Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ?

Aubrey N Bruneau · 02-06-2017, 01:59 PM

It has been a while since I had this done to my previous camshaft.
In 2008, I purchased a set of coated tool steel lifters from a company in North Carolina ( if I remember correctly ). At that same time, I sent them my new camshaft, along with related valve train parts, for them to do a test of sorts, to determine spring requirements, and make note of any concerns. I honestly don't know if that was done, but at that time, they suggested a coating / treatment of my camshaft.
Here is a photo of it:

It has kind of a polished aluminum look to it, and is very smooth. The cam was run with about 230 llb seat / 475 lb open pressures, and still shows no sign of use.
I like it.
Unfortunately, that intake lobe could not be controlled, so, I now have a new cam. This one has no special treatments. Because of the rather impressive durability of the previous camshaft... I think I would like to do this again.
So, my question is...
Can somebody help identify what this coating / treatment is, and possibly guide me to where I can get it done again ?

Alan Roehrich · 02-06-2017, 08:16 PM

That is probably not a coating. Looks like the work of Bret Conway, of Performance Research. I have not spoken to Bret, or seen him at a trade show, in several years.

I can tell you that if you're running a higher lift cam and a big valve (some of the 409 stuff is close to big block Chevy rectangle port stuff) you need about 30 pounds more on the seat and about 50 pounds more open to control a modern Stock Eliminator lobe.

Aubrey N Bruneau · 02-06-2017, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

That is probably not a coating. Looks like the work of Bret Conway, of Performance Research. I have not spoken to Bret, or seen him at a trade show, in several years.

I can tell you that if you're running a higher lift cam and a big valve (some of the 409 stuff is close to big block Chevy rectangle port stuff) you need about 30 pounds more on the seat and about 50 pounds more open to control a modern Stock Eliminator lobe.

That's him !
Thanks for replying, Alan.
Are you saying that nobody else does this cam "prep" ? I know it was expensive
( might as well have bought a steel billet core ).

.500" net lift at the valve.
As I had mentioned in a post quite some time ago... After shattering tool steel retainers a couple times.. I contacted my guy at Comp. I gave him the lobe number.
He asked what RPM does it see. I told him peak HP at 6600, shift at 7000, through traps at 7250.
He got back to me...
"You can't rev that lobe" !
me... "That's what I've been trying to tell ya'" !

HEE HEE !
Yes, we had a chuckle about that ( a costly one for me )

So, new cam has same duration @ .050", 2 degrees less @ .200", and 2 degrees more @ .020" ( checking clearance... seat ). The "adjustment" is on the closing ramp of the intake lobe.
Exhaust side never caused a problem, which is good, because I have no piston-to-valve clearance !

I will heed your advice, and add some spring pressure. However, I don't think I'll do tool steel retainers again.

Alan Roehrich · 02-06-2017, 11:17 PM

Tool steel retainers are fine. If you broke one or more, you'd have broken just about anything, and it was caused by loss of valvetrain control.

I would strongly suggest that you not use DLC coated lifters against anything other than an actual steel core camshaft. While it may be possible to get by with it, it is really likely to result in catastrophic failure.

I think there may be another company that could do it.

I use the gas plasma nitriding service Comp offers. They do offer a polishing service as well.

SSDiv6 · 02-06-2017, 11:58 PM

Two of the best coatings that I have used on both crankshafts, camshafts and valve train components are offered by Shaftech and MicroBlue.

http://www.shaftech.com/omicron.html

http://www.microblueracing.com

ron mattson · 02-07-2017, 08:54 PM

That looks like the work of Dynacron out
Chicago.

ron mattson · 02-07-2017, 09:05 PM

I just looked at micro blue and their stuff
Looks very similar to what Dynacron is
Doing.

Aubrey N Bruneau · 02-07-2017, 10:51 PM

This is very helpful... thanks, guys !

I'm going to try and get the same type of prep done to this new cam.

