how about the class winner from the 73 summernationals

[DeuceCoupe]

Originally Posted by oldskool

Don't know about all the factoring back then.

But for the '75 season, the '68 400 Bird 330hp was 330hp @ 3300lbs. Perfect 10lbs per hp.

The '69 Goat 350hp was 350hp @ 3500lbs. Also a perfect 10lbs per hp, but 200 lbs heavier than the Bird, with basically the same engine. Needless to say, the Bird was MUCH more competitive.

Would love to know exactly when the hp factor was lowered for the '69 350hp GTO. Interested in knowing all the drops, or if it was just one big one.

Since you're a CJ guy, I just can't resist telling you this one. Aw, I COULD resist. But I won't.

I only had one street race in my '69 GTO. I was cruising over to Monroe to see TJ, in 1970. As I came into a little country town, on the way, I saw a guy come out onto the edge of the road & start flaggin me down.

So, I pulled in to see what he wanted. Well, the guy he was with was sittin in a 428CJ Torino. I think it was a '68. Could be wrong, since I'm not a Ford guy. I'd heard that the car was one of the quickest Ford street cars in our area. But, they'd heard about my Goat & challenged me to a race, right then.

Well, hey, what could I say ? There was no excuse. I had to race. So, we drove around to a long straight stretch. The passenger got out & flagged us off. I won by several lengths & didn't even go back to talk. I just slowed down to 55mph & cruised on over to see TJ, who was goin to college, at the time.

One thing's for sure. They never flagged me down for a race, again. I don't really even remember ever seeing that car again. Never was challenged to another street race. Took it off the street in '72, & onto the track in '73.

See this thread - about 5 years ago I was just starting this project & Dwight Southerland was a great help on the factoring stuff.
IN GENERAL, the Firebirds got factored up to the GTO ratings.
But, a few exceptions - the 68 Bird 400/330hp was one of them - didnt get factored.

http://classracer.com/classforum/sho...t=62510&page=9

I've Gonkulated (computed, program I wrote) just about every OEM combo of the 1950s-60s, and from what I can see, the base Bird & GTO 400s probably should've all had the 335hp rating the GTO had in 1967.
Give or take 5hp or so for the cams, manual vs auto.

But, I never saw NHRA factor an engine DOWN from the OEM rating - not until much later, not sure when. So since the Bird was probably right at 330hp, and the GTO was too high at 350hp but they weren't into down-factoring (yet) so they just left it alone.

1971 may have been the 1st year that NHRA down-factored their OWN ratings. The 440-6v Mopar IIRC had been factored to 410hp, was then factored DOWN to 390hp in 1971 & started winning. The 429SCJ (J-shaker hood) Ford had been factored to 425hp, then factored down to 395hp in 1971 & started winning eg this 1973 meet. But those still weren't factored down below OEM. So the 400 base GTO was probably stuck at 350hp.

Great story about your RamAir3 vs the big 428CJ Torino. Near as I can tell from both Gonkulating and about 70 period road tests of those combos (all RamAir1 & RamAir3 GTO/Bird and all 428CJ Mustang/Fairlane) they're very close. About a 1mph edge to the 428CJ cars in the road tests, but when it's that close as you know it comes down to tune & driving.