What about STOCK ? - Page 6

08-05-2007, 11:26 AM

Mark, I thought back in the day, all the stick guys rugged it and let the clutch out where ever the rpm was. Leave on the valve spring.I don't want them to have to do that. I see stick guys run heavy and they go in first and bring up the rpm by foot and wait. They are able to race like that. I just want things left alone. Why was deep staging made illegal anyway? Was it for the cortusey staging? If thats the case leave everything alone, and let guys go deep, but don't hold the tree for them. There job to be in first. Like I said in the begining, I just want to leave things alone.

Todd Hoven
1035 Stk

Jim Bailey · 08-05-2007, 12:43 PM

Hey Guys, back to my original post. NHRA has stated, in last weeks National Dragster, that adjustable buttons have "Delay" capablilities. Therefore, in 2008, SS and Comp. will have only approved buttons for use with their Trans. Brakes.
Has "Stock" been over looked ? Aren't the same buttons used for Two Steps in Stock? Aren't Delay devices illegal in Stock?
Two Steps and buttons probably aren't going anywhere.( The Pro Sportsmen Racers would go broke, lol.) But doesn't this new ruling by NHRA make adjustable buttons -"officially" - delay devices?

08-05-2007, 01:22 PM

Those Hydralic buttons I beleve can create enough delay to leave off the top. With a transbrake it works just like that, but letting off the foot brake it will never work, the car will roll before the 2 step is deactivated. Why would you want that? The 2 step works because the car leaves harder, and it is easier to hit the tree( car reacts quicker. we cant run a transbrake in stock. So whats the difference? I run a railroad microswitch no delay.

Todd Hoven
1035 STK

tgriffith · 08-05-2007, 01:26 PM

jim,,,I would assume that anything that is illegal in superstock,,,would be illegal in stock,,,,IF Im thinking correctly ,, isnt superstock is a continuation of stock???,,,,,,Dont know if Im getting this across in words or not but I could make a good arguement in person,,,,,cant talk on keyboard well enough with my hands (LOL)

tgriffith · 08-05-2007, 01:45 PM

Todd,,The rule has been grossly mis interpeted for the last few year,,,,,tech officials have explained the rule was wrote to address the point that there could be no delay between the release of the button and the item it controled,,,,,,OK,,,here is the confusion,,,,,,,,the release of the button is NOT WHEN YOU MOVE,,,but WHEN THE BUTTON RELEASES,,,,,,now that plainly is the dumbest explaination of anything I have ever seen,,,,,,,It was explained to me that it doesnt matter if the button sticks,,,,as long as when it does release,,,there isnt any measureable,,adjustable delay,,,,,,,,,,,so help me,,there must have been an attorney and a hypnotist convince a tech offiicial of this,,,,,,now they have awaken and realized,,,,maybe we were wrong in our thinking (go figure),,,, My thinking that if a .40 button is delay,, then so is a .05 button,,,,,delay is delay ,,no matter what the time,,,,,,,I do understand that there has to be some because its mechanical BUT the adjustable button should be banned,,,,,,,,you buy a spec button and you have what you have...........if they dont ban them in stock,,,,,,,,,,,but this brings us to another issue,,,,,,,what about adjustable RPM`s??? I mean without an adjustable button,,,,you can just raise or lower RPM`s and still have a large amount of adjustable RT control

on the line lock deal,,,you not limited on what buttons can go where in stock,,,,,,all you do is put 2 longtrhow buttons side by side,,,,and release both at the same time,,,,rules dont say anythng about long throw buttons hooked to the line lock,,,,to release both at the same time,,,a thin bar connecting them together across the top works fine,,,,,rules say they cant be wired together,,,well there not,,,,but they still work together,,,,,,,,,,they only way to get an end to all this is to ban the 2 steps/buttons.......or Im with Chip,,,either ban them OR let delay boxes be legal,,,,,,,,go one way or the other

08-05-2007, 02:43 PM

Mark, Jim ,Tim, Todd Doug and everyother stocker racer...

Let's just get rid of two-steps in stock and go-back to truth foot-brake racing !!!!! You know at alot of NHRA/IHRA bracket tracks you can't run two-steps in brackets, seems strange doesn't it ??? I would say get rid of all electronics (buttons, two-steps, etc) .. I don't care if sticks have them or not, but I guess we should get ready for the next MOVE..That will be dropping some lower classes and combining Sticks with Auto for a better Show... Remember thats what this is all about, not winning or losing but putting on a good SHOW..... Yes, I know the same guys will keep winning, so why make it easier for them..But don't tell me there isn't an advantage, again !!!
Two-steps / buttons just make them much better... Lets hear it ??
Big brother (NHRA) will tell us in time what we can do ......... Dave...1033/Stock (RV-455)

Robert Bullard · 08-05-2007, 03:14 PM

regular GT and super stock guys had better hope nhra approves the long button. i see lots of super stock modified cars running a non adjustible short button. must be a transmission thing.

