What would it take for you to attend a Sportsman Race

[B Parker]

Alan all good points. With Ken and Tim not doing their race this year maybe it will open more eyes. Gainesville should also be an eye opener. This is the direction our Classes are going. BP

[Stephen & Horace Johnson]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Barry,
I'm sure that you know, Mike is a Division 2 racer. A long time Division 2 racer. The tough thing about Division 2 is that maybe half of the racers are in southern Georgia, southern Alabama, or Florida, and we know how far south Florida goes. That's the problem with Division 2.


But yes, racers let these races down. Regardless of location.


Here's the deal, the more I think about it, the more that I believe it is true.


A race that cannot yield a wally is apparently never going to compete with one that can, for a large portion of the Stock and Super Stock racers. They're going to drive further for a shot at a wally, on the same weekend, or on a different weekend. For the same or less money.



We ran the SportsNational Open one year, against, if I remember correctly, a rescheduled LODRS in Atlanta. While the SportsNational Open outdrew the Atlanta race, which did poorly, there were a ton of racers, Division 3 racers, who literally drove right past the SportsNational Open at Bowling Green to get to Atlanta. The payout at Bowling Green was the same. It was an NHRA event. As a bonus, NitroPlate paid at least $5000 to win the Saturday night Clay Jones combo.


Independent races apparently cannot compete with the wally, for a lot of Stock and Super Stock racers. Even with more money. Even with a better atmosphere. With better treatment. With more chances to win more money. Apparently, if you beat the exact same 6-8 guys to win a race, the race with the wally means something, the other race doesn't. Regardless of pay. I suppose it is a fact that we all have to learn to live with. There is a large percentage of our group that will literally skip a closer, well funded independent race, on a pretty weekend, to use that money and/or time off, to drive further, to an NHRA race where they're treated as riff raff, and paid less. Sad but true.




The best thing that we can do is understand that fact, and figure out if there is a way that anyone can successfully put on an independent race, or races, and make it financially viable. It's a tough economy, which makes sponsors recalcitrant, or hesitant at best. Without sponsors, who will demand serious car counts, it's impossible. Maybe someone will be willing to answer this question: At $250 to enter, how many racers does it take to make a 2-3 day independent race a better than break even deal?

Yep that year, my dad , my son and I drove 5 hours instead of 2.5hours. We had a great time as always at BG

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by Timothy Fletcher

After doing this with Ken for 3 years here is what we've learned it takes...

•It has to be at a facility that is reasonably close to everyone in the country.
-but the facility has to be flat and level for parking.
-and the facility has to be "fast".
-but the facility has to be easy to get to from the highway.

•It has to be a weekend that you can loop it with another race.
-but it can't be too close to other races because then it’s too many in a row
-and it can’t be too early in the season because no one is ready
-but then it can’t be too late because then everyone has encountered problems
-but then it can’t be in the middle because there’s too many races
-and it can’t be this weekend or that weekend because it’s my nephews bar mitzvah

•It has to be a weekend with a good forecast.
-but then it can’t be too hot because then it’s too hot
-and then it can’t have a 1% chance of rain because then people don’t want to sit in the rain
-but then it can’t have a head wind because then the cars go slow
-and then it can’t be too sunny because then it’s too hot

•It has to be a reasonable entry fee for reasonable pay.
-but then it can’t cost too much because a lot of racers are on a budget
-and it can’t cost too little because then it’s not worth the wear and tear
(basically, it needs to be $15 to enter and $15,000 to win)

•It has to be on the weekend because people can’t take off work.
-but then it can’t start Friday because people have work
-and then it can’t start early Saturday because people don’t want to drive through the night Friday after work to get there
-but then it can’t end late Sunday because people have work Monday

With all due respect and no offense, THERE IS NOTHING ANYONE CAN DO TO PLEASE THE STK/SS COMMUNITY. You all deserve NHRA and the **** they put you through.
$350 or $200 to enter
$100 for your wife
3–4-day long events
1 race
BUT A WALLY!

See "ya'll" at Gainesville!

AZ S/SS Double Header combo this past weekend...
20 cars ,Saturday, 16 Sunday...Trophies, package awards, cash on the barrel head...Good , tight racing...and that's all we can get for a turnout?
Pathetic, in my opinion..
I talked to the Hawk Brothers before they did their first race. I told them AZ would be an uphill battle all the way. You'll get your 12-13 dedicated supporters, your few who can make some of the races, and some who you'll never see.

Okay, so let's set aside AZ racers for a moment. Tucson is not real close to much of anything else. SoCal about 400 mi. Vegas? About the same.
But here's the thing..There will be 150 or so S/SS cars a hundred miles up the road by tomorrow.
So, if they want to put all their eggs in one basket, in pursuit of the Wally, all well and good. But if NHRA Sportsman ever goes away, some of these independent races won't be around. I can tell you that for a fact.

