texas Motorplex? No but neither is Noble or any of the LODRS tracks around.

The whole truth is if a racer don't want to go, they will make enough excuses to not go and the original question of this thread was why super stock didn't support IHRA, you have come up with every excuse why but none of them are relevant to this thread IMO ...... Just my .02

[j gardiner]

Its not nhra plain and simple. Not trying to pick on one person because there are a lot of racers that are that way. Ihra does do things a little different, who wants a carbon copy of nhra. Sometimes they come up with some good ideas because they are allowed to think outside the box, top stock, top sportsman and top dragster are examples.

[Michael Beard]

This just keeps getting weirder...

Originally Posted by Ed Wright

"Deep historical roots" in IHRA maybe, but we have a lot of Super Modified SS cars in Div 4 NHRA, but most don't fit the IHRA rules.

So are you trying to say that Production cars are a joke because they have MORE stringent rules than an unrelated NHRA class? Or are you not defending the Production cars are a joke statement? What are you calling Super Modified cars, because that's a Comp class. Yes, IHRA does not run Competition Eliminator. If you're referring to Modified Stock (AS, BS, CS, etc...), IHRA also has them. (As for "a lot", there appears to have been 4 Modified Stock cars in NHRA Div. 4 last year) Did you mean the MX classes? Both sanctioning bodies have those. What cars are you talking about, what rules do they not fit, and how is any of this relevant to SS/Production?

There aren't a lot of IHRA-only Stock or SS cars around here anyway.

So... how are they keeping anyone else at home then?

Considering the IHRA tracks around here, they likely still wouldn't draw many cars. I ran several IHRA races a few years ago. I tried to support them. Other than Tulsa, which couldn't make any money with IHRA, none of them had room for the number of cars and big rigs an NHRA points race draws. They couldn't fit them all in.

So if the facilities were larger, they'd draw more cars? Huh? Tulsa's a nice facility, and IHRA had a great program there with an added FREE race one year, and people still didn't support it. Many tracks have switched sanctioning bodies throughout the years. Tulsa, Shreveport (Thunder Road Raceway Park), Virginia Motorsports Park, New England Dragway, Norwalk, and Montgomery among many others were once IHRA. Hanging an NHRA flag at the gate must confer magical powers.

[buzzinhalfdozen]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

You would think those people would *rather* run IHRA, where they don't have to run heads-up against the new factory race cars. They also don't run heads-up against those "other" classes, either. It's also worth pointing out that there are 0 Pure Stockers in Div. 4, and only a couple of Crate Motor cars. It stands to reason that it's not the cars that are bogus, but the argument.

I used to work for IHRA back in the day, and all we heard was, "We'll come race with you if you change such-n-such." If that got changed, they still didn't come, and they came up with another excuse. The bottom line is that they simply didn't want to. Not enough people supported them when they were at their strongest, so now they're having to rebuild from a weaker position. NHRA *needs* competition to make them better.

Michael, you're saying IHRA didn't have enough racer support when they were at their peak? Maybe I'm misremembering but I seem to recall a lot of races rigs crammed in pretty tight, heck I think it was the last "world nationals" some racers were pitted in Linders lot. If that's not racer support I'm not sure what it is. Again at least in my mind IHRA has changed dramatically...and not in a good way.

[Another Friendly Racer]

If you want to make a legend of yourself (or at least get a reputation), you need to win in the NHRA. I think this is a prevalent, underlying factor to many racers... even though nobody will admit it. It's tougher to get that reputation in the IHRA.

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by buzzinhalfdozen

Michael, you're saying IHRA didn't have enough racer support when they were at their peak? Maybe I'm misremembering but I seem to recall a lot of races rigs crammed in pretty tight, heck I think it was the last "world nationals" some racers were pitted in Linders lot. If that's not racer support I'm not sure what it is. Again at least in my mind IHRA has changed dramatically...and not in a good way.

Yeah, that was Norwalk. There were a couple of other races in Div. 3 and Div. 9 that did well for a few years. Other areas, not nearly so much. But I do agree that they made some decisions that moved them in the wrong direction.

If you want to make a legend of yourself (or at least get a reputation), you need to win in the NHRA. I think this is a prevalent, underlying factor to many racers... even though nobody will admit it. It's tougher to get that reputation in the IHRA.

True, but only because of perception creating that reality. Anthony Bertozzi, Mark Nowicki, Pete D'agnolo, Jimmy Hidalgo, Brent Darroch, Scotty Stillings, Monty Bogan... and the list goes on. It doesn't matter what flag is hanging at the gate. Guys like these are always a threat to win.


Let's turn this around and make something positive out of this thread: what can they do to rebuild?

[Ed Wright]

Originally Posted by dragracer2011

That's hilarious right there Ed, if you think Tulsa made any money with 322 cars then it's obvious you don't have a clue about cost of events and as for your statement about IHRA tracks in your area, I am assuming you mean Oklahoma area, IHRA pro am tracks in div 4 are SAN ANTONIO( not very good racing surface but will hold whatever is needed for car counts), Baton Rouge( good facility and great people and former nhra track and can hold the cars needed) Pinevalley ( very good track and great racing surface and room for plenty of cars).Are they as good as the Texas Motorplex? No but neither is Noble or any of the LODRS tracks around.

The whole truth is if a racer don't want to go, they will make enough excuses to not go and the original question of this thread was why super stock didn't support IHRA, you have come up with every excuse why but none of them are relevant to this thread IMO ...... Just my .02

Do you know and talk to the people running Tulsa? I do. I live here. I'm almost fifteen minutes from the track. Been racing there since 1964. BTW, they kept announcing 370 cars last weekend. I didn't check out their numbers, as I really don't care.
Many Pro Stock cars test here, also Comp and Super Stock. Well run facility. I'm lucky.

You have been to Pine Valley? Doesn't sound like it. It's a "nice little, rural, et bracket track". Not sure where they would put a hundred or more totters & stackers, plus everybody else. I don't know where they would park everybody for an NHRA LODRS race. Spectators either.

Been to Baton Rouge lately? I wouldn't go back. Certainly not what it used to be. Very run down last time I was there. Long drive from Tulsa, for not much. They had to drive me across to the far side of the property on a golf cart to another building so I could pay my entry with my Visa.

Memphis was still pretty nice a couple of years ago, always like it. Not that bad a drive.
San Antonio isn't much. Wouldn't call it a dump, but I likely won't ever go back there. Long drive.

The track at Gilliam, LA (Not far from Shreveport, used to be called "Red River Raceway") is OK. Not a long drive from here (5 to 6 hours), but it really fills up during the points races. I have raced there under both IHRA and NHRA. It's not bad.

Yes, we have Noble. It sure isn't much. I always wonder when all the traveling "pros" that stop there on their way to the NHRA World Finals, if they think all our Div 4 tracks are like that?
If it weren't so close (less than 2 hours), I wouldn't go there either. Starting line is always great because our regular Div 4 NHRA crew preps it. Rest of it ain't much. Either dust or mud. Don't bother testing there beforehand. Been there, done that.

With your made up screen name, I don't know who you are, or what you race, but surely you aren't from here in Div 4. I'm afraid you are very mis-informed about a lot here.

[ALMACK]

Originally Posted by j gardiner

Why are they bogus? Pure stock is theost legit class in all of class racing.

I agree