Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable?

Mark Yacavone · 04-04-2021, 10:04 PM

So, lots of folks are praising the last couple of S/SS races. They're saying they will attend next year..This is assuming there will be similar races next year, from the same promoters.
I made a few calls, and from what I hear, these two events didn't exactly end up in the plus zone, monetarily. If this info is incorrect , please advise me.

Now ,what are we going to do to keep them happening?

First, let me say that we're never going to replace NHRA as a sanctioning body. We need people who are ready, willing and able to go to 8-9 points meets , so they can race on the big stage with 60 other guys and gals. This way, we still have a rules structure, a semblance of a tech dept. and HP factors , to keep everything reined in.
These races need to be an alternative for those who won't or can't play the NHRA game to the max.

I've talked to a few friends with promotional experience, and they believe, as do I, that class racers generally don't care to spend 6-9 hundred in entry fees for a chance at 40-50 K.. 5,000 to win, for a couple hundred entry, as in Kenny's race, seems to be reasonable enough...or is it?

Of course , all opinions are welcome, but I'd like to hear from the promoters and / or track operators, as to what we could do, to get these races into the black.

Let's not regress into negativity like " too early" , "too cold", "holiday weekend" ,etc.
Rather than that , tell us when and where you WOULD schedule these events.

Thanks

CMcAllister · 04-04-2021, 11:19 PM

Most first round losers in the big money bracket races buy back, and race each other with the winners going into second round. That sure helps with the size of the pot. How many are willing to do that?

Not saying it can't be done, purse vs. entry needs to be realistic. The money has to come from somewhere. Can't print it like the government.

Adger Smith · 04-05-2021, 02:06 AM

As a former track owner I can tell you the buy backs are all about what the track makes. Nothing else.
like them or hate them they can make a race be in the black instead of the red for a track owner.
Class racers may have to consider doing it for the sake of a place to race.

JeremyDuncan · 04-05-2021, 07:03 AM

Buybacks are an absolute deal breaker for me. I will not participate in a Stk/Ss race with buybacks.

jmcarter · 04-05-2021, 07:54 AM

Easter weekend was a deal breaker for me and that was the first possible weekend that I could have made. I'm absolutely going to Ken's race and hoping the turnout will be so good that promoters will step up to offer more of these. That said, even though I don't like buy backs it may be a necessary evil to insure these races survive. I'm a little befuddled that the NMCA races don't get better turnouts so if these races do not survive I guess that means a Wally is the golden calf that ultimately killed class racing.

Pistol Pete · 04-05-2021, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adger Smith

As a former track owner I can tell you the buy backs are all about what the track makes. Nothing else.
like them or hate them they can make a race be in the black instead of the red for a track owner.
Class racers may have to consider doing it for the sake of a place to race.

Ken’s race offers a 2nd chance race for anyone who lost first round.
Capped off at 48 cars.
At a NHRA national event you’ve got to get to the 3rd round to get any money so
theirs no buy backs in their arena either.
As a former Stock elim racer I wouldn’t like buy backs, as a track owner if there in
the Red than maybe they have to raise the entry fee.

MR DERBY CITY · 04-05-2021, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeremyDuncan

Buybacks are an absolute deal breaker for me. I will not participate in a Stk/Ss race with buybacks.

Sorry, but BUYBACKS are for ( ) races, this past weeks race at St. Louis was a stock/superstock race. Instead of BUYBACKS, there was a 5 Grand to win combo for a 100 dollar entry fee that all FIRST rd. losers could enter. Tyler B then opened up this race for ALL racers. I thought this was a WIN ...WIN... for the racer and the PROMOTER. BOTTOM LINE, these races must be PROFITABLE for the PROMOTERS ......Scheduling is crucial to the success, although you sure can’t please everyone....A track the caliber of Gateway only has a few OPEN dates to work with ....I had to laugh when Jeremy said buybacks were his dealbreaker .....Personally my dealbreaker is this....I don’t ENJOY racing when toboggans and gloves are involved ....

