Indy Class ...Enhanced !

[Mark Yacavone]

Mr.Bailey brings up a great point here. One , I feel should be addressed through the SRC.

Now, I promise this will be the last post here, from me, about the Ff f fords.

I was asked a question here, and I had to research it through an unimpeachable source.
I believe this is what Mr.Gump was fishing for:

In 1997 , a new clause was added to the rule book, to allow special run, small batches of factory promotional toys to be allowed to run in Stock. Shortly thereafter, the 1993 Cobra R was entered into the class guide. I think I know who may have asked for it but it is irrelevant here.
The Cobra R combo was built in house, using various hi-po parts and deletions, @ 107 units there of. It had a VIN, was emissions legal, and was delivered through Ford dealers. Yes, you had to have a drag racing associated I.D. to purchase one.

Ff f forward to 2008, 50th anniversary of the original Cobra Jets. Fifty units were completed by Gapp and Roush. Unavailable to the public engine combo, roll cage, safety bell housing, spool and axles, etc. No VIN, not sold to the public through dealers, etc. You know the drill.
Mopar then followed suit, and then GM with the COPO's. We'll never know who's palm was crossed with what, today, but I believe this was the beginning of the non-stock Stockers. It's a real stretch to try to bring it back to 1997, in my opinion.

I'd suggest , for those who want to comment further on the FX cars, start a new thread or bring back an old one from the archives.
Over...

[BRETV]

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

Mr.Bailey brings up a great point here. One , I feel should be addressed through the SRC.

Now, I promise this will be the last post here, from me, about the Ff f fords.

I was asked a question here, and I had to research it through an unimpeachable source.
I believe this is what Mr.Gump was fishing for:

In 1997 , a new clause was added to the rule book, to allow special run, small batches of factory promotional toys to be allowed to run in Stock. Shortly thereafter, the 1993 Cobra R was entered into the class guide. I think I know who may have asked for it but it is irrelevant here.
The Cobra R combo was built in house, using various hi-po parts and deletions, @ 107 units there of. It had a VIN, was emissions legal, and was delivered through Ford dealers. Yes, you had to have a drag racing associated I.D. to purchase one.

Ff f forward to 2008, 50th anniversary of the original Cobra Jets. Fifty units were completed by Gapp and Roush. Unavailable to the public engine combo, roll cage, safety bell housing, spool and axles, etc. No VIN, not sold to the public through dealers, etc. You know the drill.
Mopar then followed suit, and then GM with the COPO's. We'll never know who's palm was crossed with what, today, but I believe this was the beginning of the non-stock Stockers. It's a real stretch to try to bring it back to 1997, in my opinion.

I'd suggest , for those who want to comment further on the FX cars, start a new thread or bring back an old one from the archives.
Over...

Actually, late in 1996 we wrote a letter to NHRA to allow us to run a 95 Cobra R in Stock, which they made 250 units. They allowed it and changed the rule in 1997.




Bret Velde
2003 SS/LA

[GUMP]

Mark,

I know when and what changed. My point was that no rule change was needed to add the factory cars. The racers themselves pushed for everything that opened the door.

Way back when Dale's site was the place to be I voiced my objections to many of those changes and received the same kind of replies that I have gotten on here.

Since I purchased my first COPO we have received the gift of roller rockers, any valve spring, and solid lifters. If asked, I would have said no to all three. But, I wasn't asked. All that does is drive up costs.

If you want to talk bogus I have a 1988 Cutlass that never had a VIN. It started at 138 HP and is now at 207 HP!!

Brett,

Is that the car that Beaver had for a while?

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by GUMP

Mark,

I know when and what changed. My point was that no rule change was needed to add the factory cars. The racers themselves pushed for everything that opened the door.

Way back when Dale's site was the place to be I voiced my objections to many of those changes and received the same kind of replies that I have gotten on here.

Since I purchased my first COPO we have received the gift of roller rockers, any valve spring, and solid lifters. If asked, I would have said no to all three. But, I wasn't asked. All that does is drive up costs.

If you want to talk bogus I have a 1988 Cutlass that never had a VIN. It started at 138 HP and is now at 207 HP!!

Brett,

Is that the car that Beaver had for a while?

I think you're putting the cart before the horse here. I don't know of any people who were racing in stock in 2008 , that asked for factory sponsored, special built 100K Stockers. In fact ,those cars might be part of the reason that everybody got roller rockers, eventually.
Yes, I know about the no VIN cars. I drove a couple of them. They were pilot cars off the front of the line that were used for test purposes. I mentioned that only for comparison's sake..Cobra R vs. 2008 CJ's, etc.
Enough with this hijack, okay?

[BRETV]

Originally Posted by GUMP

Mark,

I know when and what changed. My point was that no rule change was needed to add the factory cars. The racers themselves pushed for everything that opened the door.

