What's wrong with Stock?

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

No - NHRA needs a nostalgia stock eliminator - then the new cars can race themselves.

No, NHRA needs to put factory experimental cars that were never built to drive on the street in their own class. Factory Experimental.

Stock was NEVER about cars that were never built to be legal to drive on the streets. That's why the Super Stock Hemi cars, and several other factory race cars, were not legal for Stock Eliminator. Even the most radical L-88 and ZL-1 cars had all street legal equipment, a VIN, and could be registered and insured with a regular title as they rolled off the show room floor. None of the new factory race cars can claim that, not one of them.

You want Stock Eliminator to fit your car, and the rest of the racers to find a new class.

[Bob Mulry]

Ron, Ron, Ron

I guess you missed my post.......

Bob

PS:
.....and yes my car is 40 years old which is 30 years younger me.

[Andys dad]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

I suppose that's okay, if you want to be competitive by outspending your competition and having the rules changed to suit you.

If you can be happy with that, and proud of it, well, good for you.

We do not have enough money to stay fast anymore - we have been passed by in four short years by the blower cars

When we bought ours - we knew we could not stay fast without a lot of work.

You guys on here still have not acknowledge the new cars take work to stay fast - I do not need recognition or support.- from anyone on here.

You guys (on here) hope time stands still for another 40 years - it will not.

In the new world cars do not have carburetors or distributors - there is not a single current car produced today which does not have fuel injection and a factory computer.

A novel concept might be to race cars which are available today. That is what the big three think and NHRA does not disagree.

Its about selling cars - not having a way to race nostalgia cars forever and ever and ever.

OK - I am done for today.

[Pedigo Perf]

I talked at length with Scott Burton while he was traveling home empty handed from Indy. When I asked why he didn't show for first round (hoping for a miracle) the reply In his words was " my car isn't broke, the NHRA rules are". He indicated he wouldn't waste his time returning to Indy until the problem is fixed.

This BS has gone on long enough and it is the same reason I don't get wound up about racing like I used to. An Indy class win would certainly be cherished but how likely is that with a carburetor in an upper class car?

Rather than being served up on an NHRA platter as a first round sacrifice, he tied his car down and headed for the mountains of home. Few people have been as supportive and loyal to NHRA as the Burton's and Scott is not alone in this issue. Hats off to Scott for taking a stand at INDY, in front of the NHRA, and not just on the internet like most of us.

Tracy Pedigo
C/SA

[Greg Hill]

Originally Posted by Pedigo Perf

I talked at length with Scott Burton while he was traveling home empty handed from Indy. When I asked why he didn't show for first round (hoping for a miracle) the reply In his words was " my car isn't broke, the NHRA rules are". He indicated he wouldn't waste his time returning to Indy until the problem is fixed.

This BS has gone on long enough and it is the same reason I don't get wound up about racing like I used to. An Indy class win would certainly be cherished but how likely is that with a carburetor in an upper class car?

Rather than being served up on an NHRA platter as a first round sacrifice, he tied his car down and headed for the mountains of home. Few people have been as supportive and loyal to NHRA as the Burton's and Scott is not alone in this issue. Hats off to Scott for taking a stand at INDY, in front of the NHRA, and not just on the internet like most of us.

Tracy Pedigo
C/SA

Tracy, you know the sad thing is that probably no one from NHRA even noticed.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

We do not have enough money to stay fast anymore - we have been passed by in four short years by the blower cars

When we bought ours - we knew we could not stay fast without a lot of work.

You guys on here still have not acknowledge the new cars take work to stay fast - I do not need recognition or support.- from anyone on here.

You guys (on here) hope time stands still for another 40 years - it will not.

In the new world cars do not have carburetors or distributors - there is not a single current car produced today which does not have fuel injection and a factory computer.

A novel concept might be to race cars which are available today. That is what the big three think and NHRA does not disagree.

Its about selling cars - not having a way to race nostalgia cars forever and ever and ever.

OK - I am done for today.

Well, you asked for it. Several of us, 6 years ago, warned everyone that the new expensive cars would have their combinations made obsolete every 2-3 years at best. All any factory has to do is draw up a new engine combination on paper and get NHRA to approve it with a nice new soft factor. They don't have to build the engines, they don't even have to sell new race cars with the engines in them. Which is exactly why they should be Factory Experimental cars and not Stock Eliminator cars. Because the factories are experimenting.

It has absolutely nothing to do with fuel injection, distributorless ignition, and computers. Those have been in Stock Eliminator for 20 years. No one cares about that. That is not what makes the new cars perform.

What they DO care about is over 0.600" lift roller cams, 1000+ CFM throttle bodies, tunnel ram intakes, and what amounts to CNC ported heads (they CNC port a head, pull a mold, and cast the new head). None of which have ever been in Stock Eliminator before, and very little of which, if any, is seen on production street cars. Again, these are Factory Experimental cars. These are near Super Stock engines running in Stock Eliminator, and many of them starting out factored at or below what the older cars are factored at, with the older car having half the horsepower potential.

It has everything to do with the factory race cars not even being close to the street legal new cars for sale.

You want to make this about selling new production cars? Fine. Race new production street cars. Let's see how it works. I'm all for it. By all means, bring on the new production street cars.

The fact is, we're racing cars and combinations that were sold and driven on the street, against cars and combinations that would never, and could never, be sold for street use. I don't have a problem racing an old 427 powered 69 Camaro against a 2014 Camaro with a Stock Eliminator prepared engine based on the engine that comes in it when you drive it off the showroom floor and buy license plates to drive on the street. What I do have a problem with is racing an old 427 powered 69 Camaro against a new 2014 Camaro with a built for racing engine, that is almost as radical as my 396/375 Super Stock engine, that cannot be sold in a new car to drive on the street. Especially when it is factored almost the same as our old Camaro.

Now, not only do the factory race cars get soft factors and get to run in Stock Eliminator, they now get their own set of rules, and an AHFS waiver, so they can qualify as far under the index as they want with no penalty, while the older cars get none of the above.

[Mark Yacavone]

Alan,
15 to 1 compression in a 2014 engine
LOL

[Bob Mulry]

Ron, Ron, Ron

How far under could a 2014 Camaro be with an almost 50 year old L-88 rated at 225 Horsepower?????

It's not FI, Blowers, Overhead Cams, 4 Valves per cylinder it's the rating that the Factory puts on these engines with the blessing of NHRA

Some people get it. Some people don't.........

Being fast is a relative thing....
Is a B/SA car that runs 10.90 fast or is it an M/SA car that runs 11.65 ???
I think you know the correct answer...

Bob

[Lee Valentine]

Andy,s Dad it's not about old and new it's about all of us running under the same rules. I ran one of the first F.I. cars in our area and took some B.S. about it so I know how that goes , but I was running by the same rules.

[RKelliher]

I agree that the new cars should be put in either a fs of fx class but only run in ss catagory. they could be set like the modified class super stocks,afx,bfx,etc.and not be in any other class. this is because they do not qualify for regular classes in stock or superstock. this would be the fairest way to handle this problem and would boost the superstock numbers.