if wally was'nt dead this woulda killed him

[Tony Janes]

Jim Foley is Fred Johnson brother

[Jim Wahl]

And how many times has Mr. Foley qualified *HIS* car at Indy?Jim

[Charley Downing]

Jack and others you all are living in the 1970's Stock needed a little change like this. Just because a rule was made 40 years ago does not make it right. It's simple if you can't run around 1 under don't bring your turd .5 under class winning **** box to indy unless you just want to win class. Or maybe you people could spend a little more time in the shop and less time worrying about how you can steal a spot into the U.S. Nationals. bye the way Jack a class win at indy is never point less. I would agree with barrys post about having to run someone then you would be bumped into the show that would be fair. JUST NO CLASS SINGLE BUMP INS

fastest 128 at indy its about time
U.S. Nationals class winner ,qualifier and cheater

[Jim Wahl]

So let me get this straight, I race and get enough grade points to get in to Indy. I spend the money for entry, fuel to get there and back, hotel room, and food. I get there get parked, go through tech, go up to run class but nobody else in my class chose to get off their collective butts to make the race so I get a bye. I run .85 under but sorry you say I can't make the show because no one else showed up in my class? I should be penalized, no THROWN OUT of Indy because I was lucky enough to get a single? No it's ok if I ran .52 under and one other "turd" ran .51 under and I beat him. Then I would make it, because it's a performance based class, right? I mean everybody knows that two "turds" running .50 under is better than one car running .85 under. I hope this never happens to you Mr Downing so you don't have to find out the pain it causes. Shame on you and NHRA. Jim

And BTW, NO class winner "steals a spot, all class winners earn the spot. That's the way it was set up by Wally himself. He did that for a reason. Some traditions should be left alone.

[FlyingW]

As some one who has only been to Indy one time and got schooled real fast on the best of the best. I have not been back due to I am not at the speed needed to make the show I will be soon. Indy has always been the show of the big dog's I grew up hearing stories on dad winning class to make the show and that is one of the goals I have in my racing. so from one of the guys that would benefit from this rule I dont like the rule cause it takes away from the history of indy. I want to go to indy and make the field knowing I am one of the best of the best. and if class winners are not givien a spot in the field than that will not be tru any more no matter what class it is even if its only one car in that class. thats my opion right or wrong I still am in amazment of dads fender covers from class win at indy and the sticker still on the bumber from his 71 olds .


Jeremy Waibel
Driver of the K&N Camaro
NHRA B/SA 2231

[Jason Oldfield]

As I said in the other thread, even if I was a fast car I'd still want the class eliminator winners to get a guaranteed spot in the show just in case I was chasing a problem that particular weekend. It would give me one last shot to get in.

Class eliminations are now pointless. I'd love to hear somebody make a logical argument as to the reasoning behind continuing to have class eliminations because I can't think of one. Class eliminations are now nothing more than side show, just like the extra races that many of us compete in at the division races (S/SS shootouts and the like).

All this is going to do is make it easy for NHRA to make the decision to no longer contest class eliminations and save themselves a bunch of money at races where class eliminations are run (which is not a paltry amount of money at $500 times 100 or so classes, not to mention the cost of the trophies and time saved).

If single car class winners was the problem, then why not eliminate the single car classes, and combine them into another class?

As I said before, I don't have a dog in this fight, but it seems to me that you guys are soon going to be better off running Comp...

[Bill Grubbs]

Originally Posted by Jason Oldfield

Class eliminations are now pointless. I'd love to hear somebody make a logical argument as to the reasoning behind continuing to have class eliminations because I can't think of one. Class eliminations are now nothing more than side show, just like the extra races that many of us compete in at the division races (S/SS shootouts and the like)....

If you truly believe this...Then you must also ascribe to the supposition, since we are not pros (for national events) or TAD/AFC (for divisionals), our attendance at an event is nothing more than a side show.

Keep repeating something over and over, and you, as well as other people will begin to believe your mantra. While I believe we (class racers) do not carry the biggest stick, we never the less have a stick, and a stick of any size (large or small) is dangerous, you just need to know how to use it.

Winning Class will always be a Class Win, but winning the eliminator will always be worth more money. If you can win both with out a bump in (NHRA's words) then "Your the Man/Woman."

