Where are the lower class cars?

[GarysZ24]

Originally Posted by Jack Matyas

Gary - I fully understand how you feel but the one thing you're forgetting is that in order to win the eliminator you don't need to run .9 under - all that is necessary is to go on the index ................And the .3 reduction was for everyone - so you're exactly where you were before .

Point well made Jack, however if you're running that close to the index, and all of the sudden eliminations come with a (lets say) 10mph headwind, along with crappy air, suddenly you're either at or slower than your index, and thus your meager cushion of competitiveness is gone...advantage to all cars better than .4 under their indexes.

[GarysZ24]

Originally Posted by Terry Cain

"Gary - I fully understand how you feel but the one thing you're forgetting is that in order to win the eliminator you don't need to run .9 under - all that is necessary is to go on the index ................And the .3 reduction was for everyone - so you're exactly where you were before . "

I thought you still had to run at least .5 under to qualify and run eliminations?

Terry, I don't know if anyone else has chimed in on your question, but no you don't need to run .5 under to qualify & run eliminations. However, you did need to run .5 or more under your index to earn a class win...that is prior to this years enhancement for singles to have to race other singles (based on tranny types), in both Stock and Super Stock. In that case it's most likely the swiftest of the singles that'll win (reaction times being equal)! Sorry but class pays my car $100 bucks or maybe less now, so it's hardly worth it for me anymore, because nearly all of the contingency postings I enjoyed for class back in '99 are gone now, so it's pointless to me to care about class eliminations...the only good I see is that it's a pre-race experience to prepare me for regular racing conditions the next day!

[GarysZ24]

Originally Posted by The Hawk

Gary,after the .30 reduction a year ago,which with the old altitude factor dropped the index at Bandimere .32. Now with the new altitude factor your index dropped another .23. Your new index up here went from a 17.14 to a 16.59 in just over a year. The lower the track,the less increase in index lowering.

Thanks Lane, that's what I thought it was too, and with my best run in the summer months (with heat and headwinds being intangibles there), being that 16.664 I ran in the 3rd rnd of the '06 Mile High's, I now know it would be pointless for me to enter that race again unless/until I can free up $5k to have headers custom made for my car, and get my engine redone with a better durationed cam....it's all about the money, or lack thereof...

More reason for me to be glad for RMR, & SIR embracing the IHRA, since at 4400ft, I was .35 under in not-so-ideal weather conditions, and that was even with their indexes using the Super Comp/Gas/Street correction factor...now that's something to about!

[Harry 6674]

Originally Posted by GarysZ24

Terry, I don't know if anyone else has chimed in on your question, but no you don't need to run .5 under to qualify & run eliminations. However, you did need to run .5 or more under your index to earn a class win...that is prior to this years enhancement for singles to have to race other singles (based on tranny types), in both Stock and Super Stock. In that case it's most likely the swiftest of the singles that'll win (reaction times being equal)! Sorry but class pays my car $100 bucks or maybe less now, so it's hardly worth it for me anymore, because nearly all of the contingency postings I enjoyed for class back in '99 are gone now, so it's pointless to me to care about class eliminations...the only good I see is that it's a pre-race experience to prepare me for regular racing conditions the next day!

If class wins are not important to you why do you race in a performanced based class? Wouldn't it be better not to have to worry about how far under you can run and all the work and money it takes to get faster within the rules and just stay with bracket racing? Why put yourself through it?

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by Harry 6674

If class wins are not important to you why do you race in a performanced based class? Wouldn't it be better not to have to worry about how far under you can run and all the work and money it takes to get faster within the rules and just stay with bracket racing? Why put yourself through it?

Harry, it seems that a lot of us have taken that "Option B " lately.

[GarysZ24]

Originally Posted by Harry 6674

If class wins are not important to you why do you race in a performanced based class? Wouldn't it be better not to have to worry about how far under you can run and all the work and money it takes to get faster within the rules and just stay with bracket racing? Why put yourself through it?

