New rules for 2010?

[Sean Cour]

Mr. Beard-

Just keep making the rules easier for the less fortunate, and more difficult for the performance minded!

[Dick Butler]

Sean, I think you miss the fact that many of the "Performance Minded" have also found "favored" HP motors that will never be brought back into line with the previously hammered Motors. NHRA will never remove HP from some performance motors while restarting NEW motors found at minimum to encourage a new contruction, a possible new racer and entry money. That is the reason for 90+ classes. Get everyone to Buy something to PAY ENTRY money. Many of the less fortunate are actually overfactored cars too. That why no break out would be a bad long term idea. It would be a great Quick FIX for underfactored stuff.
It would be better to hit the FAST stuff down towards the slower cars than give favoritism to less competitive cars because some might just not be worked on as hard or long....Hit the Hot stuff for a time and suddenly Class becomes a race of 4 different motors, not just the BOGUS one who everyone has to build next to stay in contention.

[Angelo DiTocco]

Originally Posted by Dick Butler

NHRA will never remove HP

It would be better to hit the FAST stuff down towards the slower cars than give favoritism to less competitive cars because some might just not be worked on as hard or long....Hit the Hot stuff for a time and suddenly Class becomes a race of 4 different motors, not just the BOGUS one who everyone has to build next to stay in contention.

Dick
(I edited your quote just to save room)
Your 1st statement is not really true. You may or may not remember it but a few years back (and maybe someone can remember exactly what year it was 2000? 20001?) the NHRA gave HP back to a ton of motors, & not just chevy's. One of them was the 350/255 that I had run for a long time. As a matter of fact, when I first ran the 255 in '95, it was rated at 300hp. It was reduced to 295 when I ran it and was subsequently reduced to 290 during the round of hp reductions I am referring to. By that time I had moved on to the injected stuff...... there were a bunch of other combos that got hp back. I remember the 350/315 was reduced to 310. The 624 head motor was originally 285, then hit to 290, was put back to 285. There were several 327 combos that were lowered, some from 300 to 280 !.The NHRA did try to level the playing field because they had no AHFS (or it was just in the embryonic stages of development). Do you remember what combos where dominating then? The Chevy 400 rated at 275hp ! Which is now 325 I think. My point is those "classic or traditional refactored combos" were beat up by people who ran them and all have since been factored upward. They have no one to blame but themselves. The rules that exist have loopholes. They could have exploited them. If someone or a group choose to do what they can to protect the combo they run, well that's the way the game is played. I don't want to name specific combos because I don't play that way.... but there are a bunch of combos (that aren't necessarily chevy's) that milk the system without much fanfare. Either way money is always going to be a factor in this. No one should be spending the mortgage money or the kids college fund to field a competitive race car.

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by Sean Cour

Just keep making the rules easier for the less fortunate, and more difficult for the performance minded!

How do more heads-up runs make things easier on the less fortunate? It seems like that is exactly what performance-minded racers would *want*. I also repeatedly noted how this would incentivize slower guys to work on their stuff.

[Casey Miles]

When people talking about working on their stuff, does that mean you go to your engine builder and work on the dyno or buy the latest trick peice? I called for a cam shaft from Bullet cams and the first words out of the salesman was "who's your engine builder?". I said you are talking to him! I'd like to know what is meant by work on your stuff? Yes, I stopped working as hard as I can, but I build my own engines and work in my garage with limited time and funding. I think that old guys use the "Purple Pill", why not let us slow guys who work on our own stuff in ower own garage use the "Blue Bottle" to catch up with the guys who work on their professionally bought stuff? I'm angry because I keep hearing about lowering the indexes, my car is carrying weight from a car from 1968 Stock Eliminator. Which never got lifted off and just keeps on getting more weight because professional engine builders find more horsepower on a dyno so that the purchaser of the engine can go faster.
Work on your stuff, what a joke!

Casey Miles
248H

[Michael Beard]

Sorry, I usually put "work on their stuff" in quotes like that --- I agree with you!

[Casey Miles]

Micheal: My post wasn't aimed at you.
Casey Miles
248H

[Sean Cour]

Originally Posted by Casey Miles

When people talking about working on their stuff, does that mean you go to your engine builder and work on the dyno or buy the latest trick peice? I called for a cam shaft from Bullet cams and the first words out of the salesman was "who's your engine builder?". I said you are talking to him! I'd like to know what is meant by work on your stuff? Yes, I stopped working as hard as I can, but I build my own engines and work in my garage with limited time and funding. I think that old guys use the "Purple Pill", why not let us slow guys who work on our own stuff in ower own garage use the "Blue Bottle" to catch up with the guys who work on their professionally bought stuff? I'm angry because I keep hearing about lowering the indexes, my car is carrying weight from a car from 1968 Stock Eliminator. Which never got lifted off and just keeps on getting more weight because professional engine builders find more horsepower on a dyno so that the purchaser of the engine can go faster.
Work on your stuff, what a joke!

Casey Miles
248H

Mr. Miles-

Your post is exactly what I've been posting about. Because some racers are more fortunate, guys like you, which by the way, I admire, want things given too them. You want the "blue bottle" to be fast! How about taking pride in the fact you're doing it on your own. The potential is their, you said it in your post.

Cars aren't just fast because of an engine. They're fast because of the whole package. "Work on your stuff," at least from me, means torque convertor on back. Balancer, forward. You can pick a car up quite a bit with refining the good parts you already have. It's not always about making horsepower. Most of the time, it's about refining it, and applying it.

Sean

[Casey Miles]

Sean: I've worked on my car now for about 38 years, I've set the record with it when stock was stock. Now stock is if the after market vendor has the part in "Stock" means you can use that part in Stock Eliminator. My pockets aren't that deep and I sure I'm not the only one. Don't anyone understand that you can't recoup what you have spent on the latest parts no mater how fast you go. I went to Indy one year and I was missing a bumper bolt and they wouldn't let me go until I put one in it's place, now as long as the car has a bumper it's OK.

Casey Miles
248H

[stefan callender]

Originally Posted by Casey Miles

Sean: I've worked on my car now for about 38 years, I've set the record with it when stock was stock. Now stock is if the after market vendor has the part in "Stock" means you can use that part in Stock Eliminator. My pockets aren't that deep and I sure I'm not the only one. Don't anyone understand that you can't recoup what you have spent on the latest parts no mater how fast you go. I went to Indy one year and I was missing a bumper bolt and they wouldn't let me go until I put one in it's place, now as long as the car has a bumper it's OK.

Casey Miles
248H

What are you complaining about the fact that Stock has evolved, of the fact that you cant keep up with the Jones??? On an average, how many heads up runs does someone have per racing season not including class run off?? You dont have to run everyone heads up every round, its a bracket race for the most part, just run the race. Believe me, I would love to run Superstock, but I cant afford to run the way I would like to, so I go to the track with my friends that do run Superstock and Stock. Life isnt fair, If it was everyone would be running fast...