Stocker Cylinder Heads.... - Page 7

69Cobra · 06-18-2012, 11:56 AM

...

Tony Janes · 06-18-2012, 01:34 PM

There is a simple answer. If the chambers and runners check the head is legal, any of story.

Mike Fuller · 06-18-2012, 03:59 PM

Here's a little more fuel for the fire.

http://www.castheads.com/cylinder-he...g-services.php

Jim Bailey · 06-18-2012, 07:18 PM

Per Tony James: if the chambers check CC, and the runners check CC.... ie : Stevie Wonder and Ray Charles ....it's legal

Rich Biebel · 06-18-2012, 08:09 PM

CYLINDER HEADS
Must be correct casting number for year and horsepower claimed,
per NHRA Technical Bulletins or NHRA accepted. Porting,
polishing, welding, epoxying and acid-porting prohibited.
Combustion-chamber modifications prohibited. Cylinder heads are
additionally restricted in that they must retain original-size valves at
original angles +/- 1 degree and must be able to hold original
cylinder-head volume per NHRA Specifications. Runner volumes
may not exceed the current Super Stock cylinder-head volumes as
listed on www.NHRARacer.com. Regardless of the poured volume
measurement, any modifications to intake or exhaust runners
prohibited. Any evidence of modifications from the original castings
will be grounds for disqualifications as determined by NHRA in
NHRA’s sole and absolute discretion. Any aftermarket steel valve
permitted, must retain stock head and stem diameters. Only
engines OEM-equipped with sodium-filled valves may use sodiumfilled
replacement valves. Titanium prohibited. Hardened keepers
permitted. Lash caps prohibited. Valve-diameter tolerance: +.005-
inch or -.015-inch from NHRA Specs. The following are prohibited:
spark-plug adapters; cylinder-head studs; any grinding in ports or
combustion chambers; removal of any flashings; sandblasting or
any other modification to cylinder head; any film coating of intake
and exhaust runners; any film coating of combustion chamber.
Runners and combustion chamber must retain OEM appearance.
Final acceptance as determined by NHRA in NHRA’s sole and
absolute discretion. Intake side of head may not be cut into any part
of valve cover bolt holes. Heat riser passage may be blocked from
intake manifold side of cylinder head. Blocking passage down in
valve pocket prohibited. The following are permitted: polylocks, jam
nuts, screw-in larger-diameter rocker studs or pinned studs, bronzewall
valve guides. Valve spring umbrellas optional. Cylinder head
may have all of the seats replaced. Any valve job permitted,Oringing
prohibited. Exhaust plates prohibited.

Forgive my ignorance but nowhere in any rulebook today or ever has it said a Stock cylinder head was legal as long as it CC'ed right on the chamber and ports. This stuff is one of the reasons I don't run stock even though I have......

In the '60 s when I first started racing Stock.....just about any cylinder head that showed up on a table in a teardown barn with some of these modifcations mentioned would have been bounced in a NY minute.......

davidhuff · 06-18-2012, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Bailey

Per Tony James: if the chambers check CC, and the runners check CC.... ie : Stevie Wonder and Ray Charles ....it's legal

I am sure you are just kidding!

06-18-2012, 09:38 PM

And they caught everything???? Nobody ever got away with any cylinder head work? The Monster Mash car that was as fast a A cars, that ran as fast as super stock cars back in the mid 60 was just tuned better than most? Jenkins was just, jetting and tuning a second better than anybody else? Its all bull sh*&. Guys maybe got away with less, but they still got away with stuff. I feel that the 60's and 70's were the best time to race our classes, but i don't believe it was without controversy, and guys bending the rules.
I thought the Jr Stock were out of controll with mods and thats why they reeled the class back in. All the 50's cars were kicked out and that was final. We are almost 40 years removed from that season. Is stock class all that bad now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Biebel

