How do you get (N) racers over to the (I) side

[Jason Oldfield]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

They used to do over 900 cars at the World Nationals at Norwalk.

Though that is true Michael, Norwalk was also the cream of the crop of IHRA tracks at the time. I'm not sure any other IHRA track at the time could have handled THAT many cars.

That said, no track today would need to. A typical NHRA race today only has on average 500 cars. Would more show up without a quota? Maybe, but in most cases last year the various eliminators were not full. So, even with a grade of 1 you were able to get in to just about any national event of your choice. Plus, at this point having tracks that can comfortably accommodate 750+ cars is the last thing that IHRA needs to worry about right now. We can worry about that once we start getting that many cars regularly at IHRA national events.

I've raced both NHRA and IHRA. But, one advantage IHRA has over NHRA for me is that they race H/R (S/St) at EVERY event, unlikely only 7 events per year for NHRA. In addition, the two closest local tracks (Empire Dragway and Dunn Tire Raceway Park) are both IHRA sanctioned. Plus, it is not MANDATORY for me to attend the division races in IHRA to attend their national events (that's a big cost savings for me, considering the closest NHRA division event is 4 hours from my house.

All that said, part of the enjoyment factor for me is how much work I have to do at the track, and IHRA's tracks are generally not up to the same standards as the NHRA tracks (particularly the pit areas). Not that all NHRA tracks are the Taj Mahal (Maple Grove's pits can be horrendous when it rains), but the last thing I want to do is to be cleaning mud off of my car or out of my trailer or motorhome.

More cars would be nice, but in most cases it is going to be at least a 5 round race for me so I don't really care if there are 32 cars or 63 cars. Sure, more money would be nice, but I can't proclaim that I do all that much winning to REALLY care about the contingency money. I'm more concerned with round money, and in years past IHRA was always better about that than NHRA (I don't know if that is still the case or not).

Most likely I'm going to stay close to home this year, race the TNT Super Series, but if I do decide to travel, the IHRA races are going to be the ones I choose to go to...

[Ed Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Jason Oldfield

Though that is true Michael, Norwalk was also the cream of the crop of IHRA tracks at the time. I'm not sure any other IHRA track at the time could have handled THAT many cars.

That said, no track today would need to. A typical NHRA race today only has on average 500 cars. Would more show up without a quota? Maybe, but in most cases last year the various eliminators were not full. So, even with a grade of 1 you were able to get in to just about any national event of your choice. Plus, at this point having tracks that can comfortably accommodate 750+ cars is the last thing that IHRA needs to worry about right now. We can worry about that once we start getting that many cars regularly at IHRA national events.

I've raced both NHRA and IHRA. But, one advantage IHRA has over NHRA for me is that they race H/R (S/St) at EVERY event, unlikely only 7 events per year for NHRA. In addition, the two closest local tracks (Empire Dragway and Dunn Tire Raceway Park) are both IHRA sanctioned. Plus, it is not MANDATORY for me to attend the division races in IHRA to attend their national events (that's a big cost savings for me, considering the closest NHRA division event is 4 hours from my house.

All that said, part of the enjoyment factor for me is how much work I have to do at the track, and IHRA's tracks are generally not up to the same standards as the NHRA tracks (particularly the pit areas). Not that all NHRA tracks are the Taj Mahal (Maple Grove's pits can be horrendous when it rains), but the last thing I want to do is to be cleaning mud off of my car or out of my trailer or motorhome.

More cars would be nice, but in most cases it is going to be at least a 5 round race for me so I don't really care if there are 32 cars or 63 cars. Sure, more money would be nice, but I can't proclaim that I do all that much winning to REALLY care about the contingency money. I'm more concerned with round money, and in years past IHRA was always better about that than NHRA (I don't know if that is still the case or not).

Most likely I'm going to stay close to home this year, race the TNT Super Series, but if I do decide to travel, the IHRA races are going to be the ones I choose to go to...

Jason I'm lucky we have both San Antonio and Crandall to race at down here. They are both excellant IHRA tracks.

[Ed Wright]

Yep. Those are decent tracks.

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by Jason Oldfield

Though that is true Michael, Norwalk was also the cream of the crop of IHRA tracks at the time. I'm not sure any other IHRA track at the time could have handled THAT many cars.

