Once again a bogus combination

[hemidup]

Originally Posted by SS Engine Guy

.....and both had to come up with bogus horsepower factors to compete with the stuff already out there.

Bogus HP factors or not, I still haven't seen where the new Challenger's or Mustang's have dominated anywhere. Have you?

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by hemidup

Bogus HP factors or not, I still haven't seen where the new Challenger's or Mustang's have dominated anywhere. Have you?

Maybe its because the money guys who are buying these new cars cant drive a nail with a hammer much less drive a race car? Unless its a heads up run they are dead meat. LOL

[Paul Ceasrine]

Gone are the days (1968/1969) when the NHRA only re-factored the;
Mopar 340; from 275HP to 310HP
Ford 428 Cobra-Jet; from 335HP to 360HP
S/S AMX 390; from 340HP to 405HP.
My daughter was going to buy a bicycle to ride, but we heard the NHRA was going to re-factor it, before she ever rode it.
OHHH,, THE NHRA,,Where have you gone Joe Dimaggio?
PC

[Dean Roberts]

Greg and others, where was all this grandstanding when GM told NHRA that they built '98 Firebirds and Camaros with LT1 engines? And of course, NHRA allowed it. In fact, every racer who has ever lost a round to one of these cars has lost to a paper car that was never built from the factory. I believe NHRA was driving GMC trucks during this time.

Greg, and others, does this not bother you?

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Dean Roberts

Greg and others, where was all this grandstanding when GM told NHRA that they built '98 Firebirds and Camaros with LT1 engines? And of course, NHRA allowed it. In fact, every racer who has ever lost a round to one of these cars has lost to a paper car that was never built from the factory. I believe NHRA was driving GMC trucks during this time.

Greg, and others, does this not bother you?

My 98 Firebird shows the LT-1 option in the owner's manual. Besides, the difference between a 97 F body and a 98 F body is body panels (the 98 is just a better looking car). At least it wasn't a car that was nearly 100HP under factored, or a car with an engine that was NEVER offered by the manufacturer in ANY car for street use, or a car that can never be registered for street use or even driven off the lot when purchased.

And I guess the 98 LT-1 F body deal in the past makes it "anything goes" in the future.

[Greg Hill]

Originally Posted by Dean Roberts

Greg and others, where was all this grandstanding when GM told NHRA that they built '98 Firebirds and Camaros with LT1 engines? And of course, NHRA allowed it. In fact, every racer who has ever lost a round to one of these cars has lost to a paper car that was never built from the factory. I believe NHRA was driving GMC trucks during this time.

Greg, and others, does this not bother you?

98 Firebirds and Camaros are no different than 97's. These cars were way under rated to start with and it's taken 16 years for the LT1's to get the rating they now have. I had to race against the LS1's when they were rated at 305hp. They are now 369 or 373 in the Camaro's and Firebird's. Why do you think the fuel injected classes were implemented? It was the failure of NHRA to properly factor these cars. I have no doubt that Pontiac being the official car and GMC being the official truck was the main reason these cars didn't get properly factored. That being said this is way more bogus than anything GM did back in those days. These are cars that were never made. The rules had to be changed just to allow these cars in stock. They had an opportunity to put these crate motor cars in their own class and decided to let them run in regular stock classes with hp ratings so Bogus Ray Charles could see they weren't right.

[Dean Roberts]

Bogus is bogus, no matter the level. Greg, you skirted my question. Why are you not grandstanding against bogus GM cars? These are cratemotor cars.

98s are different from 97s because in 98 GM used a different enigne and diffrent body work.

Alan, I would like to see one in the real world. Please post a picture of a street F-body ('98) with a factory LT1 or scan and show us where it was available in GM literature.

Greg what rule did NHRAchange?

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Dean Roberts

Bogus is bogus, no matter the level. Greg, you skirted my question. Why are you not grandstanding against bogus GM cars? These are cratemotor cars.

98s are different from 97s because in 98 GM used a different enigne and diffrent body work.

Alan, I would like to see one in the real world. Please post a picture of a street F-body ('98) with a factory LT1 or scan and show us where it was available in GM literature.

Greg what rule did NHRAchange?

I have asked the same question a few times and nobody has answered: If there was a Camaro or Corvette available in the books, would we be having these posts?

On another subject, the horsepower ratings for the crate engines shown in the Ford Racing catalog are tested under SAE conditions and they do not test every engine they assemble. Just because the engine is rated at 500 hp from the factory, it does not mean you put the engine in the car and go 1.0+ seconds under the index. The HP ratings under the SAE protocol are subjective. I have seen many engines on the dyno making 500 hp and depending on the class they run, they can run from 11.70's to 10.90's depending on the weight, trans and track conditions.

[Greg Hill]

Originally Posted by Dean Roberts

Bogus is bogus, no matter the level. Greg, you skirted my question. Why are you not grandstanding against bogus GM cars? These are cratemotor cars.

98s are different from 97s because in 98 GM used a different enigne and diffrent body work.

Alan, I would like to see one in the real world. Please post a picture of a street F-body ('98) with a factory LT1 or scan and show us where it was available in GM literature.

Greg what rule did NHRAchange?

Dean, there is no difference other than maybe a small cosmetic difference in the 97 and 98 Firebirds. I don't know why NHRA let the 98's run the LT1 but performance wise there is no difference. I know a lot of the guys claimed 98 so they could get contingency money from GM. You could walk in any Chevrolet or Pontiac dealer and buy one of these cars and drive it home.

The rule that got changed was to allow special runs of 50 cars that need not be street legal or available to the public to be allowed in Stock eliminator. That was not in the rule book until 2007 or 2008. WTF do you mean grandstanding? All I'm doing is pointing out facts. The specs don't lie.

[Rory McNeil]

Originally Posted by Dean Roberts

Bogus is bogus, no matter the level. Greg, you skirted my question. Why are you not grandstanding against bogus GM cars? These are cratemotor cars.

98s are different from 97s because in 98 GM used a different enigne and diffrent body work.

Alan, I would like to see one in the real world. Please post a picture of a street F-body ('98) with a factory LT1 or scan and show us where it was available in GM literature.

Greg what rule did NHRAchange?

And if you could show either a picture or a GM part number for the Camaro manual rack & pinion, that looks amazingly similar to a Ford Pinto rack, that would be nice as well.