B/PS lt1 formula

KennyAnderson · 10-10-2013, 04:59 AM

Morning Russell,

I am the guy building the 93 Z-28. Just getting started as a matter of fact. Bought the car from a local guy who was already racing it in no-e here at home. All it has is a mail order chip in it. According to Jim Woods it is a natural C/PS although I plan on dropping down to D. I don't think I could get it light enough to really be a factor in B. As it sits its 100 lbs over for D mainly due to the nut behind the wheel, me. When my son takes over we will be good for C. This car is for him when he is done with JR's next season. I just bought an FTI 3800 stall converter and lock-up eliminator kit (Sorry Dan. Good friends w/ Greg and Troy Williams @ FTI and they made me a killer deal). Lock-up removes 6 lbs of rotating mass from the converter and this car wont see much if any street time. I was looking for more stall but with a max power @ around 5500 more than one guy felt like it would be to close to power levels on the shift fall back. I plan on putting in 4.10 gears and have some headers coming. I will use some small flowmasters and put dumps under the car. This should make a tad bit more power but more importantly cuts 50 lbs of junk removing the X pipe/cats/over the rear exhaust. The car runs 9.oh's and teens in the eigth right now so I need 7 tenths just to play since D has an 8.50 index. Hoping to make the IHRA race in Lakeland in a couple weeks but time is running low and I am busy as a 1 armed paper hanger. Plan on getting converter in and all a/c heater stuff out next week. I'll keep you posted and look forward to checking out your build.

russellauto1 · 10-10-2013, 07:32 AM

THANKS kenny, That is some Great information. I was kinda looking at the same converter, but wasn't sure of the stall. I was leaning towards 4.10 or 4.56. I am still gonna use 7.5 rear axle but weld axle tubes, rear support and some other modds that some of the mustang guys do. As far as the exhaust, right now I have shorty headers with a aftermarket y pipe. Gonna do some research on what I can do there. I think I am going to leave a/c on cr for now. Just so I can make weight and cool off. What wheels are you going to run? I am unsure of the rear back spacing I should get. But I may get some 16" so I can put drag radials on the rear. Thanks for the info from Everyone and Keep it coming. It makes me think a little hard!!!

ss3011 · 10-10-2013, 08:42 AM

GM sells a A/C delete pulley that replaces the A/C compressor. PN 10115875 .

Mike Taylor 3601 · 10-10-2013, 09:05 AM

russelauto1
I have converter you may be interested in,is vigilante was in LS car w/4L60E,I think will fit 700R4 also, they rate it 3800-4200 is a non lock up has maybe 15 street miles since new,still has white grease on neck from install. can look for serial # if want more info.
will sell for 375.00 if interested call me 606-678-3039 shop 606 278 0601 cell
Mike Taylor 3601

KennyAnderson · 10-10-2013, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by russellauto1

THANKS kenny, That is some Great information. I was kinda looking at the same converter, but wasn't sure of the stall. I was leaning towards 4.10 or 4.56. I am still gonna use 7.5 rear axle but weld axle tubes, rear support and some other modds that some of the mustang guys do. As far as the exhaust, right now I have shorty headers with a aftermarket y pipe. Gonna do some research on what I can do there. I think I am going to leave a/c on cr for now. Just so I can make weight and cool off. What wheels are you going to run? I am unsure of the rear back spacing I should get. But I may get some 16" so I can put drag radials on the rear. Thanks for the info from Everyone and Keep it coming. It makes me think a little hard!!!

Hey Aaron, You are welcome and I'm excited I'm not alone in this endeavor! I bought some 15 x 8 Weld Pro Stars off a member here. Have a 5.5" backspacing and fit perfect. A 15 x 10 with a 7.5" backspace also fits. I used some regular 15 x 4 frontrunners on the front although my wheels had 27" Goodyears and they look like tractor tires! LOL! Going to get some 25"-26". On the rear I have MT 275 street radials. Great tires and they hook really good with this setup. The front wheels will require a 5/16" spacer to clear the calipers. My rear calipers were already ground on to fit the 15's. 15's are nice cause there are some X275 guys local and I can get their takeoffs for cheap. I don't think you will need to keep anything to make weight, in fact I think you'll need to gut everything possible. Your minimum weight in B/PS will be 3005lbs with you on board. I'm pretty sure it would be impossible to get that light with all the pure stock required stuff on there. C/PS would be 3320 lbs. Im shooting for D/PS with a minimum race weight of 3635. As it is my car with my fat *** in it is quite a bit over that. Im nervous about the factory rear. I have some buds who are Camaro guru's. All of em said the factory rear will start giving me fits when we get down into the 1.70/60/50 shorty times. This car might eventually be a crate motor car so although I don't want to spend the coin right now, a 12 bolt is in its future. Look up LS1tech.com. More Camaro/Firebird info than you will ever need. One thing that I found REALLY useful, in the racing section there is a sticky for all weight reduction parts and just about everything you can gut and what it weighs. Get BUSY Bro!