CYLINDER HEADS
Must be correct casting number for year and horsepower claimed,
per NHRA Technical Bulletins or NHRA accepted. Porting,
polishing, welding, epoxying and acid-porting prohibited.
Combustion-chamber modifications prohibited. Cylinder heads are
additionally restricted in that they must retain original-size valves at
original angles +/- 1 degree and must be able to hold original
cylinder-head volume per NHRA Specifications. Runner volumes
may not exceed the current Super Stock cylinder-head volumes as
listed on www.NHRARacer.com. Regardless of the poured volume
measurement, any modifications to intake or exhaust runners
prohibited. Any evidence of modifications from the original castings
will be grounds for disqualifications as determined by NHRA in
NHRA’s sole and absolute discretion. Any aftermarket steel valve
permitted, must retain stock head and stem diameters. Only
engines OEM-equipped with sodium-filled valves may use sodiumfilled
replacement valves. Titanium prohibited. Hardened keepers
permitted. Lash caps prohibited. Valve-diameter tolerance: +.005-
inch or -.015-inch from NHRA Specs. The following are prohibited:
spark-plug adapters; cylinder-head studs; any grinding in ports or
combustion chambers; removal of any flashings; sandblasting or
any other modification to cylinder head; any film coating of intake
and exhaust runners; any film coating of combustion chamber.
Runners and combustion chamber must retain OEM appearance.
Final acceptance as determined by NHRA in NHRA’s sole and
absolute discretion. Intake side of head may not be cut into any part
of valve cover bolt holes. Heat riser passage may be blocked from
intake manifold side of cylinder head. Blocking passage down in
valve pocket prohibited. The following are permitted: polylocks, jam
nuts, screw-in larger-diameter rocker studs or pinned studs, bronzewall
valve guides. Valve spring umbrellas optional. Cylinder head
may have all of the seats replaced. Any valve job permitted,Oringing
prohibited. Exhaust plates prohibited.

Forgive my ignorance but nowhere in any rulebook today or ever has it said a Stock cylinder head was legal as long as it CC'ed right on the chamber and ports. This stuff is one of the reasons I don't run stock even though I have......

In the '60 s when I first started racing Stock.....just about any cylinder head that showed up on a table in a teardown barn with some of these modifcations mentioned would have been bounced in a NY minute.......

Rich Biebel · 06-18-2012, 10:21 PM

Maybe you need to check your facts Todd..

The Monster Mash was a 265 in a 55 Chevy with a 3 speed.....Lots of other cars just like it were also fast back than and if any of them had bogus heads like today and set a record they would have been thown the hell out......When we raced against the Monster Mash it was a 14 or 15 second car....

Did guys cheat and bend the rules and get away with it.....Well I am sure they did....but most didn't for fear of being caught.

I raced 2 cars from 1966 to 1970. Both were legal and ran pretty close to what most other cars of the day ran or faster.

I never said anything was wrong with Stock......
People like myself are just pointing out the way the rulebook is written about heads....

Ask Walter what he thinks....

Billy Nees · 06-19-2012, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Biebel

Did guys cheat and bend the rules and get away with it.....Well I am sure they did....but most didn't for fear of being caught....

Umm, something else to think about, almost every local track ran class and (that you had to win to get into) eliminations every weekend and you could be protested and torn down at any event. Just that would tend to make you either very good at cheating or very legal. It also made the Tech Inspectors very good at what they do.
Today you're as likely to hit the lottery as to be torn down unless you plan on going to Indy and then your chances are what, 5 %?

PJ305 · 06-19-2012, 09:02 AM

" Any valve job permitted " What does that really mean? In old rule books NHRA gave you an example of what an accepted 3 angle was supposed to look like along with measurements. If you have small intake runners to keep velocity up, are you allowed to put your heads on a serdi machine and open up the bottom angle as big as you want with a cutter off the valve guide and still be legal under there new any valve job rule? You did not grind, sandblast, acid port, shot peen or anything else, you simply did a fancy valve job on a machine with cutters off the valve guide. Will NHRA tech allow this if the runner cc checks or will this be a gray area judgement call " the famous I don't like the way it looks " I don't think Wade or any of us want to here that phrase anymore.

06-18-2012, 11:56 AM	#61
69Cobra Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: California, Ky Posts: 669 Likes: 61 Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... ... __________________ Kris Rachford 69 Cobra 428CJ 4 Speed C/S 3032 Last edited by 69Cobra; 06-18-2012 at 11:59 AM.

