Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??

[Justin Graham]

I understand there are racers unhappy with the AHFS. However, no one really proposes a solution other than just "get rid of it."

Doug, I disagree. Below are a few of the possible solutions that have been discussed between NHRA and the SRA:

>Bring back the mineshaft rule
>Increase the review trigger to -1.2 under
>Raise the AHFS HP trigger to -1.0 under average
>Waive the AHFS during all class runoffs
>Lower indexes
>Provide incentives for top qualiiers such as lane choice

I would support any of these solutions. Unfortunately, NHRA hasn't made adjustments and seems to think the AHFS is working well in its current form.

Darin Grossi

A few points in Darin’s post hinted at something I was sleeping on last night and thought I’d pose the question to catch opinions of other racers.

Would it make sense, or could it be possibly done, to run Stk/SS in a similar format that Competition Eliminator is running? Basically placing the brunt of the excessive number under on the driver, not the Combo. So it doesn’t penalize the masses, just the offender.

I’m not saying it’s a solution, I’m not a multi decade veteran, but I thought it’s a start to some sort of discussion on an issue that seems to be happening yearly. Kinda sucks when an entire combo is affected by a singular agenda.

[JGrossijr]

Originally Posted by Justin Graham

Basically placing the brunt of the excessive number under on the driver, not the Combo. So it doesn?t penalize the masses, just the offender.

Justin,
With all due respect, we're racing in a performance category. How does outperforming your competition with the same combination get considered excessive or make one an offender? That's what class racing is all about, and its what a lot of us multi decade veterans live for.
In my book that racer deserves 2 things - A teardown, and recognition of accomplisment if legal.
Performance should be incentivised, not punished.

[GUMP]

That concept would be a hard NO for me.

[Justin Graham]

Originally Posted by JGrossijr

Justin,
With all due respect, we're racing in a performance category. How does outperforming your competition with the same combination get considered excessive or make one an offender? That's what class racing is all about, and its what a lot of us multi decade veterans live for.
In my book that racer deserves 2 things - A teardown, and recognition of accomplisment if legal.
Performance should be incentivised, not punished.

I find it interesting that a class like Comp, which is very performance oriented, had this concept put on it and was just curious if it would work for Stk/SS. I'm all for getting maximum effort out of our Combos. Every point Darin made, would clearly be more ideal.Totally agree with you Jim, teardown and recognition are greater. I'm trashing my spitball kit now

[Mike Pearson]

There is a huge difference between super stock/ stock and comp eliminator. Comp is a flat out first to the finish line category. They do have index's but have no break out in effect. The fields in comp are very small in comparison to stock and super stock. The cost to race a competitive comp car is much higher and much more difficult. Comp is in a much worse situation than stock and super stock as far as the health of the overall class.
I think there was less than 10 comp cars at the division race in Orlando a couple of weeks ago. Last week at the baby gators there was less than 15. Last I checked there is 17 comp cars entered in the Gatornationals. Most of us dont want stock and Super Stock to end up like Comp Eliminator.

[Billy Hampton]

So, a return to "first one to the finish line wins" is not wanted? When my dad ran, it was off the records and no break-out, Class Racing, not "bracket racing".

You could do this today by implementing a strict HP factoring system to automatically factor all runs for a season, (and get EVERY combination corrected to about -1.1). NHRA could reset to "even this out" for all combos so, no more break outs, no more ridiculously under-factored combos, etc.

THEN you could run- no breakout to the finish line.
You could always have a bracket race combo event if you don't want to compete in a performance based event. I bet all the races would be within a few hundredths after this was allowed to "run-in" for a couple of seasons.

Accurate HP factors would return Stock and SS to its true roots.

[Bill Grubbs]

Originally Posted by Billy Hampton

So, a return to "first one to the finish line wins" is not wanted? When my dad ran, it was off the records and no break-out, Class Racing, not "bracket racing"..

AND... Stock and SuperStock almost died! How many budget cars are in Comp? Hint...none. If you want to run Comp then I'm all for it...go run Comp!

[Justin Graham]

I DO NOT believe that a “First to the finish” is the way to go! I should have been clearer in my intent of this thread.

If I understand Comp rules correctly, they are given leeway to go way under, blasting the index to qualify. It’s when they go under their index by a set dot number (.6xx?), during Eliminations they get penalized with a personal ET adjustment.
So by that account, I thought what if that were applied to a Stk/SS racer going an absurd one under (-.1.xx) number, face a penalty then and there at that race, and only that race, and not get the entire combo readjusted at the end of the year. Essentially acting like AFHS but not enforcing an average. What -1.00 number do you think is outrageous? We all know that some divisions have environmental variables that are more favorable than others. It’s just an idea….

[J.R. Haddad]

So, as I see the problem, we have a performance based class, where improving your performance can lead to penalties. Usually, the faster cars
are accused of having one of two things, a) Rich Owner b) Mechanically
intelligent owner. These seem to be the cars that get the most penalties.
Conversely, with the advent of the Index System, some people quickly
figured out the could build cars for obscure or low populated classes,
for a relatively reasonable amount of money, and be as competitive as
anyone. That sounds like a relatively reasonable approach to bring the
two groups together. The budget mined Racer can race with the best of them and have an equal chance to win. So a win for the budget or Mechanically challenged Racer. This helps maintain strong participation
in the class, as most can "Play". But, no reward for the Well To Do Owner,
or the Mechanically Gifted. Here is their reward. Leave everything the very
same as it is, with one exception. Qualifying no longer has AHFS. Period.
And Qualifying will Award Qualifier 1 thru 5 qualifying points. 1 gets 5, 2 gets four, all the way until # 5, who gets one. Don't worry, it won't really affect points races as much as it may appear. The better drivers have a better chance to get points in later rounds than the usual top qualifiers. I believe it makes things more interesting. If you have already posted an idea or response to an idea, please share your thoughts. If you haven't posted an idea or responded to one, don't criticize my idea until you post yours for me to critique. J.R.

[JGrossijr]

Agree with incentivising and rewarding exceptional qualifying performance.
I'd be happy to see all, or none, of the qualifying passes count toward AHFS. Currently only the fastest qualifying run is used for averaging.