SS/D Thunderbolt in 1969 ?

[427FE]

Originally Posted by DeuceCoupe

BUT - there's that thing about no fiberglass bodies.

Why? The minimum of 100 cars were built. The fenders and hood were glass and very few received glass doors.

[DeuceCoupe]

Originally Posted by 427FE

Why? The minimum of 100 cars were built. The fenders and hood were glass and very few received glass doors.

Well I thought I'd heard fiberglass body parts other than hoods were banned after 1964, which made sense since both Ford and Mopar stopped running their 1964 S/S cars. Maybe not then.

So Ford probably just stopped running the T-bolt after 1964 because it wasnt competitive any more?

And then, if the 427 HiRiser WAS factored down to 450hp for 1969, that moved the T-Bolt down into SS/D=7.00 class
3206/450=7.12
So it appeared after a long hiatus from 1965-66-67-68?

This would have put the 64 Gal LWG into SS/F=8.00 class at
3749/450=8.33
But, I dont see any there, at least no winners.

So if fiberglass was legal all those years, what happened to the 64 Hemi Mopars? They were lighter than the 65 A990 Hemi's but the 64's just disappeared, like the 64 T-Bolts.

I was a little young back then so dont remember this stuff!

EDIT:
Ok I re-discovered a partial answer.
In 1965 & 1966, S/S had to be at least 8 lb per CID, meaning the 1964 Race Hemi's and T-bolts were banned. Too light.
That's why the 1965 A990 weighed *exactly* 3408 - to meet that 3408/426=8.00 NHRA requirement.

In 1967, the same rule applied but only to SS/A.
But the 64 Race Hemi and 64 T-Bolt fell into SS/A, so they were banned for that year too.

In 1968, same rule, SS/A minimum 8 lb/CID, but the 64 Race Hemi and T-Bolt fell into SS/B=6.00-6.99, so I guess they could've legally run?
Sure, but they'd both be up against the new Race Hemi Dart/Cuda, so no point.

For 1969, SS/C=6.50 which let the 64 Race Hemi's avoid the 68 Dart/Cuda but still run, and they did.
And, with the T-bolt 427 HiRiser factored down to 450hp (apparently), they could run in SS/D=7.00 so they did.

Just to complete the narrative:
Prior to 1969, I believe the 427 HiRiser had to be factored to 490-500hp.
Why?
Well it didnt affect anything in 1964. The T-bolt ran in S/S and the LWG ran in AA/S=7.00 as long as the 427HR was factored at 460hp to 500hp.

But the May 1967 NHRA records show Mike Schmitt's LWG holding both ends of SS/BA=7.00-7.69 with 11.66 and 121.78.
To be all the way up into SS/BA, the 427HR had to be factored to at least 490hp so then 3749/490=7.65. Any factoring below that will drop the LWG into SS/CA=7.70-8.69 class.

So I'm concluding the 427HR was factored at 490-500hp up thru 1968, then down to 450hp for 1969 which is why the T-Bolt re-appeared for one last year. The 64 LWG could compete in 1967-68 in the SS/7.00 class but would be up against the Ro23/Wo23 Mopars and 427MR T-Wedge Fairlanes and just wasn't up to that. So they disappeared.

OK well if THAT all makes sense, thanks for helping with my thought process.

"It was my understanding, that there would be no math"
- - Chevy Chase as Gerald R Ford, 1976 presidential debate on SNL

[427FE]

Ford seems to have concentrated more on the sizzling hot FX classes after 64. Along with the introduction of the SOHC, the HR was kind of forgotten about. The 64 galaxie LW had good success in AA even into the year 1966. Pretty much dropped off after that.

[FireSale]

64 Fairlane Light Weight was/is allowed fiberglass fenders and hood. Bumpers may be aluminum. They tried fiberglass bumpers and NHRA nixed that. From the 2021 book a 427 HiRise with stock heads and manual trans has a SS hp rating of 466 and a weight of 3206. That works out to a 6.87 lbs/hp. By a 1969 book, that would be just shy of the min 7.00 for SS/D and could be made up with weight. The bracket was 7.00-7.49. 1964's were the oldest cars allowed in SS in 1969.
My references are the current book and this site for the 1969 book:
http://www.superstockamx.com/page82.php

[DeuceCoupe]

Originally Posted by FireSale

64 Fairlane Light Weight was/is allowed fiberglass fenders and hood. Bumpers may be aluminum. They tried fiberglass bumpers and NHRA nixed that. From the 2021 book a 427 HiRise with stock heads and manual trans has a SS hp rating of 466 and a weight of 3206. That works out to a 6.87 lbs/hp. By a 1969 book, that would be just shy of the min 7.00 for SS/D and could be made up with weight. The bracket was 7.00-7.49. 1964's were the oldest cars allowed in SS in 1969.
My references are the current book and this site for the 1969 book:
http://www.superstockamx.com/page82.php

Dale,
Thanks for that.
I only have rule books thru 1968, when you couldn't in general "adjust" the car weight like you can today.
Are you saying the weight could be "adjusted" in 1969?
I tried that link but my Norton says its a known dangerous link so I didn't want to go there. Not that Norton is always right.

If you have time to look at my last post on pg1 see what you think of it - everything seems to make sense if the glass fenders were allowed which it seems they were. I think what i read was that for 1965-up CARS, they had to be all steel (except the hood) so that's why Mopar did the A990 in all steel.

I just wondered why the T-bolts all disappeared in 1965-66-67-68 but I think I got it on my page 1 post here.

I'd sure like to get that 1969 Rule book. I will send you a PM
EDIT: Well PM doesnt seem to work, maybe it's my setup or Norton or something. In any case I got the 69 rule book from that HAMB link so thanks.

[Colesy]

1968, 1969 and 1970.

[Carguy49]

Since this thread is about Thunderbolts, I have a 2 part question about them.

I am not trying to derail this thread just need some questions answered.

1. When introduced in 1964 was the Thunderbolt S/S only?
2. If S/S only then, how are they in Stock Eliminator currently? Or am I way off on this???

Not trying to through anyone under the bus, just curious. Yea, I know curiosity killed the cat.

Just so you know, I love Ford Thunderbolts and have a book all about them by Charles R. Morris. I also love 68 Hemi Darts and Barracudas, too.

[FireSale]

Found a link to 58-69 rule books on HAMB (Hokey *** Message Board) conmanly known as JalopyJournal.com.


https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...resent.870742/


I have the pdf for 1969 and will send it by PM to anyone who can't make the link or download work.
EDIT: Wikipedia T-Bolt page
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Fairlane_Thunderbolt


Ron- A National Dragster Featured Flyer will answer those questions.
https://www.nhra.com/news/2016/featu...ck-thunderbolt



Hemming.com on the Thunderbolt
https://www.hemmings.com/stories/art...bolt-1964-ford

[Steve Stasko]

Originally Posted by Carguy49

Since this thread is about Thunderbolts, I have a 2 part question about them.

I am not trying to derail this thread just need some questions answered.

1. When introduced in 1964 was the Thunderbolt S/S only?
2. If S/S only then, how are they in Stock Eliminator currently? Or am I way off on this???

1. Yes

2. A number of years back, NHRA started allowing limited production cars in Stock. '67 R0/W0 Mopars, '64/'65 Hemi cars, etc. The '68 L0/B0 A-bodies and the '67 L-88 Corvettes are still not allowed though.

[bigshow2966]

Originally Posted by FireSale

64 Fairlane Light Weight was/is allowed fiberglass fenders and hood. Bumpers may be aluminum.

In the video on Ray Pacquet's (sp) car it shows his still has the fiberglass bumper under the aluminum one.