What about STOCK ? - Page 4

1320GURU · 08-02-2007, 01:56 PM

How about getting rid of the "secret" timers inside of the MSD and transmissions? A spec MSD would do more to level the field than anything else.

stockracer · 08-02-2007, 02:10 PM

Griffith...Great Idea, really, lets go pro tree! Stick guys can feel like pro stock racers...And bring back deepstaging. Really if a driver is any good all you look at is the bottom bulb and react. Unless you anticipate, which is very inconsistant. I would LOVE to see a pro tree! Bring back deep staging for the slower cars...every body wins! And the adjustability will always be better with a faster car button or no button...

Mr. Beard...When I made my first post I really expected that you would be the first on to get on here and completly rip me, But thank you for speaking your opinion in a decent way. I realize everyone has a different opinion and I just consider this constructive critisim for the class.

tgriffith · 08-02-2007, 02:39 PM

pro tree??? its already here,,,just most of stock dont have a clue

Casey Miles · 08-02-2007, 03:58 PM

Back in the day, there was a track called New York National, they had a get ready light then, one amber then green. The big hitters were Sam Biondo and Phil Montief along with a small group of others. They knew to deep stage before anyone else thought about it. This was before reation timers and 60' clocks. You could always find either of them in the final. So, deep staging wouldn't be a bad idea with a pro tree.
The racer thinking out of the box would still be winning! I beleive that Sam Biondo was one of the racers thinking out of the box and now I think that Peter is following in his footsteps. Peter will still win his share of races, but it would even up the playing field. The faster car would be at a disadvantage with full blinders and pro tree. We had a race at Moroso, the Super pro cars were allowed to use their delay boxes, none of them could hit the tree because of the distraction of the other car leaving.
Casey Miles
248H

Sam Murray · 08-03-2007, 10:27 AM

Instead of everyone complaining here, send a note to Len directly, that you don't want buttons in stock PERIOD. A written letter is better. Some of us stick racers did this early this year.

bsa633 · 08-03-2007, 01:37 PM

if there is a simple way i think it would be nice if stock became a "foot break" only class,sure the good racers would still win,but maybe we could see a little more people winning...or maybe less who knows...but still there would a bigger window to win i think...would be harder to "flashrace"...frankly i am getting a little bored of that it takes .020 or better the whole way to win races nowdays...am i the only one getting bored with that?more machine than people....

Chip THELEGEND Johnson · 08-03-2007, 01:47 PM

I say allow Delay boxes and transbrakes or Make it FOOTBRAKE ONLY NO BUTTONS AT ALL.

Chip Johnson

tgriffith · 08-04-2007, 08:47 AM

"""020 or better the whole way to win races nowdays"""

a year or so ago,,,I told you guys that this was going to happen,,,,I even posted average RTs of what I could find,,I think the years of 1999,2000,,,,2001 and 2002 of selected races and then the average RT`s of 2005 and beginning of 2006,,,,,,,If I can find that topic,,I `ll repost it,,,,,,,,I think I deleted all my post because 99% of racers had the opinion that I was crying and need to shut up and learn how to race......the results I found were staggering,,,,,that in just a year,,,most all of the stock professionals had suddenly learn how to trim a consistent .03 off their RT`s in a national event setting,,,,,,,,,,and most of these guys doing so had other pro tree cars, whether it was a super car of some type or superstocker.........one of the most alarming things I found was the disappearance of slow index cars........now this typf of increase in RT pointed to a different method of racing,,,either everyone is cheating (which I dont believe in one second) or everyone is moving to faster cars to "pro tree race",,,,,,,,,,sure enough,,,thats what it is

This is just an opinion,,what you will soon see in the near future,, everyone that races seriously in stock,,,more heads up races because even as we speak,,,racers that dont have A- E cars are selling what they do have and finding them so they can be competitive.......Ive noticed that on here and other sites,,more slower cars are finding their way on the market at a lower price

If steps arent taken to stop this spending,,,it will be nearly impossible to be competitive without spending 75k for a stocker...I really believe that the elimination of the 2steps and button is a step in the rite direction ....time will tell I guess

tgriffith · 08-04-2007, 08:51 AM

one other thing,,,,,It is up to the majority to change the rules,,,,Nhra/Ihra isnt interested in making changes that would help a w/sa pinto or a chevette,,(LOL) but this has a trickle down effect because it would also help the I/sa and slower cars also

Bunkster · 08-04-2007, 10:32 AM

While spending all this time on the starting system, why not finally....finally...fix the red light inequality in handicap racing. It is downright ignorant to continue this "first" red light thing.

Imbrogno, do the right thing and institute the "worst" red light. You know it's the right thing to do. This thing of some drivers not having to take a shot at the tree is flat wrong. If anyone tells you "we've done it that way from day one", then tell them "...and we've been doing it wrong all that time, too."

It is not required you take a vote. It is not even necessary that you tell anyone when you do it. Just do it.

Or, if you won't change to a "worst" red light system, then be consistent and change the finish line to a "first" breakout system. That way, the lunacy would be the same at both ends of the track.

08-02-2007, 01:56 PM	#31
1320GURU Junior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Scottsdale, AZ Posts: 11 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? How about getting rid of the "secret" timers inside of the MSD and transmissions? A spec MSD would do more to level the field than anything else.

