Why can stock be really stock?

[GarysZ24]

Originally Posted by cicero819

Mr Janes, we have super stock exactly for that direction, we still need stock. In a purest form only format. There is so many great combinations such as Ed Fernandez, Billy Nees who are proving that you can do so much with what you have.CR

Well said Claude, and I wish that would be true too...look at Michael Beard, he today was just one round win away from creating history this century, with a non-DP/CJ/wheelie barred stocker! I often wonder why can't stock be really stock too???

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by GarysZ24

Well said Claude, and I wish that would be true too...look at Michael Beard, he today was just one round win away from creating history this century, with a non-DP/CJ/wheelie barred stocker! I often wonder why can't stock be really stock too???

Ego's, money, lack of tech today and being caught cheating are 4 reasons.

[vic guilmino]

you can't buy stock parts today
junk yards do not have old cars anymore

[Mike Taylor 3601]

I know IHRA would like more Pure Stockers to show up,it's not as pure stock as used to be,any converter,slicks9X29.5,rearend upgrades,headers w/mufflers. cam duration,overlap,lift ,valve springs still checked,no elec. water pumps.,mech fuel pump.
Mike Taylor 3601

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Mike Taylor 3601

I know IHRA would like more Pure Stockers to show up,it's not as pure stock as used to be,any converter,slicks9X29.5,rearend upgrades,headers w/mufflers. cam duration,overlap,lift ,valve springs still checked,no elec. water pumps.,mech fuel pump.
Mike Taylor 3601

Certain items that are now allowed were almost impossable to check or way to time consuming in tear downs such as a REAL OEM cam. Most were found to be running a regrind anyway like the NHRA deal in 1972. Why do you think NHRA went to rate of lift cams around 1974? They gave up trying to police it. Torque converters were another area. A converter can be made to stall low yet have a higher stall speed when raced. Im not sure about the tires today but when I last worked the tire could be no larger than 29.0. Should have been 28 inch hi max. With the use of the current tires the rear end up grade was a necessity or we would have had broken cars every run PLUS they are supposed to use a posi and not a spool. Do ya think they are checked for that today.....LOL. . The OEM exhaust manifold game became a joke with guys running 383's and 440's in late model 'Cudas and Challengers trying to argue the max wedge manifolds came on their cars.....LOL. Reason for the headers WITH a real non straight thru muffler. No empty beer cans or glass packs. If the cam duration and overlap and valve springs are checked these days (I doubt its being done) then its as close to pre 1972 Jr. stock as one can get. To bad most of the racers are not running the older cars instead of the late model FI stuff. I should have written in a max year rule of pre FI or carb non computer cars when it was done. Hind sight is 20/20 !

[cicero819]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

Certain items that are now allowed were almost impossable to check or way to time consuming in tear downs such as a REAL OEM cam. Most were found to be running a regrind anyway like the NHRA deal in 1972. Why do you think NHRA went to rate of lift cams around 1974? They gave up trying to police it. Torque converters were another area. A converter can be made to stall low yet have a higher stall speed when raced. Im not sure about the tires today but when I last worked the tire could be no larger than 29.0. Should have been 28 inch hi max. With the use of the current tires the rear end up grade was a necessity or we would have had broken cars every run PLUS they are supposed to use a posi and not a spool. Do ya think they are checked for that today.....LOL. . The OEM exhaust manifold game became a joke with guys running 383's and 440's in late model 'Cudas and Challengers trying to argue the max wedge manifolds came on their cars.....LOL. Reason for the headers WITH a real non straight thru muffler. No empty beer cans or glass packs. If the cam duration and overlap and valve springs are checked these days (I doubt its being done) then its as close to pre 1972 Jr. stock as one can get. To bad most of the racers are not running the older cars instead of the late model FI stuff. I should have written in a max year rule of pre FI or carb non computer cars when it was done. Hind sight is 20/20 !

Terry, you're right about where NHRA is going with it's limited tech support, I know that they have problems giving their tech staff support for stock and super stock, I'm sure that they wouldn't be interested in another class that would need even more scrutiny. Pure stock should be no slick, tire size that that the model came with and so on. NHRA could profit on the long term with new blood bringing their new 5.0 Mustang, don't forget all those 300hp plus v6 out there in the form of Challengers, Mustangs, Camaro's and all new Trucks with the new ecoboost 6 from Ford, I can see many young men and young women involve at that stage. Just my two cents but it's been awhile sine we've seen so many new cars with much horspower available. Claude

[GarysZ24]

Originally Posted by vic guilmino

you can't buy stock parts today
junk yards do not have old cars anymore

Vic, you and Terry hit the nails on their heads...I just look at the stockers today, and feel that the addition of things such as Wheelie bars, and inline 4spds, are more Super Stock type of stuff than stock worthy...besides, many of the things the faster cars get to use now aren't available for many slower rollers...Terry are wheelie bars legal for fwd stockers? That would be cool if they were (fair too), and I might have to get one for my car?

[Casey Miles]

Stock got messed up when Schubeck lifters where allowed and it was because of people crying that they lifters going bad on camshafts that shouldn't be running the valve spring pressures that they were applying. The valve spring rules should have been kept to what ever pressure you could get away with with the use of a STOCK lifter that you can buy at the local parts store. I asked a tech person one time out at Indy, "if they don't allow any exotic materials in Pro Stock, why is it allowed in Stock?" He replyed to me that he didn't know what I was talking about, so I told him about Schubeck lifters, that they are a very exotic materialed product and that they are not commonly available in any parts store. He just schrugged with no answer. I look at stock eliminator cars now as expense ET with a stock appearance. I personally keep my car in appearance as it did in the 70's, yes, I now have the same lifters and trans ( H patern with original shifter) as everyone else, because you can't run the number now with out going overboard. If NHRA gave back the .3 on the index, I could use at least the stock lifters again. Stock in now a modified production class in stock looking bodies.

Casey Miles
248H Stock?

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Casey Miles

Stock got messed up when Schubeck lifters where allowed and it was because of people crying that they lifters going bad on camshafts that shouldn't be running the valve spring pressures that they were applying. The valve spring rules should have been kept to what ever pressure you could get away with with the use of a STOCK lifter that you can buy at the local parts store. I asked a tech person one time out at Indy, "if they don't allow any exotic materials in Pro Stock, why is it allowed in Stock?" He replyed to me that he didn't know what I was talking about, so I told him about Schubeck lifters, that they are a very exotic materialed product and that they are not commonly available in any parts store. He just schrugged with no answer. I look at stock eliminator cars now as expense ET with a stock appearance. I personally keep my car in appearance as it did in the 70's, yes, I now have the same lifters and trans ( H patern with original shifter) as everyone else, because you can't run the number now with out going overboard. If NHRA gave back the .3 on the index, I could use at least the stock lifters again. Stock in now a modified production class in stock looking bodies.

Casey Miles
248H Stock?

X's 1000,000,0000000000000000000000 on the last staement !

[danny waters sr]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

X's 1000,000,0000000000000000000000 on the last staement !

Boy ,that makes me feel good about my car since i ain't got none of that tricky stuff.(but i would if i had the funds) I'm right proud of my ole peice running like it does for what i have done....