Rsmith38 · 02-08-2017, 09:15 AM

I have received very quick service from MicroBlue (usually less than a week - very good people to work with)

02-06-2017, 01:59 PM	#1
Aubrey N Bruneau Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: South Eastern Alberta, Canada Posts: 311 Likes: 6 Liked 7 Times in 3 Posts	Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? It has been a while since I had this done to my previous camshaft. In 2008, I purchased a set of coated tool steel lifters from a company in North Carolina ( if I remember correctly ). At that same time, I sent them my new camshaft, along with related valve train parts, for them to do a test of sorts, to determine spring requirements, and make note of any concerns. I honestly don't know if that was done, but at that time, they suggested a coating / treatment of my camshaft. Here is a photo of it: It has kind of a polished aluminum look to it, and is very smooth. The cam was run with about 230 llb seat / 475 lb open pressures, and still shows no sign of use. I like it. Unfortunately, that intake lobe could not be controlled, so, I now have a new cam. This one has no special treatments. Because of the rather impressive durability of the previous camshaft... I think I would like to do this again. So, my question is... Can somebody help identify what this coating / treatment is, and possibly guide me to where I can get it done again ? Attached Thumbnails __________________ Aubrey N Bruneau 6409 C/S 62 BelAir sport coupe, 409 HP 409

02-06-2017, 08:16 PM	#2
Alan Roehrich Veteran Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Murfreesboro TN Posts: 5,105 Likes: 1,564 Liked 1,789 Times in 408 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? That is probably not a coating. Looks like the work of Bret Conway, of Performance Research. I have not spoken to Bret, or seen him at a trade show, in several years. I can tell you that if you're running a higher lift cam and a big valve (some of the 409 stuff is close to big block Chevy rectangle port stuff) you need about 30 pounds more on the seat and about 50 pounds more open to control a modern Stock Eliminator lobe. __________________ Alan Roehrich 212A G/S

02-06-2017, 11:17 PM	#4
Alan Roehrich Veteran Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Murfreesboro TN Posts: 5,105 Likes: 1,564 Liked 1,789 Times in 408 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? Tool steel retainers are fine. If you broke one or more, you'd have broken just about anything, and it was caused by loss of valvetrain control. I would strongly suggest that you not use DLC coated lifters against anything other than an actual steel core camshaft. While it may be possible to get by with it, it is really likely to result in catastrophic failure. I think there may be another company that could do it. I use the gas plasma nitriding service Comp offers. They do offer a polishing service as well. __________________ Alan Roehrich 212A G/S

02-06-2017, 11:58 PM	#5
SSDiv6 VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Glendale, Arizona Posts: 3,043 Likes: 712 Liked 1,577 Times in 581 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? Two of the best coatings that I have used on both crankshafts, camshafts and valve train components are offered by Shaftech and MicroBlue. http://www.shaftech.com/omicron.html http://www.microblueracing.com

02-07-2017, 08:54 PM	#6
ron mattson Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: cloquet mn Posts: 466 Likes: 17 Liked 67 Times in 30 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? That looks like the work of Dynacron out Chicago. __________________ Ron Mattson 5015 STK

02-07-2017, 09:05 PM	#7
ron mattson Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: cloquet mn Posts: 466 Likes: 17 Liked 67 Times in 30 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? I just looked at micro blue and their stuff Looks very similar to what Dynacron is Doing. __________________ Ron Mattson 5015 STK

02-07-2017, 10:51 PM	#8
Aubrey N Bruneau Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: South Eastern Alberta, Canada Posts: 311 Likes: 6 Liked 7 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? This is very helpful... thanks, guys ! I'm going to try and get the same type of prep done to this new cam. __________________ Aubrey N Bruneau 6409 C/S 62 BelAir sport coupe, 409 HP 409

02-08-2017, 09:15 AM	#9
Rsmith38 Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 186 Likes: 0 Liked 28 Times in 15 Posts	Re: Flat Tappet, Cast Core Camshaft Coating ? I have received very quick service from MicroBlue (usually less than a week - very good people to work with)