08-02-2007, 02:10 PM	#32
stockracer Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 79 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Griffith...Great Idea, really, lets go pro tree! Stick guys can feel like pro stock racers...And bring back deepstaging. Really if a driver is any good all you look at is the bottom bulb and react. Unless you anticipate, which is very inconsistant. I would LOVE to see a pro tree! Bring back deep staging for the slower cars...every body wins! And the adjustability will always be better with a faster car button or no button... Mr. Beard...When I made my first post I really expected that you would be the first on to get on here and completly rip me, But thank you for speaking your opinion in a decent way. I realize everyone has a different opinion and I just consider this constructive critisim for the class.

08-02-2007, 02:39 PM	#33
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? pro tree??? its already here,,,just most of stock dont have a clue

08-02-2007, 03:58 PM	#34
Casey Miles Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 705 Likes: 128 Liked 502 Times in 91 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Back in the day, there was a track called New York National, they had a get ready light then, one amber then green. The big hitters were Sam Biondo and Phil Montief along with a small group of others. They knew to deep stage before anyone else thought about it. This was before reation timers and 60' clocks. You could always find either of them in the final. So, deep staging wouldn't be a bad idea with a pro tree. The racer thinking out of the box would still be winning! I beleive that Sam Biondo was one of the racers thinking out of the box and now I think that Peter is following in his footsteps. Peter will still win his share of races, but it would even up the playing field. The faster car would be at a disadvantage with full blinders and pro tree. We had a race at Moroso, the Super pro cars were allowed to use their delay boxes, none of them could hit the tree because of the distraction of the other car leaving. Casey Miles 248H

08-03-2007, 10:27 AM	#35
Sam Murray Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Cummaquid, Mass Posts: 445 Likes: 413 Liked 60 Times in 29 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Instead of everyone complaining here, send a note to Len directly, that you don't want buttons in stock PERIOD. A written letter is better. Some of us stick racers did this early this year. __________________ Sam Murray 1616 STK

08-03-2007, 01:37 PM	#36
bsa633 Banned Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 310 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? if there is a simple way i think it would be nice if stock became a "foot break" only class,sure the good racers would still win,but maybe we could see a little more people winning...or maybe less who knows...but still there would a bigger window to win i think...would be harder to "flashrace"...frankly i am getting a little bored of that it takes .020 or better the whole way to win races nowdays...am i the only one getting bored with that?more machine than people....

08-03-2007, 01:47 PM	#37
Chip THELEGEND Johnson Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 284 Likes: 223 Liked 281 Times in 79 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? I say allow Delay boxes and transbrakes or Make it FOOTBRAKE ONLY NO BUTTONS AT ALL. Chip Johnson

08-04-2007, 08:47 AM	#38
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? """020 or better the whole way to win races nowdays""" a year or so ago,,,I told you guys that this was going to happen,,,,I even posted average RTs of what I could find,,I think the years of 1999,2000,,,,2001 and 2002 of selected races and then the average RT`s of 2005 and beginning of 2006,,,,,,,If I can find that topic,,I `ll repost it,,,,,,,,I think I deleted all my post because 99% of racers had the opinion that I was crying and need to shut up and learn how to race......the results I found were staggering,,,,,that in just a year,,,most all of the stock professionals had suddenly learn how to trim a consistent .03 off their RT`s in a national event setting,,,,,,,,,,and most of these guys doing so had other pro tree cars, whether it was a super car of some type or superstocker.........one of the most alarming things I found was the disappearance of slow index cars........now this typf of increase in RT pointed to a different method of racing,,,either everyone is cheating (which I dont believe in one second) or everyone is moving to faster cars to "pro tree race",,,,,,,,,,sure enough,,,thats what it is This is just an opinion,,what you will soon see in the near future,, everyone that races seriously in stock,,,more heads up races because even as we speak,,,racers that dont have A- E cars are selling what they do have and finding them so they can be competitive.......Ive noticed that on here and other sites,,more slower cars are finding their way on the market at a lower price If steps arent taken to stop this spending,,,it will be nearly impossible to be competitive without spending 75k for a stocker...I really believe that the elimination of the 2steps and button is a step in the rite direction ....time will tell I guess

08-04-2007, 08:51 AM	#39
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? one other thing,,,,,It is up to the majority to change the rules,,,,Nhra/Ihra isnt interested in making changes that would help a w/sa pinto or a chevette,,(LOL) but this has a trickle down effect because it would also help the I/sa and slower cars also

08-04-2007, 10:32 AM	#40
Bunkster Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 307 Likes: 0 Liked 43 Times in 10 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? While spending all this time on the starting system, why not finally....finally...fix the red light inequality in handicap racing. It is downright ignorant to continue this "first" red light thing. Imbrogno, do the right thing and institute the "worst" red light. You know it's the right thing to do. This thing of some drivers not having to take a shot at the tree is flat wrong. If anyone tells you "we've done it that way from day one", then tell them "...and we've been doing it wrong all that time, too." It is not required you take a vote. It is not even necessary that you tell anyone when you do it. Just do it. Or, if you won't change to a "worst" red light system, then be consistent and change the finish line to a "first" breakout system. That way, the lunacy would be the same at both ends of the track.