They say you can't go back....but...??

Mike Carr · 12-25-2011, 11:48 AM

Using my 'dream world' class racing rules, turbo'd cars could be permitted in new FWD Stock, maybe with rules regarding boost limits.

Maybe some of the opposition to my proposed rule changes (and it's really just a 'what-if' type deal) is that racers think their car would be obsoleted and require a ton of $$$ and changes. That is not the case. You would be able to run your current, 2011 car, as is, with no changes whatsoever. Same engine, chassis rules, same weight break, same horsepower, same minimum weight, same Index. The only thing that would change is the letters on your window.

2011 Stock to proposed new S/S chart
Weight break Current Class New Class
6.00 SS/AA
6.50 SS/BA
7.00 SS/CA
7.50 AA/SA SS/DA
8.00 A/SA SS/EA
8.50 B/SA SS/FA
9.00 C/SA SS/GA
9.50 D/SA SS/HA
10.00 E/SA SS/IA
10.50 F/SA SS/JA
11.00 G/SA SS/KA
11.50 H/SA SS/LA
12.00 I/SA SS/MA
12.50 J/SA SS/NA
13.00 K/SA SS/OA
13.50 L/SA SS/PA
14.00 M/SA SS/QA
14.50 N/SA SS/RA
15.00 O/SA SS/SA
16.00 P/SA SS/TA
17.00 Q/SA SS/UA
18.00 R/SA SS/VA
19.00 T/SA SS/WA
20.00 U/SA SS/XA
22.00 V/SA SS/YA
24.00 W/SA SS/ZA

For 2011 Stock racers, your current weight break and class are in the first two columns. Your new class is in the last column. Your horsepower, minimum weight, Index, etc all remain the same. A current E/SA '67 Camaro 396/325 would now be a SS/IA. Still 11.70 Index. Still 3,420 pounds. Same rules per 2011 going forward. Just the letter(s) on your window(s) changes. The exception is alowing a 10.5" slick in your new eliminator (re-named Super Stock). The S/S-to-Modified deal, same thing. Same rules, Index, weight, engine/chassis rules, everything is the same--just the Class on the window changes.

The main thought you be to bring an entry level, lower cost eliminator to Class Racing. Something that the younger generation could possibly afford more easily than current, 2011 Stock Eliminator. (And yes, it is a bit like going back to 1972 in a way. Which I have heard about, though it was seven years before I was born). While the last 10-15 years have seen quite a few of the newer generation of racers enter Class Racing, there is also a large number of vetern racers (I hate the term 'old timers', sounds disrespectful) who are at, or approaching the age where perhaps they may not be able to race for much longer, whether due to health, costs, travel, length of race weekends, etc. I have lost several racing friends in the past few years at age 55 and older, and would like to know that in the future, the car counts will still be strong with new(er) blood coming in.

Starting a new eliminator, mirroring Pure Stock rules, could help bring a wave of new blood into the sport. And without them having to spend a large amount of money as they would in current Stock Eliminator. Yes, I know, Class Racing isn't supposed to be cheap or easy. Just pointing out that, unless a younger person (age 16-25) have rich parents, there isn't going to be a large influx of new talent at the rate things are going. This *could*, perhaps, help with that.

Vic, you're right, today's 'Pure Stockers' aren't what many would call 'Pure'. About the only one I can think of off-hand (and I apologize if I am leaving anyone out) is Steve Klacik, who routinely drives his H/PS '88 Mustang to the IHRA, and my S/SS races in PA and Ohio, races, makes no changes, races it, and has won. He drives 200 miles one way to Hagerstown every year, runs 2-3 tenths under (low 14's), races, and drives home. In 2010, he won an IHRA Div'l race, qualified for the T.O.C., and finished fifth in the world. A type of car similar to this is perfect for the class I am proposing. Something affordable, with stricter rules, to allow the average Joe Classracerfan a chance to race.

Don Carpenter · 12-25-2011, 12:52 PM

Mike,

I have read your proposal three times, and no where do I see the elimination of shoe polish. So it wouldn't be anyway near going back. It would just be another bracket race with more rules to enforce. Whats the point? This so called performance racing we do needs to get back to performance not more bracket racing. Please understand I"m not bashing bracket racing, they are some great drivers that understand you don"t need a bunch of rules and regulations to have fun. When all the so called performance racers that don't want to spend any money or work on their stuff realize that, the real performance racers will be better off. Just my opinion, I could be wrong!

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to ALL!

