Driver ejection,NHRA cover up at St. Louis

Billy Nees · 10-25-2018, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kansas stocker

Looked like a good call to me. When you cross the center line out of control it does not leave much choice.
Pete

Now wait a minute, if you are past the finish line and cross the "center line out of control" in a fuel car, you still win the race. And that also goes for hitting the guard wall, exploding your car apart, hitting the driver in the other lane or, oh yeah, smoking the tires.

Lenny5160 · 10-25-2018, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Now wait a minute, if you are past the finish line and cross the "center line out of control" in a fuel car, you still win the race. And that also goes for hitting the guard wall, exploding your car apart, hitting the driver in the other lane or, oh yeah, smoking the tires.

Nothing that you have stated here is incorrect. However, Section 2 Page 9 of the 2018 NHRA Rulebook specifically notes that boundary infractions past the finish line will be enforced if they determine that excessive braking was the cause of the infraction. Capitalization is in the rulebook; not mine:

Anytime it has been judged that excessive braking has resulted in loss of control that results in contact with the guardwall and/or light fixtures or crossing the center boundary lines, INCLUDING PAST THE FINISH LINE, the contestant will be disqualified.

Mark Yacavone · 10-25-2018, 05:46 PM

Bruce, welcome to the forum.
Have to say..it looked bad on video. crossing into the opponent's lane, even after the traps...Not good.
I was excited and put it in reverse is probably not a good case.
I'm afraid you'll just have to chalk this one up to experience. IMO

Michael Beard · 10-25-2018, 06:01 PM

This was obviously WAY past the finish line and not a case of excessive braking. I've had opponents hit reverse by accident in the shutdown area more than once. (once in eliminations, once in a qualifying run) On the elimination run, I got beat fair and square. I didn't complain, and my opponent busted his ***** to swap transmissions between rounds and continued on in eliminations, albeit on some slightly less than perfectly round tires.

A little common sense goes a long way.

Lenny5160 · 10-25-2018, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

This was obviously WAY past the finish line and not a case of excessive braking.

I completely agree, but it depends on how closely the powers that be are watching and paying attention.

If you're in the tower eating a sandwich, and you hear Alan say "whoa!" which makes you look up and see smoke and a car crossed-up shortly past the finish line, it is probably easy to make the bad assumption here.

And no, I don't think any assumptions should ever be made in these cases. But we also know how much of a priority we can be in the NHRA world.

HR9121 · 10-25-2018, 07:19 PM

I'm not saying the right or wrong decision was made but when's the last time they reversed a decision on anything. I think they are taught to make a decision and stick to it, just my opinion. When I watched the video, I can see why he made the call to the top end to DQ him.

Mark Yacavone · 10-25-2018, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HR9121

I'm not saying the right or wrong decision was made but when's the last time they reversed a decision on anything. I think they are taught to make a decision and stick to it, just my opinion. When I watched the video, I can see why he made the call to the top end to DQ him.

I was just going to make that point. To expound on it then, the DD DQ's him. They then tell the guy who was out, that he's in. Then the first party goes to the tower to make their case.
20 min. later the DD would have to say okay, you're in. Then he has to tell the guy who was out, then in , that he's out again, because all the other guy did was put it in reverse after the finish line , smoke the tires ,and cross over into his lane.
I've been around NHRA long enough to tell you it ain't gonna happen.

Mike Fuller · 10-25-2018, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Now wait a minute, if you are past the finish line and cross the "center line out of control" in a fuel car, you still win the race. And that also goes for hitting the guard wall, exploding your car apart, hitting the driver in the other lane or, oh yeah, smoking the tires.

That is correct. Seems like the rules are different for this case. I have also seen certian racers smoke the tires during excessive braking on two consecutive rounds an only get a warning.

FED 387 · 10-25-2018, 09:06 PM

After watching the video many times I feel the call was correct---My reasons are that the car did not "just smoke the tires a teeny little bit " but locked them up enough to disrupt the forward motion of the vehicle and cause the car to change lanes violently and at one point 100% of the car is in the other lane---It appears that he "lost control" and fortunately did not hit something whether it was another car or the wall--This is way beyond just smoking the tires by "excessive braking" --The driver openly admitted he put the trans into reverse or something of the sort something about his shifter ---The call was a safety issue and was meant as a punishment or deterrent not to do this again---I don't care if he was excited about the fact that he was going to the 5th round in stock that caused him to do this.He was wrong and I feel the decision is correct--- who the division director is or how long he has been the division director should have no bearing on the decision----The offender is wrong, it was the correct decision at the time , after either observing it in person or on a video rerun. You cannot convince me otherwise. I feel the DQ was correct. FED 387