06-18-2012, 01:34 PM	#62
Tony Janes Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Whittier, Ca Posts: 830 Likes: 94 Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... There is a simple answer. If the chambers and runners check the head is legal, any of story. __________________ Tony Janes 7941 STK, SS

06-18-2012, 03:59 PM	#63
Mike Fuller Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 951 Likes: 561 Liked 198 Times in 79 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... Here's a little more fuel for the fire. http://www.castheads.com/cylinder-he...g-services.php __________________ Mike Fuller 396 STK 3961 SS

06-18-2012, 07:18 PM	#64
Jim Bailey Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 674 Likes: 15 Liked 584 Times in 94 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... Per Tony James: if the chambers check CC, and the runners check CC.... ie : Stevie Wonder and Ray Charles ....it's legal

06-18-2012, 08:09 PM	#65
Rich Biebel VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern New Jersey suburbs Posts: 2,314 Likes: 25 Liked 544 Times in 213 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... CYLINDER HEADS Must be correct casting number for year and horsepower claimed, per NHRA Technical Bulletins or NHRA accepted. Porting, polishing, welding, epoxying and acid-porting prohibited. Combustion-chamber modifications prohibited. Cylinder heads are additionally restricted in that they must retain original-size valves at original angles +/- 1 degree and must be able to hold original cylinder-head volume per NHRA Specifications. Runner volumes may not exceed the current Super Stock cylinder-head volumes as listed on www.NHRARacer.com. Regardless of the poured volume measurement, any modifications to intake or exhaust runners prohibited. Any evidence of modifications from the original castings will be grounds for disqualifications as determined by NHRA in NHRA’s sole and absolute discretion. Any aftermarket steel valve permitted, must retain stock head and stem diameters. Only engines OEM-equipped with sodium-filled valves may use sodiumfilled replacement valves. Titanium prohibited. Hardened keepers permitted. Lash caps prohibited. Valve-diameter tolerance: +.005- inch or -.015-inch from NHRA Specs. The following are prohibited: spark-plug adapters; cylinder-head studs; any grinding in ports or combustion chambers; removal of any flashings; sandblasting or any other modification to cylinder head; any film coating of intake and exhaust runners; any film coating of combustion chamber. Runners and combustion chamber must retain OEM appearance. Final acceptance as determined by NHRA in NHRA’s sole and absolute discretion. Intake side of head may not be cut into any part of valve cover bolt holes. Heat riser passage may be blocked from intake manifold side of cylinder head. Blocking passage down in valve pocket prohibited. The following are permitted: polylocks, jam nuts, screw-in larger-diameter rocker studs or pinned studs, bronzewall valve guides. Valve spring umbrellas optional. Cylinder head may have all of the seats replaced. Any valve job permitted,Oringing prohibited. Exhaust plates prohibited. Forgive my ignorance but nowhere in any rulebook today or ever has it said a Stock cylinder head was legal as long as it CC'ed right on the chamber and ports. This stuff is one of the reasons I don't run stock even though I have...... In the '60 s when I first started racing Stock.....just about any cylinder head that showed up on a table in a teardown barn with some of these modifcations mentioned would have been bounced in a NY minute....... __________________ Rich Biebel S/C 1479 Stock 147R

06-18-2012, 10:21 PM	#68
Rich Biebel VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern New Jersey suburbs Posts: 2,314 Likes: 25 Liked 544 Times in 213 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... Maybe you need to check your facts Todd.. The Monster Mash was a 265 in a 55 Chevy with a 3 speed.....Lots of other cars just like it were also fast back than and if any of them had bogus heads like today and set a record they would have been thown the hell out......When we raced against the Monster Mash it was a 14 or 15 second car.... Did guys cheat and bend the rules and get away with it.....Well I am sure they did....but most didn't for fear of being caught. I raced 2 cars from 1966 to 1970. Both were legal and ran pretty close to what most other cars of the day ran or faster. I never said anything was wrong with Stock...... People like myself are just pointing out the way the rulebook is written about heads.... Ask Walter what he thinks.... __________________ Rich Biebel S/C 1479 Stock 147R

06-19-2012, 09:02 AM	#70
PJ305 Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 137 Likes: 0 Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Stocker Cylinder Heads.... " Any valve job permitted " What does that really mean? In old rule books NHRA gave you an example of what an accepted 3 angle was supposed to look like along with measurements. If you have small intake runners to keep velocity up, are you allowed to put your heads on a serdi machine and open up the bottom angle as big as you want with a cutter off the valve guide and still be legal under there new any valve job rule? You did not grind, sandblast, acid port, shot peen or anything else, you simply did a fancy valve job on a machine with cutters off the valve guide. Will NHRA tech allow this if the runner cc checks or will this be a gray area judgement call " the famous I don't like the way it looks " I don't think Wade or any of us want to here that phrase anymore.