Next Debate. - Page 5

GUMP · 02-19-2009, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Just how "handicapped" do you think the 2008 Cobra Jets are?

Maybe you should give your oppinion on what the Cobra Jet HP should be?

lstanford · 02-19-2009, 09:48 AM

I think this is the "point" of this debate. The supercharged and turbocharged cars are the wave of the future. How do we meld them into the Stock and Superstock classes. I think by the end of this year that the CJ Mustang will show its capability especially if one shows up in SS/B form. I believe the twin turbo, direct injected V6 Ecoboost engine is more of a threat in S/S and Stock than the CJ. Ford will be putting this engine in a Mustang that anyone can buy off the showroom floor in the next year. The potential of this engine will be mind boggling. Ford was on the right track with turbocharging in the 80's (SVO Mustang) but now with dual OHC's, direct injection , two turbos and a quantum leap in electronics have made this a formidable piece. I think we can all bitch and moan but it's not going to change whats coming in our sport. My hat is off to Ford for being on the cutting edge of power adders with small cubic inch motors and world class technology and most importantly staying off the government nipple. Ronzello may not be the only one racing a V6 Ford in the future. I wonder if this piece will turn 12 grand in the lights. Lol. This is really motorcycle technology. Maybe there's room in the bike classes.

X-TECH MAN · 02-19-2009, 10:32 AM

[QUOTE=FECARMAN; now with dual OHC's, direct injection , two turbos and a quantum leap in electronics have made this a formidable piece.This is really motorcycle technology. Maybe there's room in the bike classes.[/QUOTE]

Yeah...Kind of like the "Crotch Rockets" of today. I can smell "BURNNING RICE" in the air already ! I bet they will sound like a pissed off bee to. Weeeeeeeee Bing Bing.

junior barns · 02-19-2009, 12:57 PM

FECARMAN said about Ford

"most importantly staying off the government nipple."

Ford will be on the govt nipple before the end of trhe year!!

As for what is coming down the road combo's, as i said before, it is the future like it or not. But, these cars need to be rated properly on HP! NHRA may act like dumb ***'s but they know what is going on!!

They just dont care

bill dedman · 02-19-2009, 03:24 PM

Instead of answering my question, which was "Just how handicapped do you think the 2008 Cobra Jets are?" Gump tried to shift the load to me, by asking "Maybe you should give your oppinion on what the Cobra Jet HP should be?"

Nobody cares what ~I~ think, Gump.... My opinion means nothing. ~I~ haven't seen a dyno test of these cars.

My point is NEITHER HAS NHRA!!!! Ford suggests a figure (425) that they pulled out of a cocked hat and NHRA buys it like it was set in stone... with no proof of any kind.

Then, at Pomona,one of the cars runs a 10.0 at only 112 mph.... and weighs in at 3700 pounds

I don't know about you, but that sounds like a sandbagging run from a car that has a LOT MORE than 425 hp....

It's not up to me to determine a HP figure for these cars, but that doesn't mean that I'm blind to their potential.

I just don't think that 425 is anywhere near their capability. Do you?

goinbroke2 · 02-19-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by junior barns

Ford will be on the govt nipple before the end of trhe year!!

And that your honour is proof positive that he knows nothing about what is going on at ford, only that he's a ford hater.

They don't need assistance and if things get really bad they only want ACCESS to 9 billion of loans. They will not go "on the nipple" as this will require the family giving up b class shares (which are control voting shares)

Go on hating, I can only imagine the infantile response. Slowly, the hidden agenda behind the CJ uproar is seeing the light. While there are certainly issues with super/turbo cars, I can't help but think that if this was a chev debuting, this would not of generated a quarter of the anger/argument/response

No,no,no it's not because it is a ford....yeah ok....

GUMP · 02-19-2009, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bill dedman

I just don't think that 425 is anywhere near their capability. Do you?

On this we agree. But, I also think that it is unfair to factor them until they show a little more of what they can do. A lot of well known racers have done really well with underrated combinations. Eventually the HP police get everyone.

big blue galaxie · 02-20-2009, 01:29 PM

I have to ask this, with all the engine and chassis dynos around the country that can be used that are not directly tied to the OEMs, can somebody at the sanctioning bodies certify some dyno operators to put HP numbers together that are accurate and impartial?

Harry 6674 · 02-20-2009, 01:48 PM

So what we are all saying is we think the new Mustangs are producing around 600 hp and the 427/396 A/B/C cars are around 600 hp shouldn't they be factored the same? Where does nhra come up with hp numbers on the bbc?