As far as the SAC, call them. They are not mind readers. Yes they were elected to represent their constituancy, but they cannot call every single racer and poll them, it is incumbant upon you to let your representative know your thoughts. If you do not feel they are representing your interest, then your wrong because they represent the interest of the Class as a whole. If you feel otherwise you should run for the position next time, but remember it is not about "You" it is about the Class. If the Class is not represented then that is a different story.

Bill

PS. Eventhough I agree with this change; STOP changing the rules!! unless safety is involved, or a better part is available, or a new letter from a dusty file cabinet appears at NHRA, or if someone whines.

[Jason Oldfield]

Originally Posted by Bill Grubbs

If you truly believe this...Then you must also ascribe to the supposition, since we are not pros (for national events) or TAD/AFC (for divisionals), our attendance at an event is nothing more than a side show.

I absolutely, positively do not feel this way, nor did I state anything close to this. But, nobody is making the trek to a national event to win class only for the $500 and the mini-Wally. Sure, it's a nice little way to subsidize your trip to the track, but who in their right mind is going to pay $250 to enter to win $500 (before all other expenses are considered) with NO chance of being in final eliminations?

I'll tell you who, nobody, which is why I stated that class eliminations are now nothing better than a little side race to fill in some time.

There are a lot of good race cars that go to Indy that go home, some of which would have been able to get their way in because they could win class, maybe even using this thing called DRIVER SKILL. Now, it's the ones with the most money / most favorable combo at that time that get to race in final eliminations. Jr. Comp should be the new name of this category.

Originally Posted by Bill Grubbs

PS. Eventhough I agree with this change; STOP changing the rules!! unless safety is involved, or a better part is available, or a new letter from a dusty file cabinet appears at NHRA, or if someone whines.

I'm going to assume you're kidding about the last two, as that's what appears to happen more times than not to get these changes to take place.

As I said before, this rule change doesn't affect me in the least other than from a sportsman racing standpoint. I think it was the wrong decision to make, and just made these classes more elitist than they already are. Plus, from a fan standpoint watching class eliminations used to be fun watching the drivers try to secure themselves a spot in final eliminations. Now, they're running for $500 and a mini-Wally. Yawn.

[Bill Grubbs]

Jason,
I actually know a lot of people who go to National Events because they have (run) class, and most of those racers also have class.

Bill

[Jeff Lee]

I beg to differ but there are many Class racers that attend a National event and are there with the intent of winning class. For some, winning the eliminator is secondary. I once knew a guy that one class @ Indy back in the early '70's with a '68 Barracuda 340. He won class at Indy. He had a lleather jacket that was custom stitched with this victory "I won Class at Indy" and something about the car. I met him at Neil Smedly's home in the mid '80's and it appeared this may have been the greatest automotive event of his life. The old guy still probably goes to car shows with that jacket. Corny? You bet! But I completely understand.
The same logic finds there are some racers that only race Divisional events so they can set national records. After tear down, they go home.
Myself, I was #1 qualifier, won class and made it to the finals and lost. I'm very proud even with the loss because of the difficulty in achieving a triple like that. My friend Neil Smedly did that on his one national event win and I'll forever look up to him for doing so.
No, this whole Indy deal is a farce and as Bill Grubbs suggested, I will be in contact with our D7 rep over this. There are a lot of things in life which can be viewed as a waste of time but we do it as it is tradition and does serve a purpose. Should we save a few bullets and not have a 21 gun salute to those that have served our country when they are burried? No, we do it out of respect and honor.
Some race in S/SS and could care less about the tradition and honor in having the fastest in their class on that particular day. Fine, nobody is making you put more time or money in your vehicle. But without class run-offs, or heads-up runs, this is nothing more than a bracket race. Nothing personal to Jason or anybody else but maybe a S/ST or S/G racer using a throttle stop, delay box and whatever else may not ever fully understand the pride, devotion and sense of accomplishment that comes from showing you were the top dog that day. And just to make it clear this is not motivated by an angle, I have the slowest car in my respective class. I enjoy the challenge and fully intend to ellevate that level. But right now I'm no shoe-in for a class win.
And somehow I can't help but feel this new policy was lead by the bracket racer contingent whom would like to compete in a national event forum but lack the dedication or resources to lead the performance arena.