life after Super Stock for the Hemi A-bodies?

[davezinn]

i know that cars for Pro Stock were required to be only so old, so i understand why some cars were "updated" with later model sheet metal or trim. what about Modified Production? i'm curious too about the match race thing, were those cars classed or what is pretty much a heads up run what 'ya brung thing?

i'm also interested in when the tires started getting bigger and when did racers begin to tub and modify the rear springs and so forth for bigger tires. did this too happen around 1970 with the introduction of Pro Stock?

sorry if it seems like i'm asking some funny questions here. i'm 36 and wasn't around for this stuff but i'm very interested in it and want to learn about racing from the 70's and 80's era's and the cars, parts, modifications, etc.

Dave

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by davezinn

i know that cars for Pro Stock were required to be only so old, so i understand why some cars were "updated" with later model sheet metal or trim. what about Modified Production? i'm curious too about the match race thing, were those cars classed or what is pretty much a heads up run what 'ya brung thing?

i'm also interested in when the tires started getting bigger and when did racers begin to tub and modify the rear springs and so forth for bigger tires. did this too happen around 1970 with the introduction of Pro Stock?

sorry if it seems like i'm asking some funny questions here. i'm 36 and wasn't around for this stuff but i'm very interested in it and want to learn about racing from the 70's and 80's era's and the cars, parts, modifications, etc.

Dave

I remember the tires on Grumpys 68 Carmaro and Sox's Hemi 'Cuda in Pro Stock during 1970 were 12.2 X 31.2 "W" size. I dont believe the 14 X 32's had been introduced yet at that time. Tubbbing the wheel housings for S/S wasnt allowed until a couple of years after all of the Jr. stocks were made to run S/S in 1972. You had to run a tire that fit the existing OEM wheel wells and no rear end narrowing was allowed but that rule was "Fudged" a lot in those days just as things are done today. The 10.5 tires were used a lot back then even on the 68 Hemi 'Cudas and Darts when new from Hurst Corp. You were allowed to move the rear leaf springs for clearance. OMG ! That was about 40 years ago !
Early Modified Production cars had to use 7 inch slicks. Match racing was a big deal back in the day as it was a major sorce of income for Dyno Don, Da Grump, Sox, Bob Glidden and all the rest when Pro Stock became popular. Usually anything was allowed for match racing such as large engines, weight removal, etc. They really didnt get into funny fuels like back in the old altered wheelbase days of 65/66. The fans loved it and its a shame match racing dosent happen today. I think they are missing the boat on this. When I first got Top Stock introduced I tried to arrange some match races of those guys but there was no interest from the local tracks or the racers it seemed. It would have helped promote the heads up concept in stock but its all accient history now.

[68hemiss]

I have done a little bit of history on these cars and spoken with many of the owners. Many cars were updated and run in Pro Stock - I think there was a 2-3 year rule at the time. The Barracudas were updated to 69 models and ran for a year - many Darts were updated to 70 models and run longer. Many of these cars that were updated to 70 models are still missing. In talking to many 2nd owners, they added a tunnel ram and ran M/P - the cars were a natural B/MP and with some lightening A/MP. Some of the owners said that the factory racers - Mancini, Lilly & Tedder lowered the record so much that they were not competitive - remember they ran of the national record at the time. Once in a while you will also see one being raced in the early 70's in C/Gas. Later, some were fitted with 440's or retained the Hemi and bracket raced.
Mark J

[68hemiss]

There are a number of "Factory" cars still racing (kinda)
Chuck Comella
Harold Leiter
Jim Pancake's Barracuda
Rayburn's Barracuda - I belive has been sold to another racer
Randy Hopkins Dart
There are others as well

[Frito]

I was going to suggest he get up with you or Dell. How about the Lewis & Keys cuda? They were entered for Indy but a no show this year.

[hemidup]

I gotta feeling Lambeck's Dart will make a showing in 2011.

[hemicop]

The BO29 & LO23 cars were truly a "Jack-of-all-trades" sort of car. As others have said, many became Pro Stockers, some "match-race" cars which resulted in quite a few getting carved-up and many went on as pretty successful "class" cars, running as intended in S/S or Modified Production or even in some Gasser classes., You can find pics of cars like "Psychotic Reaction" running M/P or Lambeck's car carrying "gas" (B?) designation or more often than not A/MP. These were "natural" cars for the class as they already had the big engine/small car concept scienced out from the factory & the owner's match-raqcing experience allowed him to set-up the car above & beyond the S/S rules yet be familiar with running the car all-out & however he wanted.
As I recall the original S/S rules didn't allow for any tubing or anythingyet allowed whatever tire could fit without rear-end narrowing , so Mopar was smart enough to carve on the rear quarters of the Darts to allow a larger tire to fit without having to settle for a (relatively)small slick---the 'Cudas didn't have that issue.
As to when the narrowing of rear-ends came into play, I believe that was right at about 1973 when P/S really took off, development was coming by leaps-and-bounds, so the necessity of larger tires just evolved. Actually if you look under one of S&Ms early 'Cudas you'll see a leaf/link set-up & big tires--- kind of a cross between the still used 4-link system yet with leafsprings.

[John Lang]

Jim Keyes was going to race , but his new Engine wasn't done ! He was there as a watcher ! ..........John

[hemicop]

The interesting thing about these cars that anyone tha follows them knows, is that these cars didn't have NEAR the budget Mopar gave its NASCAR contingient. If you look at these cars closely they didn't have near the forethought or completeness of the '65 cars but that's what actually made them so great --- a ton of deleted stuff, cheap A-100 seats, basically a street Hemi with big pistons & an x-ram, sometimes they weren't even complete cars when shipped!
Sadly we'll never see this kind of stuff again. The DragPak cars come kind of close but even allowing for inflation the DP cars are far more money than the old S/S were..........

[doolie]

In the early days of the Division one NHRA Pro Stock circuit there were many Hemi Darts & Cudas competing. Those types of cars competed at the national event level for a few years with less than stellar results. I remember herb McCandless running one and Melvin Yow if my fuzzy mind is working.