perfect reason to get tree fixed

[Bob Pagano]

Wow, Things really go to **** in the off season. Thank God all this crap will go away shortly.

[Chad Rhodes]

Originally Posted by Bob Pagano

Wow, Things really go to **** in the off season. Thank God all this crap will go away shortly.

agreed

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by Ed Wright

If we were to be democratic about it, and took a vote among actually active racers ( and since most actually active racers have the faster cars, or cars in the middle that see it from both sides) the vote likely would be to leave the rules alone. Mostly the guys wanting it changed don't even race that much, or run a slow enough car that they most always leave first. If you read light, it's your fault. Did you not know the rules when you chose what car to race?

Of course it would, Ed.
That would be the same group as this one :

I'm Against Deep Staging Because I Have a Hard Leaving High Class Car So I Voted Against it ,So You Lose.

I don't know if I race enough to have an opinion, but here it is anyway.

I told you guys before . I don't have a personal agenda involved here.I don't care whether the ever change it or not. Right now, all I have to race is a Sportsman bracket racer / Nostalgia SS/ E car. That means I leave second 100% of the time in ET racing, and first,100% of the time in NSS.

I tend to think along the lines of what is good for the sport in the long run.
You know ; such as reaction times, incrementals, first across, MOV's ..All stuff that wasn't available "the way it used to be".

Some of you may not realize, before r/t's , if the Chrondeks were set on "drags", only one red light could come on during eliminations. Of course, that being in the lane of the first car to commit the infraction. We never knew whether the second car was "redder "
Now we DO know.

A simple software change would change the starting line "first or worst " situation to match that of the finish line .

Like I said , I don't care one way or the other. What amazes me is every time this deal comes up , some have to resort to personal attacks and name calling, rather than presenting a cogent argument for their "against " position.
That tells me some DO have a personal agenda involved, and that is why we can never get anything done for the good of the sport.

[novassdude]

I am sure the day after they got this change they would start in on wanting to go by best package. Then they can red light and break out and still have a chance to win.

This is how drag racing works. If you don't like the way it is find a new sport. Or you could start your own association and set the rules any way you want.

[Sean Kennedy]

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

Like I said , I don't care one way or the other. What amazes me is every time this deal comes up , some have to resort to personal attacks and name calling, rather than presenting a cogent argument for their "against " position.
That tells me some DO have a personal agenda involved, and that is why we can never get anything done for the good of the sport.

Great post.

But...

A. This point assumes there is a cogent argument for keeping things the way it is. There isn't much of one, so most just resort to. 'Quit trying to change the rules for your own personal gain.'

B. I think your giving these folks too much credit for assuming most of them are capable of creating a valid and reasonable argument.

I'm sure someone will tell me that the 'clean tree' is an advantage. But personally I think that's BS, I've raced cars as much as TEN SECONDS slower than me, without any problem. My personal advice if you have trouble with waiting on the tree is to work on relaxing and improving your mental focus. Being able to see your opponent in front of you is a much much greater advantage.

And let's be realistic, 90% of racers are capable of consistently having decent a decent R.T. It's a lot more rare to find a racer capable of consistently and driving the finish line competently. 10 second cars also seem to be a lot more consistent on average than most 12 or 13 second cars, thus having further advantage.

Now someone is going to bash me for having an axe to grind.... but I don't really care either way. I'm just presenting the actual logical debate instead of whining and bitching like most of the people on this thread.

The other funny thing is a lot the people here bitching about not changing this rule are always involved in the discussions of other rules changes. Chad Rhodes, you have consistently asked for rules changes on this site.... two I can think of right now off the top of my head are aftermarket seats in stock and moving the new factory paper cars to their own class. But since you don't agree with this rule, and it does not personally benefit you, you insult instead of discuss.

[K Stubbs]

The fact is, if you red light, you lose. Who really wants to change the rules so they can say, " I won that round because I redlighted less than my opponent"? You people are wearing this out, and trying to find all of these angles and reasons to change it, when it really doesnt matter. If you are losing that many races because "you" red lighted first instead of second, then go work on your starting line skills. Fix that and you will not be in this argument.

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by K Stubbs

The fact is, if you red light, you lose. Who really wants to change the rules so they can say, " I won that round because I redlighted less than my opponent"? You people are wearing this out, and trying to find all of these angles and reasons to change it, when it really doesnt matter. If you are losing that many races because "you" red lighted first instead of second, then go work on your starting line skills. Fix that and you will not be in this argument.

Happens everyday in a heads up or same dial -in situation.

Next ;

[K Stubbs]

Give it up Mark......Actually it is the same in a heads up or same dial. The FIRST person that redlights.

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by K Stubbs

Give it up Mark......Actually it is the same in a heads up or same dial. The FIRST person that redlights.

So then you WOULDN'T tell your friends that you dodged a bullet by red lighting less?

Oh BTW, what class are you building a new car for?

[K Stubbs]

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

So then you WOULDN'T tell your friends that you dodged a bullet by red lighting less?

Oh BTW, what class are you building a new car for?

Its going to be V/SA and im coming for you!