AHFS details

Chuck Norton · 08-17-2009, 08:09 AM

Greg,

I am sadly lacking in my ability to express my opinions on the questions you have raised without carrying the discussion past the point of good common sense. Of course, it's easy to pass that point when dealing with an issue that carries a heavy burden of emotional baggage.

A casual observer might form the belief that the upper management of the organization has a distinct emotional attachment but it is not to the esthetics of drag racing nor is it even remotely related to Sportsman racing or Sportsman racers. It is directly related to making money. I don't remember exactly when it happened but, some years ago, there was a published announcement that, henceforth, the organization was no longer a "club" but something else that was no longer responsible to the "members" but to a Board of Directors that was independent of the "membership." Ask Bruce Noland about the fine points, he's much more completely informed. I just know that it's been many years since "accountability" to "members" was anything but an illusion. Any of the "members" who retain a belief in that illusion will be ultimately disappointed but will continually be in a state of angst about the way things are going. This is a down-to-earth, in-your-face example of what happens when a group of people who are emotionally or passionately involved with an activity such as drag racing come face-to-face with another group of people who are emotionally or passionately involved with making a profit. What's happening isn't personal, it's merely business.

"Standing up" would be an option if anyone were to be astute enough to figure out how to herd cats! Picture an inner city skid-row situation in which all the addicts living on the streets became organized, elected members to an advisory committee, wrote a business plan and "stood up" to the pushers, asking for lower drug prices, home delivery, cleaner needles, and respect. Does that sound like a program that might engender a high expectation of success?

The good news is that we are (mostly) not living on the streets, are (mostly) able to find something else to do, and are (mostly) in possession of our faculties. It's just that making the personal decision to walk away from the needle is a tough one. You young guys have a much tougher decision to make than do we old-timers. You're facing more years to live without the needle.

Nice chatting with you. Hope things are going well in Derbyland.

c

Jack McCarthy · 08-17-2009, 08:34 AM

eloquently said chuck... i particularly like the "herd cats" reference...

it is impossible to get the members to stand up together, cause everyone is on thier own agenda...
there will never ba a boycott of any race... someone will see it as an easy opportunity to win, with no idea of the big picture.

i have raced my last indy... i have built my last stocker motor...i only joined nhra this season to run pat's race... which should be the model for all sportsman races !

captain jack

just a big block and a posi away from rod runs with the big wagon... holds a lot of beer / friends !

X-TECH MAN · 08-17-2009, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack McCarthy

eloquently said chuck... i particularly like the "herd cats" reference...

it is impossible to get the members to stand up together, cause everyone is on thier own agenda...
there will never ba a boycott of any race... someone will see it as an easy opportunity to win, with no idea of the big picture.

i have raced my last indy... i have built my last stocker motor...i only joined nhra this season to run pat's race... which should be the model for all sportsman races !

captain jack

just a big block and a posi away from rod runs with the big wagon... holds a lot of beer / friends !

Dont forget to add the A/C to keep the beer cool.

Jeff Teuton · 08-17-2009, 10:57 AM

Chuck, you really think Bobby Brannon is in control of his faculties? Nicely put. The date the membership ended was 1981 and (supposedly) enough members voted to give the Board the sole power to vote on issues. And Bobby isn't the only one. Not in control. A/C for beer is good. Cap't Jack likes A/C'ed beer.
Did I miss anyone. I just applied for my Social Security. Maybe it's time to quit. Maybe we are all too hard headed to quit. I guess I don't conduct my business like NHRA does, and that part I just don't understand. Maybe, maybe, maybe

bill dedman · 08-17-2009, 11:27 AM

Jeff, if you did, you'd have been OUT OF BUSINESS,a long time ago...

Greg Hill · 08-17-2009, 12:29 PM

Chuck, if making money is their sole reason for being in businees , how do they keep their non profit status? I have been on a couple of non profit boards over the years and members always elected the board. I believe NHRA is still operating under their original charter from back inn the 50's. I wonder if the IRS has had a look lately? What about the for profit corporations owned by NHRA? Whose money got invested in those? I guess my whole point is that if the management owns NHRA they stole it.

