Econo Modified

[randy wilson]

Just curious. Why the 10 degree valve angle on the Ford, and the 15 degree valve angle on the Mopar? Thought they were 20 degree, and 18 degree respectively. I believe the vortec bowtie is still 23 degree.

[FINESPLINE]

I dont know about that Ford head that he mentions but there is a W2 15 degree head made for the oval / dirt track boys . I assume these heads are factory heads cast for a special racing niche. SHADY DELL SPEED was my point of reference for the 15 degree W2 heads.

[1320racer]

The world has changed and here in the good old USA, we have too many that are on the entitlement line with the same crowd thinking everybody should be equal, life should be fair with no winners. More importantly to this discussion, we are no longer a car culture and all drag racing is on life support now, there are no new drivers in any great numbers building class cars to go drag racing and I would think bracket racing is seeing the majority of the few new drivers giving it a try. NHRA without question would have no interest in another spec class. So other than some local, maybe regional interest from a small group of old guys that have the coin to burn building a car for a class that has no appeal to the sanctioning body, track owners or fans our focus should be on promoting what we have/what we do. IMO, if the NHRA adds any class it should be a 10.5 class. This would put more fans in the seats which is what it was always about. Without that drag racing's future for my son's generation doesn't look promising.

[442OLDS]

Reading this thread has made me realize that the guy that came up with the PINKS idea wasn't as far off the wall as I thought he was.

[1320racer]

as much as I didn't like the show or premise, which IMO, promoted street racing, it worked and got cars to the track I had never seen before and filled the stands with paying customers!

[FINESPLINE]

I here you loud and clear, Ed. Unfortunately, more and more people in the sport are coming to realize that maybe the NHRA is not the answer to their racing wants and needs. As you well know there are many ways to go racing and this is just ideas being thrown out there for people who would just like to run heads up all the time and keep the costs in line without a chance of being scrapped by the stroke of a pen.

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by randy wilson

Just curious. Why the 10 degree valve angle on the Ford, and the 15 degree valve angle on the Mopar? Thought they were 20 degree, and 18 degree respectively. I believe the vortec bowtie is still 23 degree.

Both approved cylinder heads are for circle track applications, over the counter with a OEM part number just like the Chevy Bow Tie Vortec head. Also allowed in the Chevy applications, although available in trucks only, is the cast iron LS-1 cylinder head.

On the W2 heads, there is a 18 degree for the OEM block and the 15 degree, which requires the Mopar racing block with the 48 degree lifter angle.

Although the Bow Tie Vortec head retains the 23 degree valve angle, the head version being used is the large port with 235cc intake volume as cast.

The N351 and W2 heads have as cast smaller volumes. However, the latest version of the 15 degree W2 head was redesigned and I have seen a cylinder head with a 2.08" intake and blended bowl with no additional porting flow 310 CFM @ 0.700" with a 190cc intake port.

Based on the performance of Michael Mans when he raced in SS/CS with the Bow Tie Vortec head, I believe a well built Chevy engine with the Pro Action head and even with the cast iron LS-1 head is capable to run in the 8's at the right track.

[randy wilson]

No, Wrong. Fair for everyone is bracket racing. Very boring, but fair. Spec head racing is affordable, and the chance of being competitive is fair. But still, at the end of the day, the guy who crosses the finish line first, is the winner.
you know you're actually racing, when you don't need clocks, and or computers to determine the winner. A win loss light would suffice. Ha!

[randy wilson]

Good point on the heads SS. Was just curious was all. Not trying to stir anything up. Manns was an animal with the vortec, bowtie deal. I'll hand him that. But, at this rate, his stuff is already obsolete. My point again. Any manufacturer can keep producing a dominate head. So what? Proves nothing. Everyone playing on the exact same plane, proves a lot. There again, what's to stop GM or any others producing a killer head in cast iron, and peeing in everyone's post toasties?

[joespanova]

Originally Posted by 1320racer

The world has changed and here in the good old USA, we have too many that are on the entitlement line with the same crowd thinking everybody should be equal, life should be fair with no winners. More importantly to this discussion, we are no longer a car culture and all drag racing is on life support now, there are no new drivers in any great numbers building class cars to go drag racing and I would think bracket racing is seeing the majority of the few new drivers giving it a try. NHRA without question would have no interest in another spec class. So other than some local, maybe regional interest from a small group of old guys that have the coin to burn building a car for a class that has no appeal to the sanctioning body, track owners or fans our focus should be on promoting what we have/what we do. IMO, if the NHRA adds any class it should be a 10.5 class. This would put more fans in the seats which is what it was always about. Without that drag racing's future for my son's generation doesn't look promising.

Ed , how'd you get back on here? LOL
Now behave yourself
The NHRA REFUSES to think outside the bubble........and ultimately it will be their demise. The heads up and 10.5 stuff seems to always draw a crowd and apparently there's new blood in there all the time........at least based on the web sites I occasionaly roam thru.
There is still plenty of interest in drag racing , considering the world we live in today and smart heads could exploit it.