08-05-2007, 04:12 PM

I don't care if sticks have them or not, but I guess we should get ready for the next MOVE..That will be dropping some lower classes and combining Sticks with Auto for a better Show.

If we are in the same class as the sticks next year, I want the 2 step if they have em. If no eletronics have it across the board. They can adjust there light with airgap in the clutch, and rpm. That is the same as saying we can kill .03 with a button. Now Here is the problem with the Bracket races at the local tracks. Now you need a 20K and up heavy car to compete. At my local tracks ATCO, ISLAND, ETOWN. The average heavy car runs 9.80 at 140+ They Deep stage and make the car run a 1.6 + 60 ft and roll like a freight train at the other end. It never spins and the can have almost no roll out. the 11 second bracket car is very outclassed now adays. Super Pro you need a 50K car that can run 180 MPH. There are issues with running NHRA OR IHRA PRO ET. So if the bracket race deal is so great how come more and more guys are coming here. At least you can build a 10 K stocker and race and have a chance. LETS LEAVE THE ELEMINATOR ALONE....

Todd Hoven
STK 1035

Chip THELEGEND Johnson · 08-05-2007, 05:43 PM

Show me a competitive 10K stocker. I'll buy it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Chip

08-05-2007, 06:18 PM

Don Himes just sold his 1.10 under P/sa Grandprix for 11K. so I'm off by a thousand. You can buy Morgan's P/sa Olds Cutlass for 14K. There are others as well that come up. NHRA Stockers anyway.

Todd Hoven
1035 STK

08-05-2007, 11:26 AM	#51
Todd1153 Guest Posts: n/a	Re: What about STOCK ? Mark, I thought back in the day, all the stick guys rugged it and let the clutch out where ever the rpm was. Leave on the valve spring.I don't want them to have to do that. I see stick guys run heavy and they go in first and bring up the rpm by foot and wait. They are able to race like that. I just want things left alone. Why was deep staging made illegal anyway? Was it for the cortusey staging? If thats the case leave everything alone, and let guys go deep, but don't hold the tree for them. There job to be in first. Like I said in the begining, I just want to leave things alone. Todd Hoven 1035 Stk

08-05-2007, 12:43 PM	#52
Jim Bailey Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 674 Likes: 15 Liked 584 Times in 94 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Hey Guys, back to my original post. NHRA has stated, in last weeks National Dragster, that adjustable buttons have "Delay" capablilities. Therefore, in 2008, SS and Comp. will have only approved buttons for use with their Trans. Brakes. Has "Stock" been over looked ? Aren't the same buttons used for Two Steps in Stock? Aren't Delay devices illegal in Stock? Two Steps and buttons probably aren't going anywhere.( The Pro Sportsmen Racers would go broke, lol.) But doesn't this new ruling by NHRA make adjustable buttons -"officially" - delay devices?

08-05-2007, 01:22 PM	#53
Todd1153 Guest Posts: n/a	Re: What about STOCK ? Those Hydralic buttons I beleve can create enough delay to leave off the top. With a transbrake it works just like that, but letting off the foot brake it will never work, the car will roll before the 2 step is deactivated. Why would you want that? The 2 step works because the car leaves harder, and it is easier to hit the tree( car reacts quicker. we cant run a transbrake in stock. So whats the difference? I run a railroad microswitch no delay. Todd Hoven 1035 STK

08-05-2007, 01:26 PM	#54
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? jim,,,I would assume that anything that is illegal in superstock,,,would be illegal in stock,,,,IF Im thinking correctly ,, isnt superstock is a continuation of stock???,,,,,,Dont know if Im getting this across in words or not but I could make a good arguement in person,,,,,cant talk on keyboard well enough with my hands (LOL)

