Econo Modified

randy wilson · 01-16-2014, 07:52 PM

Todd, glad to hear I ain't the only idiot that thinks this would work. I also have Chris Paget of Comp Cams, Al Parker, of Parker engines, (he builds a lot of spec sprints), and the editor of Drag Illustrated, Wyatt Halden interested, and said he would put out a huge article on it if it evolved into a class. Does anyone remember the Midwest Drag Magazine that promoted an econo class dragster\altered with flat tops, and hydraulic cams? It never got off the ground for three reasons. One, they never gave it a real chance, two, any iron head, that I think you could modify, and three, no one even knew it existed. We damn sure don't want to make the same mistakes. Anyone that wants to slam this as eventually an out of control class, needs to understand there would be NO GREY AREA! The reason their econo class never took off was the unlimited selection, and modifications allowed to the head. In that case, yes, comp guys would rule. The head is the key, and the one truly limiting factor.

Dick Butler · 01-16-2014, 08:13 PM

Randy, please explain the Cam and spring specs. Any rev kit rules?
Any Div 3 interested parties?

randy wilson · 01-16-2014, 09:59 PM

We never had a cam spec in spec, which was our top class. But we had a .500 lift max in stock, .600 inch max in modified stock, and stock option. It was easy to check with a dial indicator at the valve. The Brodix spec head for Ford, Chevy, and Mopar will only except 1.55 springs, nothing larger. I think a .700 lift max at the valve will save money on valve train in spec. I found no performance difference with a cam basically in that range with a spring at 350# on the seat, and 850# over the nose, then with a spring at 285# on the seat, and 675# over the nose. So, I think it would take a lot of expense out of the valve train. Now then, if you allow unlimited lift, however, it would come into play. We were successful in turning 9,600 rpm with the lighter springs, you just had to stay on top of them. I don't care either way on rev kits. I won't use one, but I say go for it. There is less HP with one installed, so I don't think it's an issue.

Ed Wright · 01-16-2014, 11:02 PM

Spec heads would be the way to go.

Mike Taylor 3601 · 01-17-2014, 09:28 AM

Dick,
I'm in div 3,and 46 years old, modified is what I wanted to race,I was trying to get there when IHRA still had it,but did'nt make it in time,sold that car.
The spec head would put it within reach for me,alot of exotic heads are'nt that expensive by theirselves,but by the time you get everything to go with them the price goes way up,then a year or two later,there's a better setup you need to compete.
I maybe able to get my hands on borrowed car,and put spec head engine together,but would take me some time.
Mike Taylor 3601

Dick Butler · 01-17-2014, 09:56 AM

Randy, any piston that someone makes to fit the chamber?or limited to cut costs? how about angle milling head etc?

randy wilson · 01-17-2014, 10:05 AM

Mike. If need be, I could loan you an engine, but only have 2 engines in the 289 c.i. and 322 c.i. Don't worry, if you hurt one, no penalty. They ain't doing me any good, and will end up being the wrong size for the class anyway. This ain't a setup, just trying to help. I'll bet I could talk Steve Thompson into one last, no break-out race if the cobalt don't sell. Guys, it's the only car we have available at this time. The deuce is up to Rob Nall's shop right now, getting work done in the engine bay, plumbing, body panel work, to get ready for the body shop. But still a long ways off. If it happens, don't plan on having it in New York, or somewhere. Central U.S.A. if possible. I think I could get Eddyville to give us a weekend, but they are now IHRA.

randy wilson · 01-17-2014, 10:15 AM

Dick. I've gave this A LOT of thought, and I say, (now, all I'm getting ready to propose is to ease tear down) any piston, any rings, angle mill, and polishing the combustion chamber is the ONLY thing allowed other then a valve job. Any stroke, but a 1" threaded hole in the side of the pan for inspection to keep ultra trick cranks out. Any size journal. I doubt the $1,300 rings are as advantageous without the pump. Stock type oil pump, no billet. Just ideas. All we'd have to do is P&G, check pan, put a good scope in exhaust port, and down intake, and BOOM. We're basically done. But now comes the argument comp guys will fool you easily. That's where the number 1 qualifier, top speed, winner, and or runner up, record breakers have to have head OK'd by BRODIX.