Chuck Norton · 08-17-2009, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Hill

Chuck, if making money is their sole reason for being in businees , how do they keep their non profit status? I have been on a couple of non profit boards over the years and members always elected the board. I believe NHRA is still operating under their original charter from back inn the 50's. I wonder if the IRS has had a look lately? What about the for profit corporations owned by NHRA? Whose money got invested in those? I guess my whole point is that if the management owns NHRA they stole it.

Q1. how do they keep their non profit status?
A1. Hell, I'm just a retired school teacher. Ask Julie Jordan. She's an accountant and more informed in these things. All I know is that they've had good legal minds on the staff for many years and no one has been able to break down the walls even though it's been tried.

Q2. I wonder if the IRS has had a look lately?
A2. I doubt it. They're too busy questioning my racing expenses.

Statement 1. I guess my whole point is that if the management owns NHRA they stole it.
Response 1. No comment. See A1.

c

Ed Wright · 08-17-2009, 12:34 PM

You guys need to be nicer to Bobby.

Chuck Norton · 08-17-2009, 12:39 PM

[QUOTE=Jeff Teuton;135242]Chuck, you really think Bobby Brannon is in control of his faculties?

Normally, having written on a topic, I'd have already moved on to new musings but, in this instance I feel an obligation to respond directly to a direct question:

I don't know Bobby Brannon as well as do you, but I think we're at a level that would justify my introducing him as a "friend and competitor." On all occasions that we've had conversations I have found him to be the epitome of a southern gentleman in the way that I've understood the term for the last fifty or sixty years. He is courteous, polite, and accommodating. I no reason to believe that he is not an upstanding citizen.

That's enough said.

In retrospect, Chariie Manson was a frat brother, too. Perhaps I'm not discerning enough in choosing "friends." Who knows?

c

X-TECH MAN · 08-17-2009, 09:52 AM

[QUOTE=Chuck Norton;

The good news is that we are (mostly) able to find something else to do, and are (mostly) in possession of our faculties.
c[/QUOTE]

That could be debatable......lol.

08-17-2009, 08:09 AM	#1
Chuck Norton Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Covina, CA Posts: 474 Likes: 114 Liked 89 Times in 19 Posts	Re: AHFS details Greg, I am sadly lacking in my ability to express my opinions on the questions you have raised without carrying the discussion past the point of good common sense. Of course, it's easy to pass that point when dealing with an issue that carries a heavy burden of emotional baggage. A casual observer might form the belief that the upper management of the organization has a distinct emotional attachment but it is not to the esthetics of drag racing nor is it even remotely related to Sportsman racing or Sportsman racers. It is directly related to making money. I don't remember exactly when it happened but, some years ago, there was a published announcement that, henceforth, the organization was no longer a "club" but something else that was no longer responsible to the "members" but to a Board of Directors that was independent of the "membership." Ask Bruce Noland about the fine points, he's much more completely informed. I just know that it's been many years since "accountability" to "members" was anything but an illusion. Any of the "members" who retain a belief in that illusion will be ultimately disappointed but will continually be in a state of angst about the way things are going. This is a down-to-earth, in-your-face example of what happens when a group of people who are emotionally or passionately involved with an activity such as drag racing come face-to-face with another group of people who are emotionally or passionately involved with making a profit. What's happening isn't personal, it's merely business. "Standing up" would be an option if anyone were to be astute enough to figure out how to herd cats! Picture an inner city skid-row situation in which all the addicts living on the streets became organized, elected members to an advisory committee, wrote a business plan and "stood up" to the pushers, asking for lower drug prices, home delivery, cleaner needles, and respect. Does that sound like a program that might engender a high expectation of success? The good news is that we are (mostly) not living on the streets, are (mostly) able to find something else to do, and are (mostly) in possession of our faculties. It's just that making the personal decision to walk away from the needle is a tough one. You young guys have a much tougher decision to make than do we old-timers. You're facing more years to live without the needle. Nice chatting with you. Hope things are going well in Derbyland. c

