FS cars exempt from HP?

[SSGN]

This debate will go on until the bitter end. The part that is the saddest is NHRA and others think these new cars are bringing new interest and spectators to this sport. However I watched the final in car and looked into the stands and, you guessed it nobody there. No disrespect to the Bartons, great job. Just an observation.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziLLT7lJkps"]Drag Pack David Barton 2014 NHRA Nationals Reading, PA - YouTube[/ame]

Kevin

[Kevin McKenna]

Originally Posted by SSGN

This debate will go on until the bitter end. The part that is the saddest is NHRA and others think these new cars are bringing new interest and spectators to this sport. However I watched the final in car and looked into the stands and, you guessed it nobody there. No disrespect to the Bartons, great job. Just an observation.



Kevin

I also have an observation. When I go to the U.S. Nationals on a Thursday and see a full (five man) PR team from Chevrolet Performance, and media/PR members from Dodge and Ford, I know something must be working. I'm not suggesting the program is anything close to perfect but the media room at Indy used to be a ghost town on Thursday. Now, it's quite active and virtually all of that is due to the Factory Stock Showdown.

[Bruce Noland]

Originally Posted by Kevin McKenna

I also have an observation. When I go to the U.S. Nationals on a Thursday and see a full (five man) PR team from Chevrolet Performance, and media/PR members from Dodge and Ford, I know something must be working. I'm not suggesting the program is anything close to perfect but the media room at Indy used to be a ghost town on Thursday. Now, it's quite active and virtually all of that is due to the Factory Stock Showdown.

For nearly six years the media room has produced nothing of value for Stock. Nothing! The media folks (paparazzi) should venture out into the pits for the real story.

[Billy Nees]

Kevin, tell the "media folks" they need to read thread http://www.classracer.com/classforum...ad.php?t=49151, get out of the air conditioning, away from the buffet tables and leave the young girls in the media suite alone(they're too young for them anyway). Go out into the depths of the Sportsman Pits and check out reality!
(did I tell him Bruce?)

[Ken Miele]

SSGN, I have differ with you, there is major interest in the new cars and the fan base is growing fast. I’m not sure how many NHRA national races you have been to, but I can tell that new cars are a major attraction in the pits. Anthony Bongiovanni had 5 new cars in competition last weekend. They were all on display on the main pit road. The steady stream of fans coming up to these cars were awesome. When they opened the hoods the fans were all over the cars. In contrast my car was also on the main pit road and received quite the attention, but not as much as the new cars. When I was over near Anthony’s pit the fans had so many questions about the cars, cars they said they can relate to. On the other hand, although they had some interest in my car, most knew very little about it, only asking if it was a real Shelby.

If The FS class was on Friday instead of Thursday, the stands would have been quite different.

I understand why some racers are upset with NHRA and how they are handling the FS class, but there are some good reasons for the no hp. One reason I can tell you is that if they were to give this new class hp, it would take to long to see what the car potential is. These cars are running all out all the time, NHRA now knows what these cars can run. Another reason is to bring more racer interest to the class. You will see many more teams running FS next year. This weekend alone I found out there will be at least 10 more cars competing in FS next year.

Guys, I know things are not perfect, but there are changes coming next year for the better.

Oh yes, to Billy, all I can say is reality is relative.

[gbur]

so in your mind ,all the older combinations should suffer in the meantime ,lol

[Ken Miele]

No they should not, and I fail to find the humor in it with your lol. In 1969 you might have said the same thing. How do you think the guy with a early 60's car running against a 69 COPO felt. A car that was very expensive and only the few could afford was beating on you and not much you could do about it.

Stock is evolving, many are racing 40 plus year old cars. Can you imagine racing a Ford Model A in the 60's. I'm not saying things are perfect, but with change comes pain. Hell I have an old car to and knows what it feels like to get beat up on.

[Randall Klein]

1969 making about $1.60/hour I bought my first new car, "69 Nova 396/375 for $3250; the dealership had 6 427 COPO's at ____price (can't remember), but they had 1 ZL-1 that was about $7200....the ZL-1 was a $4000 option

Surely the 427 steel COPO's were around $4000

No roll bars then, Lakewood slapper bars, Hurst shifter, Scheiffer clutch, Hooker headers, Firestone 7" slicks and raced like crazy while going thru college at Cornhusker, Kearnry and Flightland

Kind of different from $90K entry fee plus another $what

Hey, I like 'em too, but a damn shame racer's heart and soul cut out in those classes with the older cars that are rendered non-competitive and de-valued and parked

[Mickey Whaley]

Originally Posted by Randall Klein

1969 making about $1.60/hour I bought my first new car, "69 Nova 396/375 for $3250; the dealership had 6 427 COPO's at ____price (can't remember), but they had 1 ZL-1 that was about $7200....the ZL-1 was a $4000 option

Surely the 427 steel COPO's were around $4000

No roll bars then, Lakewood slapper bars, Hurst shifter, Scheiffer clutch, Hooker headers, Firestone 7" slicks and raced like crazy while going thru college at Cornhusker, Kearnry and Flightland

Kind of different from $90K entry fee plus another $what

Hey, I like 'em too, but a damn shame racer's heart and soul cut out in those classes with the older cars that are rendered non-competitive and de-valued and parked

Well said

[Michael Beard]

if there was an internet back in 69, there would have been just as many complaints.

Were those complaints justified? Just because people complain about something doesn't mean it's automagically wrong, OR unfounded. We saw it with the fuel injected cars, and it took their own separate classes and 10 years to factor them some semblance of properly. It would stand to reason that if mistakes were made in the past that we would try to not repeat them.

Throughout the myriad of threads regarding the new factory cars, the overwhelming complaint is not with the cars, the car owners, or even the factories. Ultimately, the primary issues revolve around HP factors.

NHRA has set the precedent with its baseline factored HP of the factory cars, so it is unlikely they will change. Also based on precedent, it is reasonable that they would create separate FX classes to allow them factor themselves without bludgeoning traditional Stockers heads-up in the meantime. While it doesn't address qualifying (bye runs), it's a start.

if they were to give this new class hp, it would take to long to see what the car potential is.

Presumably, potential remains in these combinations, particularly since they are so new. It would stand to reason then that their HP factors (S/SS) should be higher and/or the Factory Stock indexes lowered. Each would allow the cars to "stretch their legs" without fear of factoring. A quick glance at Indy and Reading qualifying indicates that the Factory Stock indexes are a MINIMUM of .30 soft. Moving their indexes several tenths would STILL have them dominating qualifying.

Yes, the new cars are cool. VERY cool. VERY impressive. Factory Stock is even cooler. I'd like to have a race for them. As I've stated before, no has asked that they be factored unrealistically high and rendered uncompetitive, but neither should they be factored unrealistically low. There exists a great deal of space inbetween that could be palatable to ALL parties. Enjoying and appreciating the factory cars is not mutually exclusive with realistic administration.

Standard disclaimer: I run a 'factory' engine in SS/GT. Despite better specs all the way around, it is rated 50 HP *less* than my Crate Motor was. My wife told me to build this engine!

$.02,