KennyAnderson · 10-10-2013, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KennyAnderson

Hey Aaron, You are welcome and I'm excited I'm not alone in this endeavor! I bought some 15 x 8 Weld Pro Stars off a member here. Have a 5.5" backspacing and fit perfect. A 15 x 10 with a 7.5" backspace also fits. I used some regular 15 x 4 frontrunners on the front although my wheels had 27" Goodyears and they look like tractor tires! LOL! Going to get some 25"-26". On the rear I have MT 275 street radials. Great tires and they hook really good with this setup. The front wheels will require a 5/16" spacer to clear the calipers. My rear calipers were already ground on to fit the 15's. 15's are nice cause there are some X275 guys local and I can get their takeoffs for cheap. I don't think you will need to keep anything to make weight, in fact I think you'll need to gut everything possible. Your minimum weight in B/PS will be 3005lbs with you on board. I'm pretty sure it would be impossible to get that light with all the pure stock required stuff on there. C/PS would be 3320 lbs. Im shooting for D/PS with a minimum race weight of 3635. As it is my car with my fat *** in it is quite a bit over that. Im nervous about the factory rear. I have some buds who are Camaro guru's. All of em said the factory rear will start giving me fits when we get down into the 1.70/60/50 shorty times. This car might eventually be a crate motor car so although I don't want to spend the coin right now, a 12 bolt is in its future. Look up LS1tech.com. More Camaro/Firebird info than you will ever need. One thing that I found REALLY useful, in the racing section there is a sticky for all weight reduction parts and just about everything you can gut and what it weighs. Get BUSY Bro!

PS; Do some homework before you buy a converter, I was looking at a couple used Yank units but all were for an LS motor. Was told x2 that an LS converter wouldn't fit a LT1. Pad spacing or ??? different.

Mark Yacavone · 10-11-2013, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KennyAnderson

PS; Do some homework before you buy a converter, I was looking at a couple used Yank units but all were for an LS motor. Was told x2 that an LS converter wouldn't fit a LT1. Pad spacing or ??? different.

The LS converter has a much higher overall height, plus the bolt pattern is larger.

You can adapt the LT1 converter to an LS, but not the other way around. LS is too long to retro fit it .

You can buy an aftermarket flex plate or drill the LS one to the early b.p. and extend the pilot to use an early converter with an LS .

gbur · 10-12-2013, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

The LS converter has a much higher overall height, plus the bolt pattern is larger.

You can adapt the LT1 converter to an LS, but not the other way around. LS is too long to retro fit it .

You can buy an aftermarket flex plate or drill the LS one to the early b.p. and extend the pilot to use an early converter with an LS .

so what is the difference of 4L60 and turbo 350 spline count

Mark Yacavone · 10-12-2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gbur

so what is the difference of 4L60 and turbo 350 spline count

No difference in count ..both 30 spline ..Difference is in the length
Stator support shaft...all the same in modern GM transmissions ..Again, different lengths and placement

ss3011 · 10-12-2013, 11:04 AM

While the spline count is the same, at 30, there are differences in the turbine shaft. The majority of the 700-R4 transmissions used a "298 mm" torque converter. The turbine shaft has a stub and an o-ring on the end close to the engine, the splines are closer to the transmission end. Most of the car transmissions used that combination, even the early LS engines. The trucks with LS engines got a "300 mm" converter. The turbine shaft has the splines closer to the engine end and a journal and o-ring between the spline end and transmission. The basic converter to flexplate spacing is the same between the 700-R4 (4L60-e) and the 350/400 THM transmissions. The later 4L60-e with the 300 mm converter is different and would require a different flexplate , and a spacer for the crankshaft to converter pilot.

