2015 Rules - Page 13

Alan Roehrich · 11-01-2014, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Ya know, take away his trash talk and b##lbusting and Charliebob does have a good point. IMHO we really don't need any more new classes. It's just watering down the gene pool some more. NHRA reacted exactly the way that NHRA always reacts when they create a problem. Instead of admitting to creating a problem and fixing it, they just create another entirely different problem. They should have just taken a step back from the AHFS and fixed all of their factoring mistakes (old and new) in one shot. As it stands now, we are going to wind up with a "segregated" eliminator just like when we had all of the FI classes. The difference being, with the FI classes, when the factors got in line(relatively) they were brought back into the regular classes. That will not be as easily done with these new classes as they are combining sticks and autos and (I'm guessing) changing the indexes.
And maybe I should just keep my opinions to myself seeing as, of all the cars I own, none of them runs higher than P. Oh yeah, there are still some of those factoring mistakes bouncing around that can kick the snot out of my stuff.

Billy, the problem is that those cars, and especially the factory programs, simply don't fit in Stock, the way Stock is structured, and they cannot be made to. They don't really fit into Super Stock, either.

So, unlike the fuel injected production street cars, you'll never be able to merge them back into the regular classes, and it has nothing to do with them having stick and automatics combined.

So long as those programs continue, you will have paper cars built out of the parts catalogs, and intentionally assigned extremely bogus factors. It is the way those programs are designed and intended to work. It allows the factories to participate for the smallest possible investment, and still have their cars go extremely fast.

Since NHRA evidently has no desire to create one or two entirely new eliminators, the closest they can come to leveling the field is adding separate classes to the two existing eliminators for the factory programs. I'd love to see those cars truly separated, as much for their own benefit as well as for the rest of us.

The truth is, in a completely separate eliminator of their own, they could really be showcased, and do a lot of good for the factories and for drag racing. There is no telling what they could grow those classes into, there's almost no limit, provided it is done right.

The Super Stock version of a class like that could be the second coming of Pro Stock, much the way Pro Stock began, properly managed. Unfortunately, I don't think NHRA wants to do that, and I don't think they have enough of the right people to do it, and I expect the number of those people to continue to decline.

Nick Heath · 11-01-2014, 09:09 AM

Imagine that, the factory cars got their own classes, like everyone was asking for...and people are STILL complaining!!!

Marty Buth · 11-01-2014, 09:16 AM

Will the FS cars have a combo of their own, when only 1 car is entered in a particular class? Or will they be in the combo for the "older" cars?

Ed Wright · 11-01-2014, 09:34 AM

Nick, the only people complaining (and not being straight about why they are unhappy) have new cars and don't like suddenly not being one of the fast guys in their classes. If NHRA doesn't lower their indexes about half a second they will still dominate the top of qualifying sheets if they want to. Would still be killers in class combo races. Of course, it's not a big deal to guys running lower classes where they didn't have to deal with them heads up. Most people are happy.

Bruce Noland · 11-01-2014, 11:01 AM

Billy is slipping folks. He actually just asked whether he should keep his opinions to himself? And deprive us of his wisdom and common sense. No way.

Dick Butler · 11-01-2014, 03:43 PM

Factoring by HP has always been a flawed method. It punishes the hard workers. Dividing the cars into smaller and smaller classes decreases this as they don't run another car type for class and only race bracket style at points meets.
There is the point where if you want to be a class winner now regardless the age of car you can do it. Maybe even with a Bye.
For those who "care" about winning on an even basis, maybe re starting a LB/CUBIC inch class would work. If you want to win in S and SS you Must change ahead of the rules not with them. Beat the adjustments to hp or class by an unseen combo or NEW motor spec. Buy an Injected car, then a 4 valve head car then a supercharged car. Any Turbos on the horizon?

Support a New Modified Class for a real even chance at a good time and reward for your work.

D.Johns · 11-01-2014, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brent flynn

Stockers shouldnt make 900hp.... Just my opinion...hehe

Who only makes 900hp??? I agree they should make a lot more!

bob3240 · 11-01-2014, 07:11 PM

Check out the new CarCraft and there you go! Calvert's 5.0 does the deed.

