Attn 396, 375hp iron head racers

[Keith Lynch]

Hadtobethere, comon ol buddy I took care of the 402 years ago and it just keeps coming back! LOL How about this: 396/375 cast@ 395......402cast@400.....396 alum@405......428/367@390. Should make for some good all out class racing. Where is Farmer when you need him?

Jeff, yea lets lynch em!!!

[Keith Lynch]

What happened to the new AHFS rule about the average being lower for a large number of cars with the same combo as compared to a single combo car? I thougt NHRA made that change this year? Or was it recinded? I'm way to old to keep up with the AHFS.......of course, Jim, you knew that already.LOL

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Keith Lynch

What happened to the new AHFS rule about the average being lower for a large number of cars with the same combo as compared to a single combo car? I thougt NHRA made that change this year? Or was it recinded? I'm way to old to keep up with the AHFS.......of course, Jim, you knew that already.LOL

Oh, that's the way it works Keith, the MORE cars running a combination the LOWER (less under the index) their average has to be for them to get HP. The FEWER cars running a combination, the HIGHER (more under the index) their average has to be for them to get HP.

Not that Keith really needed it explained, it's more of a joke between us as we've discussed this several times. It's always the reason I give him when he asks why we don't run the 396-375.

It does not seem to be so equitable a situation. But the neither is a single person, or a "HP committee". Introduce the human factor, with politics, friends vs. enemies, grudges, and possible factory pressures, and you have a mess.

So a more popular combination, even though not as fast as a less popular combination, is more likely to see a heads up run (because there are more cars running that combination), there for needing to go fast more often and hurt their average, will get HP easier and sooner. Where as a less popular combination, even faster than the more popular combination, is less likely to see a heads up (because there are fewer cars running that combination), there for not needing to go as fast as often, will take longer to get HP, and will get less HP each time unless they go 1.4 under, even though it is a faster combination with a softer factor.

This thread is a perfect example. The 396-375, with or without aluminum heads, is one of the most popular combinations in Stock, period. It's in 67-69 Camaros, Chevelles, and Novas and runs in AA thru D in most cases. Now, there are cars and combinations that will easily go faster than the 67-69 396-375 cars and combinations. But not nearly so many. So, barring someone accidentally triggering an automatic hit with a 1.4 under pass, odds are the 67-69 397-375 combinations will be hit several more times before the faster combinations with fewer cars.

To be even close to fair, NHRA needs to either make the average required to cause a HP hit the same for everyone, at the very least, or swap it around so that a combination with more cars must average farther under the index than one with fewer cars.

It's just another one of many screw ups and loop holes in the current AHFS setup. And why the AHFS doesn't REALLY work like it should.

[Stewart Way]

Alan
Don't run Stock but the AHFS is an interesting topic and I do try to make sense of it so I have been following this thread. Agree with most of what you stated above, especially the human factor. One point I question is your belief that the more cars in a combo, the more heads up runs. I don't think thats true. Its the total class population that dictates the number of heads up runs not a combo population. A B/SA Camaro has no more chance of a heads up run than a B/SA Cuda but there are a lot more Camaros than Cudas.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Stewart Way

Alan
Don't run Stock but the AHFS is an interesting topic and I do try to make sense of it so I have been following this thread. Agree with most of what you stated above, especially the human factor. One point I question is your belief that the more cars in a combo, the more heads up runs. I don't think thats true. Its the total class population that dictates the number of heads up runs not a combo population. A B/SA Camaro has no more chance of a heads up run than a B/SA Cuda but there are a lot more Camaros than Cudas.

But since there are a lot more B/SA Camaros, there's a far greater chance a B/SA Camaro will be in a heads up than a B/SA 'Cuda. It's pretty simple really. It's hard to find a field WITHOUT a B/SA Camaro, or for that matter, two of them. If you have a field of say 80 cars or so, and there are 3 B/SA Camaros, and the normal 1 or less B/SA Cuda's, which is more likely to get a heads up, A Camaro or THE 'Cuda? Or maybe I've got that figured wrong.

[Stewart Way]

Alan
Your right. Odds are the same for the Cuda and any one of the Camaros, but since there are more Camaros odds of a heads up run for a Camaro are greater.

[hadtobethere]

Originally Posted by Keith Lynch

Hadtobethere, comon ol buddy I took care of the 402 years ago and it just keeps coming back! LOL How about this: 396/375 cast@ 395......402cast@400.....396 alum@405......428/367@390. Should make for some good all out class racing. Where is Farmer when you need him?

Jeff, yea lets lynch em!!!

Keith, you know what the bottom line is.....the AHFS does not work and who really understands how it really works or is suppose to work?

Some cars get a hit for running fast, think about that...is not running fast what drag racing is suppose to be, not to have a penalty for hard work, or being a bit sharper.....Farmer once threw me out at Indy, I then pointed out what was wrong with the hemi car he had just passed, with the stroke of a pen I was back in, LOL

[Terry Cain]

Originally Posted by Stewart Way

Alan
Your right. Odds are the same for the Cuda and any one of the Camaros, but since there are more Camaros odds of a heads up run for a Camaro are greater.

The odds would be the same. If you have four cars in a class all cars have the same odds of drawing a heads-up run.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by TCain

The odds would be the same. If you have four cars in a class all cars have the same odds of drawing a heads-up run.

Yes, but if there are three Camaros and one 'Cuda, as in this example, it is three times more likely that ONE of the THREE Camaros will get a heads up than the ONE 'Cuda. Simply because there are three times as many Camaros in the field. Any ONE car has the same odds as the rest. But the GROUP of THREE has higher odds AS A GROUP than the single car.

[stefan callender]

Originally Posted by bob Pagano

dave You And Peter Can Save The Index At E-town

Look At The Qualifying....lol