Ken Miele · 04-05-2021, 09:28 AM

Mark,

I can not speak for the other promoters as I have had no contact with them. I think its great that they put these races on to give STK/SS more options. As for what we do, I plan on doing a Class Racer National every year, and hoping for two next season. Its not about the money for us, its about racing at a good event were the racer is treated with respect and appreciated for there support.

From what I saw and heard about these two races, the racers were treated great and had a good time. The promoters did and excellent job as far as I am concerned. Whether they have them next season, who knows, but I hope they do.

This biggest hurdle on promoting these races are finding a race date that does not interfere with NHRA scheduling. Another issue is finding a track that you can work with. Fortunately for us Numidia Dragway owned by the DiMino family is a great place to promote races. You could not ask for a better family to work with.

The racing we all do, whether it is NHRA, NMCA or promotion races like these, are mostly supported by our entries. With that being said, we all deserve to be treated as paying customers. And as the saying goes... the customer is always right.

So guys, CRN will be around for sometime. We want to give a better option for the racers and make them feel like they are the stars, and are treated as they should be.

James Perrone · 04-05-2021, 09:29 AM

I like racing both nhra and stock super stock big bucks races
Sheeeet I will race anywhere. But when nhra makes it near impossible to enter a national event. I will take the BiG Bucks option every time
Nhra give no zero. Fs about sportsman racers.
I swore I would not stop nhra racing till I got a Big Wally
It ain’t easy to do it. Now it’s impossible with a grade 8 just to get into a race
Nhra national events are touture. Hurry up and wait. No wait till Sunday maybe Monday
I will go to any big $$ race this side of the Mississippi over a nhra event
Spend my $$ with organization the appreciates the customer base
I race because enjoy it National events aren’t about us.
Nhra just stealing our $$$ to pay the idiots in charge.

GTS340 · 04-05-2021, 10:59 AM

It was fun to watch. A handful won some money. Others spent plenty to be there. If you're well off and retired or own a business no problem to enjoy. Unless you live in these very few big buck race areas. Its a rich man's sport. How many racers can afford to spend 2-3 grand to be there. Racers that traveled 2000 miles one way. Hats off to those few heroes. Goodyear tire and Sonoco fuel should be one of the sponsors too.

Paul

04-04-2021, 10:04 PM	#1
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,815 Likes: 2,903 Liked 5,120 Times in 1,951 Posts	Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? So, lots of folks are praising the last couple of S/SS races. They're saying they will attend next year..This is assuming there will be similar races next year, from the same promoters. I made a few calls, and from what I hear, these two events didn't exactly end up in the plus zone, monetarily. If this info is incorrect , please advise me. Now ,what are we going to do to keep them happening? First, let me say that we're never going to replace NHRA as a sanctioning body. We need people who are ready, willing and able to go to 8-9 points meets , so they can race on the big stage with 60 other guys and gals. This way, we still have a rules structure, a semblance of a tech dept. and HP factors , to keep everything reined in. These races need to be an alternative for those who won't or can't play the NHRA game to the max. I've talked to a few friends with promotional experience, and they believe, as do I, that class racers generally don't care to spend 6-9 hundred in entry fees for a chance at 40-50 K.. 5,000 to win, for a couple hundred entry, as in Kenny's race, seems to be reasonable enough...or is it? Of course , all opinions are welcome, but I'd like to hear from the promoters and / or track operators, as to what we could do, to get these races into the black. Let's not regress into negativity like " too early" , "too cold", "holiday weekend" ,etc. Rather than that , tell us when and where you WOULD schedule these events. Thanks __________________ "We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for." Will Rogers

04-04-2021, 11:19 PM	#2
CMcAllister Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Fulton County, PA Posts: 614 Likes: 16 Liked 920 Times in 259 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? Most first round losers in the big money bracket races buy back, and race each other with the winners going into second round. That sure helps with the size of the pot. How many are willing to do that? Not saying it can't be done, purse vs. entry needs to be realistic. The money has to come from somewhere. Can't print it like the government.