The question was asked, I answered. -=shrug=- Rockingham had 506 Sportsman cars that year as well, no problem. And they had more Qualifying runs back then, too.

IHRA's tracks are generally not up to the same standards as the NHRA tracks (particularly the pit areas). Not that all NHRA tracks are the Taj Mahal (Maple Grove's pits can be horrendous when it rains), but the last thing I want to do is to be cleaning mud off of my car or out of my trailer or motorhome.

Uh, what tracks and what standards are we talking about?

I remember a guy telling me what a hole Tulsa was and that he'd never go back (They'd had 19" of rain leading up to the event)... all the while standing beside his toterhome and stacker that was pitted on grass at an NHRA facility. I'm sure 19" of rain would effect ground differently if it was under a different sanction. For the record, I think Tulsa was an outstanding facility. Not every track is Englishtown or Norwalk. (Maybe you missed the photos of Sheehan pulling the engine in his dirt pits at a certain 4-Star Luxury track) There aren't too many tracks that can withstand that kind of rain without issues.

I've been to over 60 tracks. Some are fancier than others, but the era of considering IHRA tracks as a whole second rate is LONG gone. In fact, I've been to some NHRA tracks that racers fawn over, and seen bald spots, built-up rubber and other traction issues (something I VERY rarely see or here about at IHRA events). One in particular was disorganized, had a PA system that you couldn't hear, and a garbled radio broadcast on top of that. When to a hole-in-the-wall track the very next day that featured super friendly, informative staff, clear PA and radio broadcast, and killer traction. That being said, I don't think any one track is a reflection upon an entire sanctioning body, on one side or the other. You have to take them case by case.

$.02,

[Ed Wright]

There ya go. Well said Michael.

Btw, I can't tell track prep or traction is any better at one compared to the other.

[Jason Oldfield]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

Uh, what tracks and what standards are we talking about?

-- Snip --

There aren't too many tracks that can withstand that kind of rain without issues.

I've been to over 60 tracks. Some are fancier than others, but the era of considering IHRA tracks as a whole second rate is LONG gone. In fact, I've been to some NHRA tracks that racers fawn over, and seen bald spots, built-up rubber and other traction issues (something I VERY rarely see or here about at IHRA events). One in particular was disorganized, had a PA system that you couldn't hear, and a garbled radio broadcast on top of that. When to a hole-in-the-wall track the very next day that featured super friendly, informative staff, clear PA and radio broadcast, and killer traction. That being said, I don't think any one track is a reflection upon an entire sanctioning body, on one side or the other. You have to take them case by case.

$.02,

I completely agree Michael. A torrential downpour will make any track crappy. And I'm not talking about the racing surface, as I agree with whoever else said it that with both tracks prepped in decent weather, I can't tell the difference between one track and another (maybe the guys with 1000 hp can, but not me).

And you've raced at MANY more tracks than I have, so you obviously have a better cross section than I do, but since we're on the topic, here's what I'm comparing (I'll list the tracks as to their sanctioning body affiliation at the time I went there, as a few have changed recently):

NHRA
Maple Grove
Columbus
Englishtown
Atco
Indy
Route 66
Cecil County
Lebanon Valley
Pomona
Phoenix
Houston
Sonoma
Charlotte
Gainesville
Atlanta
Numidia
Delmar

IHRA
Grand Bend
Norwalk
Epping
Milan
Budds Creek
Toronto Motorsports Park
Empire Dragway (was NYIRP)
Dunn Tire Raceway Park (was Lancaster)

I'm sure I'm forgetting a few as I know I was at Thompson and/or Dragway 42 once or twice, but I can't remember which or anything really about them (I know one of them you do a burnout uphill), and I know I was at an IHRA track near Cincinnati, but I can't remember what that track is either. But, at least you can see what I'm comparing.

Obviously, not all of the NHRA tracks are great, and maybe my cross section of IHRA tracks isn't large enough to make any blanket statements. But, I don't think there's any real arguing that the "average" NHRA track that I've been to is much nicer than the "average" IHRA track that I've been to (I'm not going to rate each one as I'm not looking to insult anyone, but it is generally well known which of these tracks are "nice" and which aren't.)

So, what's that worth? Well, this and $2 will buy you a cup of coffee (I think, unless coffee has gone up, in which case you'll have to shell out more money because my comparison probably won't be accepted as an alternative for cash.)