01-16-2014, 07:52 PM	#1
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Todd, glad to hear I ain't the only idiot that thinks this would work. I also have Chris Paget of Comp Cams, Al Parker, of Parker engines, (he builds a lot of spec sprints), and the editor of Drag Illustrated, Wyatt Halden interested, and said he would put out a huge article on it if it evolved into a class. Does anyone remember the Midwest Drag Magazine that promoted an econo class dragster\altered with flat tops, and hydraulic cams? It never got off the ground for three reasons. One, they never gave it a real chance, two, any iron head, that I think you could modify, and three, no one even knew it existed. We damn sure don't want to make the same mistakes. Anyone that wants to slam this as eventually an out of control class, needs to understand there would be NO GREY AREA! The reason their econo class never took off was the unlimited selection, and modifications allowed to the head. In that case, yes, comp guys would rule. The head is the key, and the one truly limiting factor. __________________ don,t have one

01-16-2014, 08:13 PM	#2
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Randy, please explain the Cam and spring specs. Any rev kit rules? Any Div 3 interested parties?

01-16-2014, 09:59 PM	#3
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: Econo Modified We never had a cam spec in spec, which was our top class. But we had a .500 lift max in stock, .600 inch max in modified stock, and stock option. It was easy to check with a dial indicator at the valve. The Brodix spec head for Ford, Chevy, and Mopar will only except 1.55 springs, nothing larger. I think a .700 lift max at the valve will save money on valve train in spec. I found no performance difference with a cam basically in that range with a spring at 350# on the seat, and 850# over the nose, then with a spring at 285# on the seat, and 675# over the nose. So, I think it would take a lot of expense out of the valve train. Now then, if you allow unlimited lift, however, it would come into play. We were successful in turning 9,600 rpm with the lighter springs, you just had to stay on top of them. I don't care either way on rev kits. I won't use one, but I say go for it. There is less HP with one installed, so I don't think it's an issue. __________________ don,t have one Last edited by randy wilson; 01-16-2014 at 10:06 PM.

01-16-2014, 11:02 PM	#4
Ed Wright Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sand Springs, OK Posts: 8,132 Likes: 896 Liked 390 Times in 170 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Spec heads would be the way to go. __________________ Ed Wright 4156 SS/JA

01-17-2014, 09:28 AM	#5
Mike Taylor 3601 VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Somerset,Ky Posts: 1,380 Likes: 371 Liked 319 Times in 108 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Dick, I'm in div 3,and 46 years old, modified is what I wanted to race,I was trying to get there when IHRA still had it,but did'nt make it in time,sold that car. The spec head would put it within reach for me,alot of exotic heads are'nt that expensive by theirselves,but by the time you get everything to go with them the price goes way up,then a year or two later,there's a better setup you need to compete. I maybe able to get my hands on borrowed car,and put spec head engine together,but would take me some time. Mike Taylor 3601

01-17-2014, 09:56 AM	#6
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Randy, any piston that someone makes to fit the chamber?or limited to cut costs? how about angle milling head etc?

01-17-2014, 10:05 AM	#7
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Mike. If need be, I could loan you an engine, but only have 2 engines in the 289 c.i. and 322 c.i. Don't worry, if you hurt one, no penalty. They ain't doing me any good, and will end up being the wrong size for the class anyway. This ain't a setup, just trying to help. I'll bet I could talk Steve Thompson into one last, no break-out race if the cobalt don't sell. Guys, it's the only car we have available at this time. The deuce is up to Rob Nall's shop right now, getting work done in the engine bay, plumbing, body panel work, to get ready for the body shop. But still a long ways off. If it happens, don't plan on having it in New York, or somewhere. Central U.S.A. if possible. I think I could get Eddyville to give us a weekend, but they are now IHRA. __________________ don,t have one

01-17-2014, 10:15 AM	#8
randy wilson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 882 Likes: 0 Liked 22 Times in 22 Posts	Re: Econo Modified Dick. I've gave this A LOT of thought, and I say, (now, all I'm getting ready to propose is to ease tear down) any piston, any rings, angle mill, and polishing the combustion chamber is the ONLY thing allowed other then a valve job. Any stroke, but a 1" threaded hole in the side of the pan for inspection to keep ultra trick cranks out. Any size journal. I doubt the $1,300 rings are as advantageous without the pump. Stock type oil pump, no billet. Just ideas. All we'd have to do is P&G, check pan, put a good scope in exhaust port, and down intake, and BOOM. We're basically done. But now comes the argument comp guys will fool you easily. That's where the number 1 qualifier, top speed, winner, and or runner up, record breakers have to have head OK'd by BRODIX. __________________ don,t have one