Nick Heath · 11-02-2014, 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Wright

Nick, the only people complaining (and not being straight about why they are unhappy) have new cars and don't like suddenly not being one of the fast guys in their classes. If NHRA doesn't lower their indexes about half a second they will still dominate the top of qualifying sheets if they want to. Would still be killers in class combo races. Of course, it's not a big deal to guys running lower classes where they didn't have to deal with them heads up. Most people are happy.

Fair enough, Ed. After seeing all the comments over the years about how "everything would be fine if the new cars were in their own classes," I was just surprised to see a fair amount of grumbling in this thread. I agree that the FS indexes will need adjustment, maybe the 0.30 that NHRA gave back originally?

Marlin Bogner · 11-02-2014, 12:02 PM

Oct 31 was the first that I heard of the SS/CS head problem. but what problem? I feel that GM, Ford and Mopar were very even with GM having the slight edge. We all Crack heads. I have had to back out of CFM for reliability, Why can't GM? We are using the basic W-2 head which came out 40 plus years ago. there is nothing else. Again, GM racers get there way. How many Ford racers knew what was going on? I thought we had the class back on course when we stopped the GM racers wanting the aluminum heads.

11-01-2014, 09:09 AM	#122
Nick Heath Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Jersey Shore Posts: 359 Likes: 1,443 Liked 565 Times in 135 Posts	Re: 2015 Rules Imagine that, the factory cars got their own classes, like everyone was asking for...and people are STILL complaining!!!

11-01-2014, 09:16 AM	#123
Marty Buth Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Freeport, IL Posts: 467 Likes: 651 Liked 232 Times in 39 Posts	Re: 2015 Rules Will the FS cars have a combo of their own, when only 1 car is entered in a particular class? Or will they be in the combo for the "older" cars? __________________ Marty Buth 3657 STK

11-01-2014, 09:34 AM	#124
Ed Wright Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sand Springs, OK Posts: 8,132 Likes: 896 Liked 390 Times in 170 Posts	Re: 2015 Rules Nick, the only people complaining (and not being straight about why they are unhappy) have new cars and don't like suddenly not being one of the fast guys in their classes. If NHRA doesn't lower their indexes about half a second they will still dominate the top of qualifying sheets if they want to. Would still be killers in class combo races. Of course, it's not a big deal to guys running lower classes where they didn't have to deal with them heads up. Most people are happy. __________________ Ed Wright 4156 SS/JA Last edited by Ed Wright; 11-01-2014 at 09:37 AM.

11-01-2014, 11:01 AM	#125
Bruce Noland VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,855 Likes: 83 Liked 444 Times in 145 Posts	Re: 2015 Rules Billy is slipping folks. He actually just asked whether he should keep his opinions to himself? And deprive us of his wisdom and common sense. No way. __________________ Bruce Noland 1788 STK

11-01-2014, 03:43 PM	#126
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Re: 2015 Rules Factoring by HP has always been a flawed method. It punishes the hard workers. Dividing the cars into smaller and smaller classes decreases this as they don't run another car type for class and only race bracket style at points meets. There is the point where if you want to be a class winner now regardless the age of car you can do it. Maybe even with a Bye. For those who "care" about winning on an even basis, maybe re starting a LB/CUBIC inch class would work. If you want to win in S and SS you Must change ahead of the rules not with them. Beat the adjustments to hp or class by an unseen combo or NEW motor spec. Buy an Injected car, then a 4 valve head car then a supercharged car. Any Turbos on the horizon? Support a New Modified Class for a real even chance at a good time and reward for your work.

11-01-2014, 07:11 PM	#128
bob3240 Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: lebanon ohio Posts: 251 Likes: 3 Liked 16 Times in 5 Posts	Re: 2015 Rules Check out the new CarCraft and there you go! Calvert's 5.0 does the deed.

11-02-2014, 12:02 PM	#130
Marlin Bogner Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 20 Likes: 0 Liked 5 Times in 1 Post	Re: 2015 Rules Oct 31 was the first that I heard of the SS/CS head problem. but what problem? I feel that GM, Ford and Mopar were very even with GM having the slight edge. We all Crack heads. I have had to back out of CFM for reliability, Why can't GM? We are using the basic W-2 head which came out 40 plus years ago. there is nothing else. Again, GM racers get there way. How many Ford racers knew what was going on? I thought we had the class back on course when we stopped the GM racers wanting the aluminum heads.