[David Lee]

a track, do you think the tock racers in california could get a combo or series at bakersfieild?

[Larry Hill]

The best bet is a timely race at St. Louis before or after Indy. Don’t bother going to Earlville after Indy it’s a skating rink.

[GTX JOHN]

We would try to attend all out West!

[TBear5033]

Originally Posted by Larry Hill

The best bet is a timely race at St. Louis before or after Indy. Don’t bother going to Earlville after Indy it’s a skating rink.

Larry, I understand that you had some struggles the last time you came to Earlville and was sorry to hear that you didn't have a good experience. As a Canadian ice hockey player who paid my way through college as a referee, I've been on more than my fair share of ice rinks.

Granted the groove at Earlville is more narrow than at some other tracks and I won't speak for the 100+ Stk/SS racers that routinely attend Midwest Class Racer events 2-3 times are year at Tri-State Raceway, but most of us have figured out how to make our cars work at this track.

Now I don't know him, but Tim McAmis doesn't live too far from the track.
He has already created his Chassis Master App, but I'd be happy to call him and see if he would come and do a tutorial for anyone needing some help hooking up.

[GTS340]

Even though this is a back east thread. We have lost so many tracks out west here. Which in turn we have lost racers and race cars. Larry has the right idea and location. The word fun has to be more than the one person winning the race. I was at Bowling Green over 30yrs ago and it left a great memory. Steve McGrath was driving my Volare. Top Stock and class eliminations are great spectating racing and of course we build class cars to be the best in class. We can E.T. race at home. Class racing and fun. Sign me up.

Paul Haszlauer

[Ron Ortiz]

Thank you to all on this post. Fantastic input. The last few posts have totally summed it up. Thank you.

And now, back to our regular scheduled programming.

Ron Ortiz
U/SA can't wait to see you all.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by GTS340

Even though this is a back east thread. We have lost so many tracks out west here. Which in turn we have lost racers and race cars. Larry has the right idea and location. The word fun has to be more than the one person winning the race. I was at Bowling Green over 30yrs ago and it left a great memory. Steve McGrath was driving my Volare. Top Stock and class eliminations are great spectating racing and of course we build class cars to be the best in class. We can E.T. race at home. Class racing and fun. Sign me up.

Paul Haszlauer

Nice post, Paul. It's great to see some love for our home track, especially from people so far away.


I have friends out there, it's a shame that with all that land, you guys have lost a ton of tracks, and have to drive eight hours to race, on a good weekend.





I'm a bit biased, because it's my home track. And this only applies really east of the Mississippi.


But Bowling Green absolutely IS the ideal facility for a Stock and Super Stock race. They literally host a ton of the combo races every year, plus the SportsNational Open, and the Indy tune up LODRS, they love the cars and classes, and they know them. The central location is great, and the track is easy to access. The parking is great, even for 1,000 cars. The track is reasonably fast in decent weather. There are plenty of affordable hotels, motels, and restaurants. There's even a recreation park for kids.



Ideally, you could have a $100 test and tune on Thursday, and even throw in a $100 to enter combo that night. Open Friday for tech, a couple of rounds of qualifying, and either run class, or another $100 to enter combo.


I really would rather see class run starting at 10:00 Saturday morning, just to allow people who want/need to make a two day race of it the opportunity to run for class. This despite my belief that people hard core enough to run for class are going to come in Wednesday night to be ready for the $100 test and tune (yeah, you Larry Hill ). In conjunction with class, there's time for at least 2 qualifying shots for everyone, so if you choose to roll in on Friday night, you still have a qualifying shot in each lane for the big race. And you even have the opportunity to run at least one bonus race, even if you choose to make it a two day race.



Then start eliminations on Saturday evening, 1-2 rounds. Have another $100 to enter bonus combo on Saturday night, especially good for anyone who didn't make it past rounds 1 or 2.You could also run Top Stock style racing Saturday night in conjunction with the $100 to enter combo, to eliminate down time. Or, run a big money $500 to enter combo. And finish the main race eliminations on Sunday.


Seriously, at Bowling Green, you could pack in a ton of racing for a big field of cars, without it being a hassle.


Think about it. A main race, say $250 to enter, that includes class eliminations. Plus 2 to 4 $100 to enter combo races. A $100 test and tune session, and maybe Top Stock style racing ($100 entry fee, 2-3 classes each in Stock and Super Stock). One location, one weekend. With a chance to decide how much to race and how much to spend.





For those east of the Mississippi, and even 300 miles west of it, you can't really beat the location or the facility, and it's capable of hosting a huge field of cars, and a bunch of racing. It would be cool to offer a lot of different races, so everyone has multiple shots at going some rounds and winning some money.




Nah. Never mind. Fletcher is right. It's not perfect enough. And there's no wally.