08-17-2009, 08:34 AM	#2
Jack McCarthy VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: lyndon ky. ... louisville area Posts: 1,327 Likes: 30 Liked 511 Times in 122 Posts	Re: AHFS details eloquently said chuck... i particularly like the "herd cats" reference... it is impossible to get the members to stand up together, cause everyone is on thier own agenda... there will never ba a boycott of any race... someone will see it as an easy opportunity to win, with no idea of the big picture. i have raced my last indy... i have built my last stocker motor...i only joined nhra this season to run pat's race... which should be the model for all sportsman races ! captain jack just a big block and a posi away from rod runs with the big wagon... holds a lot of beer / friends ! __________________ Jack McCarthy 3609 STK "the Captain"

08-17-2009, 10:57 AM	#4
Jeff Teuton VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Houma, LA Posts: 2,717 Likes: 2 Liked 325 Times in 50 Posts	Re: AHFS details Chuck, you really think Bobby Brannon is in control of his faculties? Nicely put. The date the membership ended was 1981 and (supposedly) enough members voted to give the Board the sole power to vote on issues. And Bobby isn't the only one. Not in control. A/C for beer is good. Cap't Jack likes A/C'ed beer. Did I miss anyone. I just applied for my Social Security. Maybe it's time to quit. Maybe we are all too hard headed to quit. I guess I don't conduct my business like NHRA does, and that part I just don't understand. Maybe, maybe, maybe __________________ Jeff Teuton 4022 STK

08-17-2009, 11:27 AM	#5
bill dedman VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Conway, AR Posts: 1,739 Likes: 0 Liked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Re: AHFS details Jeff, if you did, you'd have been OUT OF BUSINESS,a long time ago... __________________ Bill

08-17-2009, 12:29 PM	#6
Greg Hill VIP Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Louisville , KY Posts: 1,995 Likes: 69 Liked 279 Times in 68 Posts	Re: AHFS details Chuck, if making money is their sole reason for being in businees , how do they keep their non profit status? I have been on a couple of non profit boards over the years and members always elected the board. I believe NHRA is still operating under their original charter from back inn the 50's. I wonder if the IRS has had a look lately? What about the for profit corporations owned by NHRA? Whose money got invested in those? I guess my whole point is that if the management owns NHRA they stole it. __________________ Greg Hill 4171 STK

08-17-2009, 12:34 PM	#8
Ed Wright Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sand Springs, OK Posts: 8,132 Likes: 896 Liked 390 Times in 170 Posts	Re: AHFS details You guys need to be nicer to Bobby. __________________ Ed Wright 4156 SS/JA Last edited by Ed Wright; 08-20-2009 at 09:32 AM. Reason: Spelling

08-17-2009, 12:39 PM	#9
Chuck Norton Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Covina, CA Posts: 474 Likes: 114 Liked 89 Times in 19 Posts	Re: AHFS details [QUOTE=Jeff Teuton;135242]Chuck, you really think Bobby Brannon is in control of his faculties? Normally, having written on a topic, I'd have already moved on to new musings but, in this instance I feel an obligation to respond directly to a direct question: I don't know Bobby Brannon as well as do you, but I think we're at a level that would justify my introducing him as a "friend and competitor." On all occasions that we've had conversations I have found him to be the epitome of a southern gentleman in the way that I've understood the term for the last fifty or sixty years. He is courteous, polite, and accommodating. I no reason to believe that he is not an upstanding citizen. That's enough said. In retrospect, Chariie Manson was a frat brother, too. Perhaps I'm not discerning enough in choosing "friends." Who knows? c

08-17-2009, 09:52 AM	#10
X-TECH MAN Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lake Placid, Florida Posts: 3,203 Likes: 1,047 Liked 235 Times in 110 Posts	Re: AHFS details [QUOTE=Chuck Norton; The good news is that we are (mostly) able to find something else to do, and are (mostly) in possession of our faculties. c[/QUOTE] That could be debatable......lol.