10-10-2013, 04:59 AM	#1
KennyAnderson Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 293 Likes: 38 Liked 368 Times in 122 Posts	Re: B/PS lt1 formula Morning Russell, I am the guy building the 93 Z-28. Just getting started as a matter of fact. Bought the car from a local guy who was already racing it in no-e here at home. All it has is a mail order chip in it. According to Jim Woods it is a natural C/PS although I plan on dropping down to D. I don't think I could get it light enough to really be a factor in B. As it sits its 100 lbs over for D mainly due to the nut behind the wheel, me. When my son takes over we will be good for C. This car is for him when he is done with JR's next season. I just bought an FTI 3800 stall converter and lock-up eliminator kit (Sorry Dan. Good friends w/ Greg and Troy Williams @ FTI and they made me a killer deal). Lock-up removes 6 lbs of rotating mass from the converter and this car wont see much if any street time. I was looking for more stall but with a max power @ around 5500 more than one guy felt like it would be to close to power levels on the shift fall back. I plan on putting in 4.10 gears and have some headers coming. I will use some small flowmasters and put dumps under the car. This should make a tad bit more power but more importantly cuts 50 lbs of junk removing the X pipe/cats/over the rear exhaust. The car runs 9.oh's and teens in the eigth right now so I need 7 tenths just to play since D has an 8.50 index. Hoping to make the IHRA race in Lakeland in a couple weeks but time is running low and I am busy as a 1 armed paper hanger. Plan on getting converter in and all a/c heater stuff out next week. I'll keep you posted and look forward to checking out your build.

10-10-2013, 07:32 AM	#2
russellauto1 Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 150 Likes: 2 Liked 35 Times in 6 Posts	Re: B/PS lt1 formula THANKS kenny, That is some Great information. I was kinda looking at the same converter, but wasn't sure of the stall. I was leaning towards 4.10 or 4.56. I am still gonna use 7.5 rear axle but weld axle tubes, rear support and some other modds that some of the mustang guys do. As far as the exhaust, right now I have shorty headers with a aftermarket y pipe. Gonna do some research on what I can do there. I think I am going to leave a/c on cr for now. Just so I can make weight and cool off. What wheels are you going to run? I am unsure of the rear back spacing I should get. But I may get some 16" so I can put drag radials on the rear. Thanks for the info from Everyone and Keep it coming. It makes me think a little hard!!!

10-10-2013, 08:42 AM	#3
ss3011 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 911 Likes: 70 Liked 239 Times in 114 Posts	Re: B/PS lt1 formula GM sells a A/C delete pulley that replaces the A/C compressor. PN 10115875 .

10-10-2013, 09:05 AM	#4
Mike Taylor 3601 VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Somerset,Ky Posts: 1,382 Likes: 374 Liked 321 Times in 109 Posts	Re: B/PS lt1 formula russelauto1 I have converter you may be interested in,is vigilante was in LS car w/4L60E,I think will fit 700R4 also, they rate it 3800-4200 is a non lock up has maybe 15 street miles since new,still has white grease on neck from install. can look for serial # if want more info. will sell for 375.00 if interested call me 606-678-3039 shop 606 278 0601 cell Mike Taylor 3601 Last edited by Mike Taylor 3601; 10-10-2013 at 09:06 AM. Reason: spelling

10-12-2013, 11:04 AM	#10
ss3011 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 911 Likes: 70 Liked 239 Times in 114 Posts	Re: B/PS lt1 formula While the spline count is the same, at 30, there are differences in the turbine shaft. The majority of the 700-R4 transmissions used a "298 mm" torque converter. The turbine shaft has a stub and an o-ring on the end close to the engine, the splines are closer to the transmission end. Most of the car transmissions used that combination, even the early LS engines. The trucks with LS engines got a "300 mm" converter. The turbine shaft has the splines closer to the engine end and a journal and o-ring between the spline end and transmission. The basic converter to flexplate spacing is the same between the 700-R4 (4L60-e) and the 350/400 THM transmissions. The later 4L60-e with the 300 mm converter is different and would require a different flexplate , and a spacer for the crankshaft to converter pilot.