Good question Harry, but I have some good answers to/for you:

1. The only other alternative for a car that runs in the 15-16sec. zone is the sportsman bracket class, and only at the divisional finals does the pay out seem worthwhile...many tracks in Colorado, and even the ones here in Az., would pay $250 or less to the winner of that class as opposed to racing for over $1k in a national/divisional/stock or super stock combo race....just like chum in the ocean attracts sharks, money (and the chance at it plus the fame that goes with it), attracts me!

2. The prestige of racing in front of large groups of people is something else I enjoy, because the stage is a lot bigger than in bracket racing, and after most of the past 36yrs of my being in this sport, that's what I want....

3. I wish to do something no one has done since Mark back in '86, and the guy in '85 divisionally...win a national event, and then set my sights on being the first to repeat that feat, with a front wheel drive car. I like the challenge of doing something that no one has yet done this century, nor has anyone else done since Mark's awesome feat!

Yes if I wanted to I could scrap the fuel injection system, and have my engine built to use a carburetor (Holley), and make the car run 13's (so I could run Pro ET), but to only race for sportsmans meager payouts, and w/o the glamour of running in front of larger groups of fans is something I don't wish to do anymore (exceptions being at Nitro Jam races, where those bracket racers get to race for larger payouts, and in front of lots of fans)! Don't get me wrong Harry, I would like racing for class (for the nearly real racing conditions), however class doesn't pay any money anymore (for products I'm able to use), to give me reason to give a hoot about it...bring back the contingencies of '99, and I'd be more excited about it (oh and return the class runnoffs to how they were prior to this year)!

[Frito]

I did notice Randall Campball at Bristol made it down to the semi finals in his N/SA, he was dialed at 14.05. So much for the lower class cars, or trucks, being a disavantage. The 4 second spot against Keith Lynch was interesting to watch and had a lot of folks in the stands on their feet watching the finish line.

[Bob Don]

Originally Posted by Frito

I did notice Randall Campball at Bristol made it down to the semi finals in his N/SA, he was dialed at 14.05. So much for the lower class cars, or trucks, being a disavantage. The 4 second spot against Keith Lynch was interesting to watch and had a lot of folks in the stands on their feet watching the finish line.

Randall Campbell ran in R/SA. (N/SA index is 13.00)

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by Frito

I did notice Randall Campball at Bristol made it down to the semi finals in his N/SA, he was dialed at 14.05. So much for the lower class cars, or trucks, being a disavantage.

Well there's a scientific statistical analysis for ya.... with a sample size of one. That's what is referred to as an outlier. (Full disclosure: I have been trounced by Randall before! LOL Dude can drive!)

There are a large variety of reasons why certain combinations have slowly disappeared over the years. Among those are regulations that haven't forced these cars out, but have served as a nudge here and a nudge there. There's also been a sea change shift in the types of drivers participating in the classes, or the mindset of existing competitors. There's no one thing that covers everyone's individual choices, but taken as a whole, they have had a cumulative effect over the years.

$.02,

[Jack Matyas]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

Well there's a scientific statistical analysis for ya.... with a sample size of one. That's what is referred to as an outlier. (Full disclosure: I have been trounced by Randall before! LOL Dude can drive!)

There are a large variety of reasons why certain combinations have slowly disappeared over the years. Among those are regulations that haven't forced these cars out, but have served as a nudge here and a nudge there. There's also been a sea change shift in the types of drivers participating in the classes, or the mindset of existing competitors. There's no one thing that covers everyone's individual choices, but taken as a whole, they have had a cumulative effect over the years.

$.02,

Michael - Regulations ? I don't see it .My thoughts are they are dwindling because mostly they are grass roots racers who simply can't afford to keep up in these hard economic times .I just don't see the nudges .......

Frankly they are great for our sport - some fans love to root for the slow - lumbering cars - yet others like the big guns .Nothing better than to see an R/SA being chased by a 9 second late model or even an early Hemi or God forbid - a '69 Camaro .Doesn't matter which you want to win - it's always a great race ! ! !