08-05-2007, 01:45 PM	#55
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Todd,,The rule has been grossly mis interpeted for the last few year,,,,,tech officials have explained the rule was wrote to address the point that there could be no delay between the release of the button and the item it controled,,,,,,OK,,,here is the confusion,,,,,,,,the release of the button is NOT WHEN YOU MOVE,,,but WHEN THE BUTTON RELEASES,,,,,,now that plainly is the dumbest explaination of anything I have ever seen,,,,,,,It was explained to me that it doesnt matter if the button sticks,,,,as long as when it does release,,,there isnt any measureable,,adjustable delay,,,,,,,,,,,so help me,,there must have been an attorney and a hypnotist convince a tech offiicial of this,,,,,,now they have awaken and realized,,,,maybe we were wrong in our thinking (go figure),,,, My thinking that if a .40 button is delay,, then so is a .05 button,,,,,delay is delay ,,no matter what the time,,,,,,,I do understand that there has to be some because its mechanical BUT the adjustable button should be banned,,,,,,,,you buy a spec button and you have what you have...........if they dont ban them in stock,,,,,,,,,,,but this brings us to another issue,,,,,,,what about adjustable RPM`s??? I mean without an adjustable button,,,,you can just raise or lower RPM`s and still have a large amount of adjustable RT control on the line lock deal,,,you not limited on what buttons can go where in stock,,,,,,all you do is put 2 longtrhow buttons side by side,,,,and release both at the same time,,,,rules dont say anythng about long throw buttons hooked to the line lock,,,,to release both at the same time,,,a thin bar connecting them together across the top works fine,,,,,rules say they cant be wired together,,,well there not,,,,but they still work together,,,,,,,,,,they only way to get an end to all this is to ban the 2 steps/buttons.......or Im with Chip,,,either ban them OR let delay boxes be legal,,,,,,,,go one way or the other

08-05-2007, 02:43 PM	#56
RIBEIRO RACING Guest Posts: n/a	Re: What about STOCK ? Mark, Jim ,Tim, Todd Doug and everyother stocker racer... Let's just get rid of two-steps in stock and go-back to truth foot-brake racing !!!!! You know at alot of NHRA/IHRA bracket tracks you can't run two-steps in brackets, seems strange doesn't it ??? I would say get rid of all electronics (buttons, two-steps, etc) .. I don't care if sticks have them or not, but I guess we should get ready for the next MOVE..That will be dropping some lower classes and combining Sticks with Auto for a better Show... Remember thats what this is all about, not winning or losing but putting on a good SHOW..... Yes, I know the same guys will keep winning, so why make it easier for them..But don't tell me there isn't an advantage, again !!! Two-steps / buttons just make them much better... Lets hear it ?? Big brother (NHRA) will tell us in time what we can do ......... Dave...1033/Stock (RV-455)

08-05-2007, 03:14 PM	#57
Robert Bullard Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 43 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? regular GT and super stock guys had better hope nhra approves the long button. i see lots of super stock modified cars running a non adjustible short button. must be a transmission thing.

08-05-2007, 04:12 PM	#58
Todd1153 Guest Posts: n/a	Re: What about STOCK ? I don't care if sticks have them or not, but I guess we should get ready for the next MOVE..That will be dropping some lower classes and combining Sticks with Auto for a better Show. If we are in the same class as the sticks next year, I want the 2 step if they have em. If no eletronics have it across the board. They can adjust there light with airgap in the clutch, and rpm. That is the same as saying we can kill .03 with a button. Now Here is the problem with the Bracket races at the local tracks. Now you need a 20K and up heavy car to compete. At my local tracks ATCO, ISLAND, ETOWN. The average heavy car runs 9.80 at 140+ They Deep stage and make the car run a 1.6 + 60 ft and roll like a freight train at the other end. It never spins and the can have almost no roll out. the 11 second bracket car is very outclassed now adays. Super Pro you need a 50K car that can run 180 MPH. There are issues with running NHRA OR IHRA PRO ET. So if the bracket race deal is so great how come more and more guys are coming here. At least you can build a 10 K stocker and race and have a chance. LETS LEAVE THE ELEMINATOR ALONE.... Todd Hoven STK 1035 Last edited by Todd1153; 08-05-2007 at 06:18 PM.

08-05-2007, 05:43 PM	#59
Chip THELEGEND Johnson Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 284 Likes: 223 Liked 281 Times in 79 Posts	Re: What about STOCK ? Show me a competitive 10K stocker. I'll buy it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Chip

08-05-2007, 06:18 PM	#60
Todd1153 Guest Posts: n/a	Re: What about STOCK ? Don Himes just sold his 1.10 under P/sa Grandprix for 11K. so I'm off by a thousand. You can buy Morgan's P/sa Olds Cutlass for 14K. There are others as well that come up. NHRA Stockers anyway. Todd Hoven 1035 STK