Way back when Dale's site was the place to be I voiced my objections to many of those changes and received the same kind of replies that I have gotten on here.

Since I purchased my first COPO we have received the gift of roller rockers, any valve spring, and solid lifters. If asked, I would have said no to all three. But, I wasn't asked. All that does is drive up costs.

If you want to talk bogus I have a 1988 Cutlass that never had a VIN. It started at 138 HP and is now at 207 HP!!

Brett,

Is that the car that Beaver had for a while?

No, we raced it for a couple years and sold it to one of our employees and he still has the car today





Bret Velde
2003 SS/LA

[Bruce Noland]

Originally Posted by GUMP

Nobody playing dumb here. My point is the same as it has always been. The rules did not change to allow these cars that you hate so much into the guide. All of those things that were changed to suit guys like you over the years in the name of safety and reliability opened that door.

I will remind you that Chevrolet didn't build any third generation Corvettes with solid rear ends. Of course you know that. Just like I know that I am wasting my time replying to your BS.

There is nothing bogus about the new combinations. My COPO is no more cutting edge than a 1969 COPO was in it's day.

As far as the horse power goes, it is no different today than it has ever been. No manufacturer wants their new combinations on the bottom of the ladder. It's funny that we never see you crying over some "Dime Rocket" combination that makes a joke out of qualifying. By your logic, that guy is pure evil.

It also amazes me that you are such a big man on the key board. You weren't nearly so big with your mouth when I came over to see you at Gainesville a few years ago. I, for one, have never been out to get you or any other guy driving an old car. I am however getting tired of your troll like ways.

Now look at you. I'm away for three days and you are all bad a**!

Lets start with the big mouth part first. You didn't come over to me at Gainesville. We were in the lanes getting ready to run class and we had a candid conversation about the way we felt about these cars with no vitriol from either one of us. You certainly didn't have your little chest all pumped out at the time and I'm surprised to read your creative account of our discussion. As I remember our race didn't go so well for you.

The solid rear ends were allowed in Corvettes because as an axle ripped through the fiberglass floor or a Corvette while racing and destroyed a racers arm. So, yes safety is important.

I like the dime rockets, they were production cars and don't represent institutional cheating by the OEM's.

On the other hand you represent all that is bad about this sport. Buying your way in with a bogus car and trying to blow smoke about it when we all know the truth. The rules do not have to change when a system is corrupted by the OEM's.

I'll be at Indy. Maybe we can visit in the lanes again.

[GUMP]

Originally Posted by Bruce Noland

Now look at you. I'm away for three days and you are all bad a**!

Not at all.

Lets start with the big mouth part first. You didn't come over to me at Gainesville. We were in the lanes getting ready to run class and we had a candid conversation about the way we felt about these cars with no vitriol from either one of us. You certainly didn't have your little chest all pumped out at the time and I'm surprised to read your creative account of our discussion. As I remember our race didn't go so well for you.

I remember it exactly the way you do. I really wasn't expecting it to be that easy going as you had been giving me the same attitude on here then as you are now. As far as the race, it is still one of my favorite runs ever. I got great photos!

The solid rear ends were allowed in Corvettes because as an axle ripped through the fiberglass floor or a Corvette while racing and destroyed a racers arm. So, yes safety is important.

I am not arguing with that. But, it opened the door for what came later on the newer Corvettes and GTOs, which opened the door for what has been allowed for the 2008 up cars.

I like the dime rockets, they were production cars and don't represent institutional cheating by the OEM's.

I like them too. I don't agree with the last part. Jesse posted a letter from NHRA to him (on Facebook) that was written in 2008. It doesn't show any of the narrative that you have been pushing.

On the other hand you represent all that is bad about this sport. Buying your way in with a bogus car and trying to blow smoke about it when we all know the truth. The rules do not have to change when a system is corrupted by the OEM's.

You are welcome to your opinion. For the record, I was racing Stock long before the new cars. Also, when you beat me at Gainesville, pretty much everything in the car was home grown.

I'll be at Indy. Maybe we can visit in the lanes again.

Free country.

[Jim Bailey]

….Wow … I'll be at Indy too. As a spectator. I was just hoping to see the classes, run as classes, during class eliminations.... I'm getting old, just trying to make things less complicated...…. Maybe next year, ( if I can get doctor clearance ), I can be part of this madness... Then again, not sure I want too.

[Billy Nees]

So one of the manufacturers greased one (or all) of the NHRA board members. So what, it's not like it hasn't happened before. Let us get back to the subject of Class at Indy!

[Jack McCarthy]

ill do my best if the COMET shows up on time ill try to find the R/SA guys and follow them out ...

figure T/SA gremlin guy is bringing his dragpak instead

seeya thursday guys > im sure another HP gifted FFFord is gonna beat me again, but hey why should i complain as this thread shows us NHRA dont care about rules or fairness just that $360 the181 of us ponied up (thats $65,160 if you are counting, i am) !!!