Speer Drag Racing · 10-26-2018, 11:07 AM

The ruling was excessive braking. If you took 2 minutes to go back and look at the video that D3TV now thankfully gives us, you can see he was well past the finish line and his story backs the case of putting it in Reverse. I would imagine the DD would have had access to this video since even I was able to rewind and watch it immediately after it happened. With championships on the line it seems to me an immediate DQ should have adequate evidence. Now if you are DQ'ing him for making a mistake and then threatening a year suspension you are opening a huge can of worms. Do you DQ someone for not tightening up the front end and doing an uncontrollable wheelie if they don't cross the center line? They made a mistake on an adjustment that could have potentially put the other racer in danger if they would have crossed. We all make mistakes and we all know racing has it's dangers and as many people here have pointed out there were a lot of "what-ifs" but where is the line that someone has subjective control of the outcome of a race? From the sounds of some of these responses I am sure glad some of you are not DD's!

10-25-2018, 05:46 PM	#3
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,818 Likes: 2,909 Liked 5,126 Times in 1,954 Posts	Re: Driver ejection,NHRA cover up at St. Louis Bruce, welcome to the forum. Have to say..it looked bad on video. crossing into the opponent's lane, even after the traps...Not good. I was excited and put it in reverse is probably not a good case. I'm afraid you'll just have to chalk this one up to experience. IMO __________________ "We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for." Will Rogers

10-25-2018, 06:01 PM	#4
Michael Beard VIP Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 4,060 Likes: 0 Liked 13 Times in 9 Posts	Re: Driver ejection,NHRA cover up at St. Louis This was obviously WAY past the finish line and not a case of excessive braking. I've had opponents hit reverse by accident in the shutdown area more than once. (once in eliminations, once in a qualifying run) On the elimination run, I got beat fair and square. I didn't complain, and my opponent busted his ***** to swap transmissions between rounds and continued on in eliminations, albeit on some slightly less than perfectly round tires. A little common sense goes a long way. __________________ Michael Beard - NHRA/IHRA 3216 S/SS

10-25-2018, 07:19 PM	#6
HR9121 Live Reporter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New Bern, NC Posts: 3,467 Likes: 146 Liked 3,363 Times in 731 Posts	Re: Driver ejection,NHRA cover up at St. Louis I'm not saying the right or wrong decision was made but when's the last time they reversed a decision on anything. I think they are taught to make a decision and stick to it, just my opinion. When I watched the video, I can see why he made the call to the top end to DQ him. __________________ James Williamson W200 J/SA. SS/JA

10-25-2018, 09:06 PM	#9
FED 387 VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 3,422 Likes: 529 Liked 333 Times in 180 Posts	Re: Driver ejection,NHRA cover up at St. Louis After watching the video many times I feel the call was correct---My reasons are that the car did not "just smoke the tires a teeny little bit " but locked them up enough to disrupt the forward motion of the vehicle and cause the car to change lanes violently and at one point 100% of the car is in the other lane---It appears that he "lost control" and fortunately did not hit something whether it was another car or the wall--This is way beyond just smoking the tires by "excessive braking" --The driver openly admitted he put the trans into reverse or something of the sort something about his shifter ---The call was a safety issue and was meant as a punishment or deterrent not to do this again---I don't care if he was excited about the fact that he was going to the 5th round in stock that caused him to do this.He was wrong and I feel the decision is correct--- who the division director is or how long he has been the division director should have no bearing on the decision----The offender is wrong, it was the correct decision at the time , after either observing it in person or on a video rerun. You cannot convince me otherwise. I feel the DQ was correct. FED 387

10-26-2018, 11:07 AM	#10
Speer Drag Racing Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Minnesota Posts: 48 Likes: 6 Liked 56 Times in 10 Posts	Re: Driver ejection,NHRA cover up at St. Louis The ruling was excessive braking. If you took 2 minutes to go back and look at the video that D3TV now thankfully gives us, you can see he was well past the finish line and his story backs the case of putting it in Reverse. I would imagine the DD would have had access to this video since even I was able to rewind and watch it immediately after it happened. With championships on the line it seems to me an immediate DQ should have adequate evidence. Now if you are DQ'ing him for making a mistake and then threatening a year suspension you are opening a huge can of worms. Do you DQ someone for not tightening up the front end and doing an uncontrollable wheelie if they don't cross the center line? They made a mistake on an adjustment that could have potentially put the other racer in danger if they would have crossed. We all make mistakes and we all know racing has it's dangers and as many people here have pointed out there were a lot of "what-ifs" but where is the line that someone has subjective control of the outcome of a race? From the sounds of some of these responses I am sure glad some of you are not DD's!