04-05-2021, 02:06 AM	#3
Adger Smith VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Texarkana Ark/TX Posts: 2,446 Likes: 575 Liked 880 Times in 311 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? As a former track owner I can tell you the buy backs are all about what the track makes. Nothing else. like them or hate them they can make a race be in the black instead of the red for a track owner. Class racers may have to consider doing it for the sake of a place to race. __________________ Adger Smith (Former SS)

04-05-2021, 07:03 AM	#4
JeremyDuncan Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 264 Likes: 1,174 Liked 354 Times in 79 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? Buybacks are an absolute deal breaker for me. I will not participate in a Stk/Ss race with buybacks.

04-05-2021, 07:54 AM	#5
jmcarter VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Richmond Hill GA (and Port Ludlow WA) Posts: 4,295 Likes: 2,381 Liked 3,174 Times in 971 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? Easter weekend was a deal breaker for me and that was the first possible weekend that I could have made. I'm absolutely going to Ken's race and hoping the turnout will be so good that promoters will step up to offer more of these. That said, even though I don't like buy backs it may be a necessary evil to insure these races survive. I'm a little befuddled that the NMCA races don't get better turnouts so if these races do not survive I guess that means a Wally is the golden calf that ultimately killed class racing. __________________ Jim Carter 2340 Super Stock 2340 SST/2340 Stock Set another place at the table

04-05-2021, 09:28 AM	#8
Ken Miele Live Reporter Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 4,861 Likes: 456 Liked 16,554 Times in 1,522 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? Mark, I can not speak for the other promoters as I have had no contact with them. I think its great that they put these races on to give STK/SS more options. As for what we do, I plan on doing a Class Racer National every year, and hoping for two next season. Its not about the money for us, its about racing at a good event were the racer is treated with respect and appreciated for there support. From what I saw and heard about these two races, the racers were treated great and had a good time. The promoters did and excellent job as far as I am concerned. Whether they have them next season, who knows, but I hope they do. This biggest hurdle on promoting these races are finding a race date that does not interfere with NHRA scheduling. Another issue is finding a track that you can work with. Fortunately for us Numidia Dragway owned by the DiMino family is a great place to promote races. You could not ask for a better family to work with. The racing we all do, whether it is NHRA, NMCA or promotion races like these, are mostly supported by our entries. With that being said, we all deserve to be treated as paying customers. And as the saying goes... the customer is always right. So guys, CRN will be around for sometime. We want to give a better option for the racers and make them feel like they are the stars, and are treated as they should be.

04-05-2021, 09:29 AM	#9
James Perrone VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: LONG ISLAND N.Y. Posts: 1,676 Likes: 3,373 Liked 1,816 Times in 425 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? I like racing both nhra and stock super stock big bucks races Sheeeet I will race anywhere. But when nhra makes it near impossible to enter a national event. I will take the BiG Bucks option every time Nhra give no zero. Fs about sportsman racers. I swore I would not stop nhra racing till I got a Big Wally It ain’t easy to do it. Now it’s impossible with a grade 8 just to get into a race Nhra national events are touture. Hurry up and wait. No wait till Sunday maybe Monday I will go to any big $$ race this side of the Mississippi over a nhra event Spend my $$ with organization the appreciates the customer base I race because enjoy it National events aren’t about us. Nhra just stealing our $$$ to pay the idiots in charge. __________________ james perrone 1290 STK

04-05-2021, 10:59 AM	#10
GTS340 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Las Vegas, Nv Posts: 868 Likes: 270 Liked 1,341 Times in 408 Posts	Re: Big $$$ S/SS Races as a Business Model..Viable? It was fun to watch. A handful won some money. Others spent plenty to be there. If you're well off and retired or own a business no problem to enjoy. Unless you live in these very few big buck race areas. Its a rich man's sport. How many racers can afford to spend 2-3 grand to be there. Racers that traveled 2000 miles one way. Hats off to those few heroes. Goodyear tire and Sonoco fuel should be one of the sponsors too. Paul