GUMP · 02-20-2009, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by big blue galaxie

I have to ask this, with all the engine and chassis dynos around the country that can be used that are not directly tied to the OEMs, can somebody at the sanctioning bodies certify some dyno operators to put HP numbers together that are accurate and impartial?

OK, so once you have that dyno information what are you supposed to do with it? What equation do you use to figure factored HP? Pick any combination in the book and dyno the motor and again at the rear wheels and neither will be the factored number.

02-19-2009, 09:48 AM	#42
lstanford Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 312 Likes: 1 Liked 134 Times in 32 Posts	Re: Next Debate. I think this is the "point" of this debate. The supercharged and turbocharged cars are the wave of the future. How do we meld them into the Stock and Superstock classes. I think by the end of this year that the CJ Mustang will show its capability especially if one shows up in SS/B form. I believe the twin turbo, direct injected V6 Ecoboost engine is more of a threat in S/S and Stock than the CJ. Ford will be putting this engine in a Mustang that anyone can buy off the showroom floor in the next year. The potential of this engine will be mind boggling. Ford was on the right track with turbocharging in the 80's (SVO Mustang) but now with dual OHC's, direct injection , two turbos and a quantum leap in electronics have made this a formidable piece. I think we can all bitch and moan but it's not going to change whats coming in our sport. My hat is off to Ford for being on the cutting edge of power adders with small cubic inch motors and world class technology and most importantly staying off the government nipple. Ronzello may not be the only one racing a V6 Ford in the future. I wonder if this piece will turn 12 grand in the lights. Lol. This is really motorcycle technology. Maybe there's room in the bike classes.

02-19-2009, 10:32 AM	#43
X-TECH MAN Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lake Placid, Florida Posts: 3,203 Likes: 1,047 Liked 235 Times in 110 Posts	Re: Next Debate. [QUOTE=FECARMAN; now with dual OHC's, direct injection , two turbos and a quantum leap in electronics have made this a formidable piece.This is really motorcycle technology. Maybe there's room in the bike classes.[/QUOTE] Yeah...Kind of like the "Crotch Rockets" of today. I can smell "BURNNING RICE" in the air already ! I bet they will sound like a pissed off bee to. Weeeeeeeee Bing Bing.

02-19-2009, 12:57 PM	#44
junior barns Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 541 Likes: 11 Liked 20 Times in 14 Posts	Re: Next Debate. FECARMAN said about Ford "most importantly staying off the government nipple." Ford will be on the govt nipple before the end of trhe year!! As for what is coming down the road combo's, as i said before, it is the future like it or not. But, these cars need to be rated properly on HP! NHRA may act like dumb ***'s but they know what is going on!! They just dont care

02-19-2009, 03:24 PM	#45
bill dedman VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Conway, AR Posts: 1,739 Likes: 0 Liked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Next Debate. Instead of answering my question, which was "Just how handicapped do you think the 2008 Cobra Jets are?" Gump tried to shift the load to me, by asking "Maybe you should give your oppinion on what the Cobra Jet HP should be?" Nobody cares what ~I~ think, Gump.... My opinion means nothing. ~I~ haven't seen a dyno test of these cars. My point is NEITHER HAS NHRA!!!! Ford suggests a figure (425) that they pulled out of a cocked hat and NHRA buys it like it was set in stone... with no proof of any kind. Then, at Pomona,one of the cars runs a 10.0 at only 112 mph.... and weighs in at 3700 pounds I don't know about you, but that sounds like a sandbagging run from a car that has a LOT MORE than 425 hp.... It's not up to me to determine a HP figure for these cars, but that doesn't mean that I'm blind to their potential. I just don't think that 425 is anywhere near their capability. Do you? __________________ Bill

02-20-2009, 01:29 PM	#48
big blue galaxie Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 36 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Next Debate. I have to ask this, with all the engine and chassis dynos around the country that can be used that are not directly tied to the OEMs, can somebody at the sanctioning bodies certify some dyno operators to put HP numbers together that are accurate and impartial? Last edited by big blue galaxie; 02-20-2009 at 01:33 PM.

02-20-2009, 01:48 PM	#49
Harry 6674 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 589 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Next Debate. So what we are all saying is we think the new Mustangs are producing around 600 hp and the 427/396 A/B/C cars are around 600 hp shouldn't they be factored the same? Where does nhra come up with hp numbers on the bbc?