12-25-2011, 11:48 AM	#1
Mike Carr VIP Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Enon Valley PA Posts: 1,650 Likes: 234 Liked 83 Times in 37 Posts	Re: They say you can't go back....but...?? Using my 'dream world' class racing rules, turbo'd cars could be permitted in new FWD Stock, maybe with rules regarding boost limits. Maybe some of the opposition to my proposed rule changes (and it's really just a 'what-if' type deal) is that racers think their car would be obsoleted and require a ton of $$$ and changes. That is not the case. You would be able to run your current, 2011 car, as is, with no changes whatsoever. Same engine, chassis rules, same weight break, same horsepower, same minimum weight, same Index. The only thing that would change is the letters on your window. 2011 Stock to proposed new S/S chart Weight break Current Class New Class 6.00 SS/AA 6.50 SS/BA 7.00 SS/CA 7.50 AA/SA SS/DA 8.00 A/SA SS/EA 8.50 B/SA SS/FA 9.00 C/SA SS/GA 9.50 D/SA SS/HA 10.00 E/SA SS/IA 10.50 F/SA SS/JA 11.00 G/SA SS/KA 11.50 H/SA SS/LA 12.00 I/SA SS/MA 12.50 J/SA SS/NA 13.00 K/SA SS/OA 13.50 L/SA SS/PA 14.00 M/SA SS/QA 14.50 N/SA SS/RA 15.00 O/SA SS/SA 16.00 P/SA SS/TA 17.00 Q/SA SS/UA 18.00 R/SA SS/VA 19.00 T/SA SS/WA 20.00 U/SA SS/XA 22.00 V/SA SS/YA 24.00 W/SA SS/ZA For 2011 Stock racers, your current weight break and class are in the first two columns. Your new class is in the last column. Your horsepower, minimum weight, Index, etc all remain the same. A current E/SA '67 Camaro 396/325 would now be a SS/IA. Still 11.70 Index. Still 3,420 pounds. Same rules per 2011 going forward. Just the letter(s) on your window(s) changes. The exception is alowing a 10.5" slick in your new eliminator (re-named Super Stock). The S/S-to-Modified deal, same thing. Same rules, Index, weight, engine/chassis rules, everything is the same--just the Class on the window changes. The main thought you be to bring an entry level, lower cost eliminator to Class Racing. Something that the younger generation could possibly afford more easily than current, 2011 Stock Eliminator. (And yes, it is a bit like going back to 1972 in a way. Which I have heard about, though it was seven years before I was born). While the last 10-15 years have seen quite a few of the newer generation of racers enter Class Racing, there is also a large number of vetern racers (I hate the term 'old timers', sounds disrespectful) who are at, or approaching the age where perhaps they may not be able to race for much longer, whether due to health, costs, travel, length of race weekends, etc. I have lost several racing friends in the past few years at age 55 and older, and would like to know that in the future, the car counts will still be strong with new(er) blood coming in. Starting a new eliminator, mirroring Pure Stock rules, could help bring a wave of new blood into the sport. And without them having to spend a large amount of money as they would in current Stock Eliminator. Yes, I know, Class Racing isn't supposed to be cheap or easy. Just pointing out that, unless a younger person (age 16-25) have rich parents, there isn't going to be a large influx of new talent at the rate things are going. This could, perhaps, help with that. Vic, you're right, today's 'Pure Stockers' aren't what many would call 'Pure'. About the only one I can think of off-hand (and I apologize if I am leaving anyone out) is Steve Klacik, who routinely drives his H/PS '88 Mustang to the IHRA, and my S/SS races in PA and Ohio, races, makes no changes, races it, and has won. He drives 200 miles one way to Hagerstown every year, runs 2-3 tenths under (low 14's), races, and drives home. In 2010, he won an IHRA Div'l race, qualified for the T.O.C., and finished fifth in the world. A type of car similar to this is perfect for the class I am proposing. Something affordable, with stricter rules, to allow the average Joe Classracerfan a chance to race. __________________ Mike Carr, Tri-State S/SS Association President Looking for 2015 S/SS Race Sponsors Contact me if interested buffdaddy_1302@hotmail.com (724) 510-5912

12-25-2011, 12:52 PM	#2
Don Carpenter Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Ambridge Pa. Posts: 10 Likes: 14 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: They say you can't go back....but...?? Mike, I have read your proposal three times, and no where do I see the elimination of shoe polish. So it wouldn't be anyway near going back. It would just be another bracket race with more rules to enforce. Whats the point? This so called performance racing we do needs to get back to performance not more bracket racing. Please understand I"m not bashing bracket racing, they are some great drivers that understand you don"t need a bunch of rules and regulations to have fun. When all the so called performance racers that don't want to spend any money or work on their stuff realize that, the real performance racers will be better off. Just my opinion, I could be wrong! Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to ALL!